I believe that the rules should be amended or at least a separate section created for it where hosts can post offers when a client is specifically looking for a specific service. Currently we have the advertising forums where users are not allowed to request services and then we have VPS/Dedicated forums where users are supposed to discuss those services. Everyday there are users posting there asking for services but hosts aren't allowed "advertise" there services even though someone wants them. I understand that those sections want to be clean of advertising but if someone wants a specific service they should be able to request it and get a reply from hosts that can offer that specific need.

If someone wants a specific service they have to plow through all the offers in the advertising forums and may never find what they are looking for. Sometimes clients want things installed etc or custom plans. This is the only forum I know of that doesn't allow it or doesn't have a section for it.

So I am requesting or asking for some discussion/opinions on the matter so something can be done about it. Hosts should either be able to respond to users requests or there should be a specific section where users can submit requests and get them answered.

I hope I made myself clear on what the issue is and what I'm trying to accomplish.

thewird

There was a sub-forum for exactly that which closed in 2003. It was a lot of work for the moderators to maintain. If you look around other forums that still allow this, you'll see hosts constantly spamming their wares in every thread, even when they're not a match. Hosts wanting to directly advertise their services here are supposed to use the Host Quote feature now :).

the vps/dedicated forums are for users looking for advice from other users, not for hosts to spam you just because you are in the market. Unless I ask for offers from a host, which is not allowed anymore, then I do not want to receive posts from hosts offering their services, or acting like a normal user recommending what is really there company. And pming in case is not acceptable either.

As I expected this forum is run to earn advertising dollars with Sticky's and "get a quote". "Host Quote" can't offer services or script installs or explain what the service actually has. The "Host Quote" quote feature is just another gimmick to ask for advertising dollars from hosts to get priority like the Sticky threads. That is the only purpose I see in the current setup.

I know the section is only for discussing which is why I also said that another section may be an option. If you had this before, you should have never removed it.

And yes its true the forums that allow such postings get a lot more attention since someone is actually there to respond to the user's questions. Moderators are rarely needed and threads actually end up with the initial thread starter getting what he wanted.

thewird

I was here when the request forums were active and I can assure you they were a mess. Every day I saw hosts replying to threads that didn't match even the basic requirements. The most common was a Linux host offering hosting when the requester needed Windows. This created a lot of extra work for the moderators and they made the decision (with plenty of objections) to permanently remove it.

At least host are still capable of posting in the Advertising Forums for free. That the most popular forum for web hosting on the Internet allows that is something folks should be a little more grateful for in my opinion.

You realize moderators don't need to delete the post if it isn't relevant. That is completely unnecessary work unless the post is offensive or against some other rule or even if the thread starter specifically requests it. The thread starter is smart enough to to look at what he wants.

thewird

The request forum was nice when it was around, but usually it was a big mess. The moderators felt it was necessary to insure that the most accurate results of the users requests were displayed. Also it was against the rules to post irrelevant offers, hence why they were deleted.

While I do not really like the host quote option, a single thread in the web hosting/vps/dedicated forums will help you find what you need from the users on this board.

If you just wish to advertise on here, then there are advertising forums. While many of people including myself take advantage of the advertising forums and the ability to advertise in your signature, it is not completely what this forum is about. And giving the amount of spam and bogus accounts there are now, I highly doubt re instating something that did not work very well the first time, would help much of anything.

Suggesting that moderators shouldn't remove those posts doesn't make a lot of sense to me. This is part of the clutter and mess that existed when those forums were around. Some hosts would try to post in every single request thread. When more than a handful of hosts started doing this, it would create a thread where the original poster had to sort through several spammish posts to try and find the relevant ones. I don't see how that scenario is any better than what we have here now.

I think you'd have to see the amount of replies you'd get by posting a request in the main forums... one or two would be alright, twenty plus several for outsourced support and server management might be a little much to cope with.

It is best for providers to advertise their wares in one place, and to direct requestors to look there themselves. This approach (where the client goes in search of the provider) works quite well.

For very special requests, we do have some Requests forums where you are allowed to respond, though most of the time, csparks is right - you won't need to respond, others will offer their reviews or assistance without any need of advertising in the main forums.

Well, if it wasn't fine when it existed then new rules can be created to better existence of the thread including providing a better experience for the users. If a user is spamming every thread and it isn't relevant to what the person is asking constantly, he should be deleted.

I think you'd have to see the amount of replies you'd get by posting a request in the main forums... one or two would be alright, twenty plus several for outsourced support and server management might be a little much to cope with.
Outsourced support and server management shouldn't be allowed to post in a thread where a user is asking for hosting. The infraction system can be used for this.

thewird

and I'm sure you could get a few new moderators that would be interested in this. Back when I was in hosting, I used to wish that this forum had requests.

I'd be happy to moderate a new requests forum if needed.

its not need and I hope it never gets implemented again, to keep ppl like the op poster who are only interested in advertising there wares out.

Its ok to advertise, but to complain because of the lack of FREE advertising, is just plain stupid.

Is this forum ran by advertising dollars? Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes. Do I believe the status quo system is ok? Indeed I do. Although I wasn't on this forum when a requests section existed, I do think a requests section would be chaotic. It would also detract from posts in the offers section and would quickly become a free-for-all for companies paying some foreigner $2 per hour to hawk their products. Trust me, we shouldn't go there.

But along the lines of what *is* wrong with the status quo, I believe the offers section should be void of offers to "take over" services. Advertising the ability to take over someone else's services is really unfair to the companies who provide them. A given client might have a really favorable price from the provider, and the provider's business model is probably predicated on not having to continue providing the service after the original user wants to terminate. Further it clogs the advertising forums. It's bad enough that anyone with no financial means, no servers, no network - nothing, can advertise some service that they have little or no hand in. This is not to take away from resellers - ours are a great asset to us - I'm just illustrating that there is no barrier to entry for advertising in the offers section. Having takeover offers only exacerbates this point. If anything, this should be the subject of a thread - not how to create a new free-for-all on WHT.

Instead of just saying how bad it was in the past, how about some alternatives? Even though I'm of the opinion that it would be a good thing, it seems most of the people that matter in terms of policy don't agree. I mean, moderators exist for a reason, to weed out the users that abuse... Although, on forums that allow it don't seem that bad at all.

thewird

I mean, moderators exist for a reason, to weed out the users that abuse...
And that was a *lot* of users when that forum existed.
Although, on forums that allow it don't seem that bad at all.
That you can see (undeleted ones) anyway. I can't speak for these other forums, but if you saw just how much effort goes into keeping WHT clean on a daily basis, you'd be quite surprised, I think.

The current system seems to be working pretty well, and I don't see any compelling arguments in favor of it.

I've not been around WHT that long, but I've been in the industry longer than most and have got to say, allowing hosts to hawk their warez in a request folder would be a free-for-all mess.

The current advertising folders should be clamped down alot too in my opinion. Limit how often a company can post their offers in those folders to once a week/month or X times a year for free. Too often I see folks posting every day or two to insure close to top placement without paying for a sticky thread, how is this good? I've built a very nice niche business without WHT at all until just recently, and frankly could go on for another decade without it's advertising. When I do browse the forum, I prefer to activly participate over advertising, and let my sig do what little advertising it can. I realize some have built nearly 100% of their biz by using the advertising forums here, but at what cost to the quality of posts as a whole to the foum?

I've not been around WHT that long, but I've been in the industry longer than most and have got to say, allowing hosts to hawk their warez in a request folder would be a free-for-all mess.

The current advertising folders should be clamped down alot too in my opinion. Limit how often a company can post their offers in those folders to once a week/month or X times a year for free. Too often I see folks posting every day or two to insure close to top placement without paying for a sticky thread, how is this good? I've built a very nice niche business without WHT at all until just recently, and frankly could go on for another decade without it's advertising. When I do browse the forum, I prefer to activly participate over advertising, and let my sig do what little advertising it can. I realize some have built nearly 100% of their biz by using the advertising forums here, but at what cost to the quality of posts as a whole to the foum?
The advertising forums already do limit new threads to once every 7 days if I remember correctly.

thewird

The advertising forums already do limit new threads to once every 7 days if I remember correctly.

thewird

You had to go and make me look ;)

I did not see any frequency cap on posts, only that a poster have 10 posts and 7 days of membership.

I am a moderator on forum that does allow paid hosting requests. It is small scale compared to what we even had in the past here, but the amount of moderation needed is still 25ish% compared to the other categories on that forum.

Since we stopped it here in 2003, we have over 100,000 more members :eek2:

You had to go and make me look ;)

I did not see any frequency cap on posts, only that a poster have 10 posts and 7 days of membership.
I recently posted a thread and trying again now "You may only start thread every 7 day(s). Please try again later." You only get the error if you try to post another thread within 7 days.

Since we stopped it here in 2003, we have over 100,000 more members :eek2:
If it didn't I'd be worried since this is one of the more popular forums when it comes to hosting (not only in finding web hosts but in all issues related to hosting). I don't think it applies.

I think this comes down to a case of their aren't enough moderators willing to cleanup after the spammers from what I can tell. But I think there should be some alternative and haven't heard any suggestions.

thewird

There were a few ideas tossed around here (http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=624556).

webhosting requests is also allowed on webhostingtalk.nl and it's just messy. A lot of posts are edited, there are very strict rules and a LOT of spamming around.

The way its handled now, seems ok to me.