This is regarding Modernbill vers. PerlBill.

This per John from PerlBill:

"ModernBill seems to be for host only from what I have seen. PerlBill is
not going to go that way as we want to cater for a more general client
solution market which is why we have not added more domain tools or
hosting specific features"

So there you go, if you need a hosting billing package check out ModernBill and if you are selling toys or ? see PerlBill it don't have the features needed to run a complete hosting billing system. It is feature lacked. You can check out there demo and it looks good tell you purchase it and you can't send welcome letters but with 3 line on it and info is useless and there are new tags that you can use, other then 3. So the other part of his email states:

Our pricing ($149) is carefully considered and we put a fully functional demo
on our site. If people think it is too highly priced then they do not
have to purchase it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
But yes the demo looks good but you don't see the limitation of it.
Then I think he should state that is not for the hosting business.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For some one that has a Help Desk product and used by almost 100 % hosting companies why would you not build your billing system for them as well?

I already own a copy Modernbill before I went to PerlBill to purchase it. The one reason I went to PerlBill was I wanted to 2checkout and they can and Modernbill can't at this time.
I have owned ModrnBill when it costed $49 as when they first started and I am still with them.


Each his own....

Well there is my dollars worth.



:mad: :confused:

Hi

It's been a while since I last posted here but I'd just like to address the issues 'hoster' has raised in this post.

On the hosting front .. We are not saying host's should not use our product, we welcome anyone to use our software who feels it will benefit their company. I realise many host's will have interest in such a billing package and have taken many steps to ensure it will work well in a hosting environment - that being said, I have kept in mind other uses and not limited it to hosting and will not limit it to a hosting company in future.

ModernBill may well be good for a non-hosting environment also, but I have little experience with the software.

We have put up demo's of all 3 areas of the PerlBill software on our site, the only thing not working on the demo is outgoing email to prevent abuse. The demo is there so that potential client's can fully test it and ensure it will work for their uses - I make no steps to hide any limitations in the software, what you see is what you get and I would encourage people interested to fully test the package before purchasing.

On your qoute for our PerlDesk software, I would not estimate that near 100% utilization is by web hosts. Indeed a large percentage are hosts but there are many many non hosting installations - but this is not relevant to this post.

hoster, I am aware you are not 100% happy with our product and I have previously offered you a refund. I will gladly submit a refund for the purchase price if you would prefer to stop using PerlBill on your site. If you would like a refund please just let me know through email.

I hope this clears some of this up,

Best Regards

John Bennett

A reply about your comment about Modernbill, it is for webhosting companies only and not other types of business.

And as far as not being 100% happy with PerBill you are right.
If you remeber I spent 2 days trying to get it to working around with you with over 15 emails this past weekend. Then finaly I gave you access and then it worked. I asked you what you found you said changed some code around. So I spent 2 days pulling what little hair I have left out trying to get it to work.

So anyway John, I will let you know in a few hours here about the refund, hopr that workss for you.

Richard :mad:

I'd like to add a note in John's defence here. I went over a lot of the same points you have probably raised with John when he first released this. I was/am of the same opinion...it is not as focused on the hosting industry as ModernBill.

John made some changes that I've seen in the latest version, and was very helpful at the time we bought it. As you mention Richard, 15 emails helping you to get it installed. I don't recall having many problems getting it installed ourself, but don't you think it's admirable that you had that after-sales service available to you in a one-on-one capacity?

It's a good script (for basic hosting and other circumstances that call for a billing solution), and it's backed up with some good support from its developer. There are other dedicated hosting solutions around (and more coming up), so take Johns' offer of a refund. We buy a lot of software that we'll never use, from billing systems to faq/kb generators to nifty little desktop apps that never see the light of day past the next reformat, if not only to support the developers. Perlbill was a good buy, and we will more than likely find a use for it one day. :)

Cheers

Gary

yes, modernbill is definently for hosting only

its a GREAT product, i am very happy with it so far :D

Hello

The product is good for basic hosting services.
As far as he's support goes most of the time was great had no problems with that part.
As far the 15 emails goes that is a fact and nothing on my part, when the code is not correct I don't no that one way or the other.
The major thing with it and me are the emails and leters that get sent to your clients. There is but 3 tags that can be used to pull info, how do you send a welcome letter with only 3 tags? So if I keeo this product I need to manual send out the letters and have to edited each one with the proper info for that client. So since Saturday I have entered over 200 clients and before sending out emails with account info each letter has to be edited.

The thing is he has a pro versions which takes care of the problem at hand and I have asked him to up grade it to that version. To solve this problem he could of done that for the extra money and I would of been happy, but no offer came my way.

So I'll let him know later today about the refund.

Thanks for your info.

Richard

I meant to ask you what order system are you using now, I see you are using Revecom processing?

Just wondering.

Richard

Originally posted by hoster
how do you send a welcome letter with only 3 tags?

I'm not denying that a few (simple?) changes could make it a very attractive solutions for hosting, but it is still very usable. What else would you want to pull from the database that isn't covered (or could be covered) in the welcome.txt file? Pretty much most information aside from that could be presented on a webpage or in a FAQ, or provided to the client by another means. All they will need from Perlbill directly is their login details. Our Welcome email is quite long and covers a lot of aspects of the clients' account, but there are only 3 variables in it and one of those isn't even necessary.

All I'm saying is that Perlbill is well presented and well supported. It's not for everyone, but it's not flame material.

Cheers

Gary

Hi Richard/Gary

Richard - the issue with the three tags in the welcome email: you asked me that exact question before you purchased the software and I did clearly state that those were the only tags that can be utilized in the welcome email.

The PRO version is not realeased on our site yet, and we have only distributed it to a few select clients - and it would not solve the tags in the welcome email as it is exactly the same in that respect.

The only version with more tags in the welcome email is the cpanel integration email, as that contains information such as {domain} and the cpanel login information .. which I also clearly stated before you purchased the software.

The offer is still there for a refund if you are unhappy.

Regards

John

John
like I said I will let you no in a few hours if I need a refund.

Richard :mad:

Originally posted by hoster
I meant to ask you what order system are you using now, I see you are using Revecom processing?

Just wondering.

Richard

We had to switch to Revecom when PlanetPOS shut down and it has taken too long to get our merchant facility. We're building another system of our own now as our previous one was strictly set up to talk to PlanetPOS, but we use ModernBill on a local machine here for maintaining the entire client base.

We're also using clientexec.com (worth a look) for some separate brands to keep things organised.

Cheers

Gary

Originally posted by hoster
A reply about your comment about Modernbill, it is for webhosting companies only and not other types of business.

And as far as not being 100% happy with PerBill you are right.
If you remeber I spent 2 days trying to get it to working around with you with over 15 emails this past weekend. Then finaly I gave you access and then it worked. I asked you what you found you said changed some code around. So I spent 2 days pulling what little hair I have left out trying to get it to work.

So anyway John, I will let you know in a few hours here about the refund, hopr that workss for you.

Richard :mad:

Hi Richard,

I am obviously missing something here...

You bought the product, had problems installing it. But, the developer happily worked with you to directly to get it installed.

Once it was installed and working you find that you don't like it, or it doesn't meet your needs. You then proceed to post here that the online demo 'hides' the fact that PerlBill does not do certain things you thought it did. Acting as thought you were intentionally being ripped off.

The online demo of PerlBill shows exactly how it works. I understood it with no problems. It didn't do things how I had initally anticipated, but that is because I was used to how my old online billing software functioned. Once I realised how PerlBill was going to manage things I immediatley saw how it could work for me to bill my web hosting and web design customers.

I do not see how it would not work for anyone else, unless their expectations where not in sync with what the product actually does. And the only way that would happen is if they really didn't have a clue what they were doing - because as I said before, the demo illustrates perfectly what the scripts do. This also goes for problems with the installation.

I just bought PerlBill yesterday. I am a web designer not a programmer. I read the instructions that came with the product and installed it as advised. Due to the fact that it comes with an install script that sets up the mySQL database tables for you and allows you to easily set all the required variables without editing even one script. All I really had to do was upload the files, set the permissions, and run the installer script. It worked perfectly. I was able to customize the look and feel from the admin control panel, and although I did find one small bug - weather it was caused by my action, or was there in the first place I dont know - but the developer, John Bennett, fixed it for me within no time.

Having bought countless pieces of software like this I can attest to the fact that the quality of John Bennett's program and customer care is some of the best I have come across in the $100 - $200 price range.

Any developer who will spent 2 days and 15 emails working with a customer to install a peice of software that frankly my 10 year nephew could have installed without any problems, is definatley to be commended for his dedication to his customers.

Here is what you get in a text file, now when you have to inform the NEW client of his login info for, ftp, frontpage login, control panel login, and other needed info can't be done. I am sorry there is 4 tags.

I am not trying to flame anyone just stating the way I see it.

Thanks Editor for your info.

Richard

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear {fname}

Thank you for your order, it has now been approved.

You can use the below details to login to our client center.

Login Details
--------------------------------
Username : {user}
Password : {password}

{baseurl}/client.cgi

Thank you

Admin

yes, i dont think the online demo was hacked to work better. i'm sure it runs off the same source code you download ;)

I give you a full demo of all software features (except email).

I sell you the product without installation services.

You have trouble installing so I assist you and get it working.

You say you are unhappy.

I offer you a complete refund.

You say you will let me know.

You still bash me on forums.

Frankly, I am at a loss as to what more you expected John to do. If it isn't what you want, that's fine. But to bash him here is not appropriate at all. He has gone beyond the call of duty to try to remedy the problem.

As I stated the support was find, and as far as the 2 days and 15 emails goes is that there was a code problem in the script not what I did to it.

Like I said I think it is great to a point, and we purchase alot of software and scripts here as well.

And as far as a refund goes John is the one that bought that up the other day, I just told him don't I get 6 mos of support?

The other problem is he is in the UK and when I need help he is sleeping so I need to wait another day to get a reply back.
And he does reply back no problem with that part.

It is just that we have +200 clients already but in the db and need to add some more before we are done.

The lack of tags is the big issue with me to do a welcome letter the way it should be done.

You can do much with 3 tags, I have to edit each clients letter which takes time to do.

That's all I got here.

As for the same on site demogoes I was told Saturday the new version I got was just out Friday, so the hack g=has nnothing to do with it. He just didn't upload the new version.

Originally posted by hoster
Here is what you get in a text file, now when you have to inform the NEW client of his login info for, ftp, frontpage login, control panel login, and other needed info can't be done. I am sorry there is 4 tags.

I am not trying to flame anyone just stating the way I see it.

Thanks Editor for your info.

Richard

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear {fname}

Thank you for your order, it has now been approved.

You can use the below details to login to our client center.

Login Details
--------------------------------
Username : {user}
Password : {password}

{baseurl}/client.cgi

Thank you

Admin


Richard,

In the online demo this file is readily available for you to view. How could you not have understood that it would be the same in the version you got?

This welcome email gives the customer their login to perlbill for submitting tickets and checking their payment history. That is what it is for. If you are using PerlBill to take orders and bill for hosting, then you would need to also send your customer and seperate email with their specific hosting information. How would PerlBill do this - via telepathy?!

As I said in an my earlier post - the only reason you would think PerlBill did things it didn't is if you didn't undertsand what you were buying. This is obviously the case. But that is not John Bennett's fault - his demo shows exactly what you are buying. The misunderstanding is with you.

(Also, that welcome email is editable via the online admin control panel, you can have it say whatever you want.)

Lets try this again and it is my final post.

All I am trying here is to tell you that the SCRIPTS sent to me on Friday had some problem with the code in it.

I gave him access to take a look and see, he found a problem with HIS CODE so he corrected and everything was fine and I was happy camper.

Then after I entered 200 clients and ran some tests and found that we were going to have this issue when we get signups with the welcome letters, LET IS THE ONLY ISSUE. All emails have to be edited before they can be sent.

John's support was great and told him each and every time.

This is my final post on this subject work has to be done here.

Thanks all for your info.....


Richard

Originally posted by hoster

The other problem is he is in the UK and when I need help he is sleeping so I need to wait another day to get a reply back.
And he does reply back no problem with that part.

The fact that John is in the UK is also readily available via his web site. If you choose to buy a product from someone in the UK, you cna't then complain that they are sleeping when you want support.

For the record, I first emailed sales@perlbill.com on Saturday evening EDT. I received a quick reply and continued to correspond with John till close to midnight EDT. When I got up the next morning (Sunday) and purchased a copy of PerlBill, I received it within 60 minutes. Later in the day I received another email from John because he wanted to check up to see if my installtion had gone well. This morning (Monday) I emailed John and again got a reply within 60 minutes.

As I said before, it seem to me like you are inventing alot of problems that don't exist to cover up for your own lack of understanding.

THIS MY FINAL POST NOW.

This is the version number of demo on site of PerlBill.
So as you can see the demo is not the sanme version.

Powered by PerlBill 1.1
Copyright © PerlBill [www.perlbill.com]



This is the version sold to me

Powered by PerlBill 1.3 ST
Copyright © PerlBill [www.perlbill.com]

Hi Hoster,

Yes, you have received a more recent version than the one on our site and the one you have has more features. The areas you have highlighted in this post though are identical to 1.1.

I can understand why you would like those tags in a welcome email to your customers, the fact is though how would PerlBill know the IP of your client's site, or the login information for your server if PerlBill does not setup the account on the server - It does offer that level of integration and extra tags for cPanel servers but no other platforms have been catered for yet.

What you can do is completely change the welcome template and set it out how you would like and enter the clients IP and login information before the email is sent. You are given the oppurtunity to edit the email when you approve every customer and you can manually enter your desired information that is specific to that user.

Anyway, I hope you can email me if you have any further questions as I can deal with them much faster via email and would be happy to help you further.

Best Regards

John

Originally posted by hoster
Lets try this again and it is my final post.

All I am trying here is to tell you that the SCRIPTS sent to me on Friday had some problem with the code in it.

I gave him access to take a look and see, he found a problem with HIS CODE so he corrected and everything was fine and I was happy camper.

Then after I entered 200 clients and ran some tests and found that we were going to have this issue when we get signups with the welcome letters, LET IS THE ONLY ISSUE. All emails have to be edited before they can be sent.

John's support was great and told him each and every time.

This is my final post on this subject work has to be done here.

Thanks all for your info.....


Richard

Hi Richard,

Well I am glad we cleared that up then. Becuase to be honest it really upsets me when I see posts such as your orginal one which completely misrepresent things.

It may well be that there was a probelm with the code that you were sent. Mix-up's happen from time to time - I am sure you have sent a client the wrong login info or something at some point. The fact that John fixed the issue for you, leaving you with a perfectly functioning copy of his software is good and of course what is expected of him.

But your initial post also alluded to the fact the some how the demo you used at the site was not the product you got and you had been ripped off,or that PerlBill was bad software that did not live up to it's advertising. When really, as you cleared up in the above quoted post, you did not undertsand some of the features (such as how welcome emails worked), even though they were clearly there in the demo before you purchased the program.

:D

John

I understand that with the welcome email, and we made up our minds here in the past hour repling to all these posts that we will keep the product and reedit the welcome letters for now.

But one thin John lets need to be cleared up here is the problem you had with the scripts sent to me.

Every body here has the idea I am making up these issues.

There was a problem and that is the reason it didn't work.

Also the copy you have on site is not the the same version correct?

I checked the version number of the demo it is not the same correct?

Please reply to this post.

Thanks Richard

Originally posted by JBS
Hi Hoster,

Yes, you have received a more recent version than the one on our site and the one you have has more features. The areas you have highlighted in this post though are identical to 1.1.

I also got 1.3 ST, as did Richard, and it is identical to the demo.

Looks maybe, it is a different version number 1.1 on there site how can it be the SAME as our version 1.3-ST?

So an other words there are changes some where, and maybe yours workd off the bat because you got your copy after he fixed mine, I don't no John only knows.

So tell John replies to my last post we will not no.

The other thing I ran a client signup before I ordered it and never got any return email back from that test.

So what ever like I said I am not requesting a refund so that should make everybody happy here.

Back to work...


Richard

Originally posted by hoster
[B
The other thing I ran a client signup before I ordered it and never got any return email back from that test.
[/B]

Richard - John clearly stated somewhere earlier in this thread that the email function is disabled in the online demo because of the risk of abuse.

This is a pretty normal thing to do.

Originally posted by hoster
Looks maybe, it is a different version number 1.1 on there site how can it be the SAME as our version 1.3-ST?

It is pretty normal for minor version changes to be so similar it is hard to tell the difference - sometimes it is just that something in the code go a rewrite.

What John said earlier in the thread is that the 1.3 ST does have a few differences from 1.1, but not regarding the functionality you took issue with.

When I stated that there were the same - I meant in the areas such as the welcome email. Although to be honest I am hard pressed to see what the differences are in other areas too - the software I am running seems the same as the demo.

This is what John said:

Yes, you have received a more recent version than the one on our site and the one you have has more features.

I do understand about small changes in software I have been in this business since 1998 and have purchased a lot of software in my days.

I have been in computers whne the Mac first can out if that tells you anything.

lanie, like I said many of times now in this thread that I am keeping the software, and I said many times over and over that Johns support is great.

So can we get on to another subject?

Regards,

Richard :) :) :)

Originally posted by hoster
like I said many of times now in this thread that I am keeping the software, and I said many times over and over that Johns support is great.

So can we get on to another subject?

Regards,

Richard :) :) :)

I am glad that ultimately you are happy with PerlBill. It is a great product.

Good talking with you.

Lanie :)

Hi Richard

This isn't really the place for me to post a changelog between versions. There are a number of backend changes and additions in the administration.

I will email you the exact changes, as I said earlier though no changes have been made to the areas raised such as welcome emails.

Best Regards

John

No John what I wanted you to do is explain what you corrected on the software you sent me and way it didn't work?

Thats it.

Richard

Hi Richard

The correction was made to the HTML code for the 2Checkout payment form in the documentation that needed to be inserted into one of the templates to activate the 2Checkout integration. One of the value tags was missing an '=' sign in the source. I simply corrected that.

Apologies for the delays that caused getting you up and running but it has been corrected in our documentation.

Regards

John

Thank you John.

Case closed..............

Richard :)

All i can say is wow. What is the problem if he had to fix some of the code. He did it, and from what I understand pretty fast. I don't get why you said lets make it clear. Because who cares.

I purchased this program last week. I will post a demo once i have fully modified mine. I am currently adding hard coded fields, and changing a few other things like the welcome letter and all that.

I have been emailing john back and forward for the last few days with him responding everytime and even telling me how his code works pretty much. So now i completly understand it and can modify it anyway i want.

Just so everyone knows. This product is great, the support is great, enough said. I don't get why hoster had to bring it to these forums when john had been emailing him back everytime. He even took his time to come and respond to this lame thread

Thanks John

Please look at my comment here...

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?postid=1678425#post1678425