(Buyer Beware)...
...of Cyberwing Communications (www.cyberwings.com)

If you don't read my long post, at least check out the quotes from other people (below)...

Then check out the site. See anything suspicious? Do you really think a company can provide reliable, fast, feature-rich, long-term web hosting for such ridiculously low prices? That aint even the half of it... you should see some of the sales he sends out and offers in the chat room. Things like - lifetime individual hosting account for $10. Gimme a break! Shawn White, the CEO, cannot possibly keep his business (and I use that term loosely) running so cheaply.

And you better hope nothing ever goes wrong. Do you see any type of server status page on the website? Nope. Wanna know why? They are too embarrassed! For example, one of their Cobalt Raq servers started having PAM authentication issues about a week ago, and DAYS later they could only put a bandaid on the problem by special request only. It allowed access back to the account for a few hours, then the server went completely offline. It has been inaccessable, with NO explanation or ETA offered, for DAYS now. No posting on the site, no emails to the customers, and evasive answers (if any) in their chat room. I can't blame them for not wanting people to know the quality (or lack thereof) of "service" Cyberwings provides.

Now look at the "Contact Us" page - see the email address for tech support? Would you believe that "support@cyberwings.com" is not monitored by real people? Email it to give it a try! See the canned email reply telling you that's NOT how you get technical support?

Shawn is all about getting your money up front, and promising you service later. Sounds good, if you are Shawn, but for the customer, you better hope he comes through. That remains to be seen. Everyone has heard that saying about 'if it sounds too good...' Promises for Shawn are free, so it stands to reason that if you want to take a lot of money from people in a short amount of time, you sell them promises. And I do give him credit for creativity! He has come up with some of the silliest (but creative) terms for sales and upgrades that get you to want to spend more money for future service.

In the time the one server was recently down (affecting about 200 accounts/websites, by the way), there was not a single notification to anyone. I have a "priority one" trouble ticket that has gone DAYS without any type of reply. I initiated that ticket before the server crashed, when it was having basic problems just a couple of days earlier. When the server crashed, they added a new category to the help desk tickets. Since I wasn't in the "correct" category, they may never see it now. What a crock! I hope all 200 customers know that the only way to get any anwers (albeit mostly wrong answers) is to join and IRC chat room. It appears that losing 200 customers is no big deal, when you are so busy reeling in all the other believers who actually think they will get what they pay for.

Shawn, who must be about 18 years old, thinks he can fool all the people all the time. Us older folks learned long ago that it can't be done. He should stop the charades, get his act together, and stop playing with peoples' livlihoods. Many of his customers may actually RELY (gasp!) on their web hosting and emails for their jobs, etc, and the way Shawn and his lousy staff is handling problems shows their lack of maturity and overall concern for the customers - the people who spent all that money. And I predict the non-service-oriented business practices, immaturity, and overzealousness will be the company's downfall in a rather short amount of time.

In the mean time, for you risk-takers out there, enjoy the trip! When your account vanishes, or when Cyberwings vanishes, try out a better company like Eryxma or Affordable Host or one of the other ones that truly care about their customers more than the customers' money. I previously moved my account to another hosting company, and I advise everyone at Cyberwings to have a backup plan!

I know that after I post this, numerous customers (he must have several thousand by now, with the sales he's promoting) will come to his aid, along with some of his worthless staff to pick apart this post, but that's to be expected. It's all semantics. The bottom line is the dead server for days, and the lack of results. They can pick apart the post, but if they spent half as much time fixing their hosting problems, maybe people like me wouldn't have to post "beware of this company" notices like this. If those of you reading this think I'm the only one, and I'm just venting, then read some excerpts from some posts in a public forum, NOT from the Cyberwings site:

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=40&threadid=820096

"Has anyone had trouble accesing their sites hosted by them ? I can't check my mail, visit my site, or for that matter theirs ? I hope the "life time" offer was mine, I hope ther are still there."

"I'm having trouble too - I'm also not sure this is the right forum (maybe a move to OT? hint hint). But yeah, my site (see sig) is dead too...damn."

"Yea it seems like their Upstream provider is having problems
AGAIN...."

"It's really starting to piss me off right now, i'm on PLESK14 which HAS downtime EVERY day, doesn't just seem that way, it truely has hours of downtime EVERY day, sigh..."

"Both of mine are unreachable as well. Oh, well. Luckily I only paid a little over $3 for them and I don't do anything important on them."

"Ya, I also understand the the few bucks i paid aren't that important if i lose it. But the e-mail adress they host is. I got some important contacts that are handled through it, so i dont wana have to trouble them explaining why i had to change adress."

"Kinda makes it hard to sell on Ebay when none of your pictures work! And I hear ya about the email. This connection is down at least once a day. Over the last week, I usually check my mail maybe 3 times a day, and at least once everyday I was not able to connect for hours at a time. That cannot be 98% uptime, no way!"

"My account on Plesk11 is down too."

"dam, another day another downtime"

"Ok my site is back up now. It was down for at least 30 minutes! So 60 (minutes)*24 (hours) =1440 minutes in a day. 30 / 1440 = .02 so low and behold 98% uptime assuming it was not down earlier today and will not go down again tonight. There almost seems like there is a planned 2% downtime lately every day. Whatever..."

"they still havne't set my account up that i orderd in MAy, so screw them"

"mine is down. so is www.cyberwings.com"

"They definitely need to solve this upstream provider issue"

"hahah build a new datacenter? if this guy had millions of dollars to throw around, im sure he could afford a couple backup lines for u guys..."

"what makes all u guys believe them when they say "their upstream provider" is the problem...that could very well be just "press talk""

"Cyberwings sucks. Shawn, give me my money back, stop ignoring my emails."

"To be honest I dont know why anyone would sign up with cyberwings. They have absolutely no business model. Lifetime accounts? Impossible unless they invest your money in some very high interest solid fund. I am predicting they will be out of business, with your money, in under 6 months. Be ready."

"I was informed their 98% uptime gaurantee is an average over ONE YEAR!?!??! I don't think I saw that mentioned on their site when I registered a month or 2 ago. So they could be down approx. 7.5 days and they'd stay within their uptime gaurantee. 2% of a year is around what, 175 hours or so...blah.."

"Their uplink providers have been crappy lately. The downtimes are usually for about 30 min to 1 hour."

"No, their choice of peers has been crappy always. Uplink? give me a break. It's about peering, and who you sleep with in that regard. Sheety host = sheety service."

And my favorite:

"Everytime a server crashes a user earns his cyberwings..."

I did take a look at them the other day and was totally turned off by the site in general. I just looked plain sloppy which makes me wonder about support and service.

For that reason alone, I would not consider Cyberwing Communications for hosting.

Your obviously upset with them. Perhaps I missed something in the lengthy post but are you a client of theirs?

Perhaps I missed something in the lengthy post but are you a client of theirs?

I was, briefly. I paid for a year, but have already obtained new hosting and changed the name servers. I won't even bother asking for a refund... I'll just chalk it up to experience. I do hope, however, to help others avoid similar situations.

:eek: Ya know, I just noticed... in the cyberwinge nightmare thread... soon after Shawn posts his excuses for poor service or whatever, several of his "customers" start to chime in with their positive experiences. Kinda fishy how all of a sudden, several customers (in a row) suddenly visit the forum to defend him. Oh well...

Wasn't Cyberwings claiming they had thier own datacenter once:rolleyes:

They dont claim to, they do have their own DC... though for the past couple of days they have been having problems with their upstream provider...

On the whole though CW get a thumbs up from me, and no I'm nothing to do with them...

What do you mean by "and no I'm nothing to do with them...", Scotty? Do you mean you have nothing to do with them? Just trying to understand you better.

What? You get crappy support and uptime w/ $3 a month hosting???? STOP THE PRESSES!!!!

I've an account at CyberWings and yeah, I'm not satisfied with their uptimes. If you visit the "Server Maintenance, Upgrades & Outage" forum (in their site), you will know why.

So, all I can say about CW is that they are not good for your mission critical site. They are most suitable for people who want to host their personal or low traffic sites or hobby sites. Mine is a similar site, and I'm very satisfied about their service and pricing (ofcourse!), other than the uptime issue.

So you need not complain that their uptime is bad or low. If you find you are missing lot of visitors and revenue, then switch to some other host and ask Shawn for a refund. Shawn is not cheating people, he does give refund if you ask, anytime. He is making money through these 'creative' deals so that he can improve the services in future. Ofcourse, he knows that people wont be using 300 MB of space and 100 GB of bandwidth per month for their personal sites !

Anyway, they are switching to monthly based hosting like other hosts from this week. Their website will be redesigned too. It was just to make some quick money that he had these 'out of the world' deals. It doesn't mean that he cheated people. They are still alive with average customer support.

Enough said ;)

Originally posted by xelA
What do you mean by "and no I'm nothing to do with them...", Scotty? Do you mean you have nothing to do with them? Just trying to understand you better.

I mean that my only connection with them is that I use them to host my site

Originally posted by NOcyberwings


I won't even bother asking for a refund...


I did the same, but I think that's the way they make money. They charge you low price, and give you low quality service, hoping you move out without using their resources and not asking for a refund. YOu see, they get your money, you don't use their service...

got my personal site there, ~98% uptime, not that good but .. As someone said, I would not put a mission critical site there . (uptime)&(slow support)

I have about eight sites with Cyberwings. Quite honestly I dont have a monitor on them, and really only use them for domains I dont need for email, just as play around personal stuff.

J definitely would not host a business site or any critical site on Cyberwings. But I still think they serve a great purpose as a cheap host. You get what you pay for and then plus some (if you use their cheapest plans).

I am not a customer of Cyberwings, but I would like to comment if I may.

During the past few days I have been watching the IRC Support chat channel. I see that many customers arent very happy, and I would like to ask a couple questions of my own, because at one time I was interested in purchasing a dedicated server.

I have been told by many CW Employees that Cyberwings has 'Redundant Connections' with level3 and verizon. CW has been going down alot in the past couple days, and they keep saying its the Upstream providers fault (LightShip), but if they have redundant connections, then there would be NO downtime, because once LS goes out, the level3 or verizon (redundant connection) would kick in. But instead all we hear is "The upstream is having problems". To me this sounds really weird.

I have nothing wrong with CW, and Im glad Shawn is having such good success with sales and everything. But you NEED to keep people updated with what EXACTLY is going on, or you will end up regretting it in the future.

Exactly do you expect good uptime/support if you pay $2/year? How will they have to cover the losses on sales, putting thounsands of clients on a server. Thus the constant downtime. Move with your feet people leave cyberwings pay a little more and get the service/support that you require.

I got my cyberwings account a couple of months ago. Paid $2.70 for a year. Worth nearly every penny.

From what I've seen, I imagine my account won't run the year. Unless the service improves substantially and the company finds a way to repeal the laws of financial gravity.

Well, I got a reseller account with them for **** and giggles... 10 bucks a month for 1gb/25gb is DIRT cheap, and if it's a little slow sometimes, it's OK, because I'm not actually going to resell the space.

Also... They had a birthday special and I got 75mb/30gb of bandwith per month for only 4 dollars a year. I had to take that one... Even if they don't make it... I won't be out anything that's going to kill me.

Whatever you do don't go to cyberwings, I sent them so much money and I have yet to get my information, I bought I few reseller accounts and they kept my money, thing is I sent it via paypal what should I do now?

What a Joke!
75mb/30gb of bandwith per month for only 4 dollars a year. :D :D :D
What do they do, pull numbers out of a hat?

Originally posted by bodyz
Whatever you do don't go to cyberwings, I sent them so much money and I have yet to get my information, I bought I few reseller accounts and they kept my money, thing is I sent it via paypal what should I do now?

File a complaint with PayPal, they will reverse the charges if CW cant prove delivery.

Well, all I have on Cyberwings is a forum and that has been 100% down for the last 4 days. I don't mind them cheating me out of 7 months of service but I sure would like to be able to FTP in and get my files!

This has scam written all over it. My friends and I all expected this when we signed up but like one said, "For $10 a year, who cares?"

Originally posted by ATST
What a Joke!
:D :D :D
What do they do, pull numbers out of a hat?
Haha, probably.

In all seriousness, I've been a "customer" (if you could really call me a customer from the way I was treated by Cyberwings) of theirs for several months now, and it's just been one bad thing after another. I kind of rushed into purchasing an account with them because I saw a few rave "customer" comments and their prices were so cheap. How naive of me - I should've left as soon as I saw their website. Well, suffice it to say that they were slow to respond even to my pre-sales questions, and after that it just got worse - slow support, downtime, ridiculously cheap "lifetime" sales, etc.

Continued from last post..

Had a huge outage on the server I was on shortly after I joined up, and after 10 hours, they were "researching" the problem. I went to the chat room because I just plain couldn't get a response from the help desk about it, only to be verbally abused by the CW fanatics that hang out there. One of them even started swearing at me and told me that he had the private beeper/pager numbers of CW staff, but now he wouldn't give them to me, nah nah. That's one of the things that kills me and I hatedthe most: whenever I've tried to publicly question something like the slow/poor service or some downtime, a few of these "customers" start flaming me and basically telling me that I should revere Shawn (Cyberwings CEO) and give the poor, poor man a break. Yeah right.

So there's the slow, rotten support and then there's the flaming fanatics, and finally there's Shawn and Cyberwings: Wow. Here's a few bits from a chat he held with his customers the other day (http://www.cwstatus.com/logjuly5afternoon.htm):
<deadhead77> Shawn, I had high hopes when I signed up with your company. I was somewhat apprehensive when there were questions about your lack of corporate filing with the State of Maine. You stated that you were validly incorporated and promised to post the Articles of Incorporation on the web site. Now it appears that you only filed with the State of Maine on 6/12/02. What is your response?
...
<CEO-Shawn> DEADHEAD77: I've already had this discussion with the Secretary of State of the State of Maine and ANY issues you have with that should be directed to them. They will respond accordingly. We are 100% legal in our proceedings over the past 12-13 months and that has already been addressed between Me, our Counsel, and them. But again, feel free to contact them if you wish to inquire further. They already have a canned [response to give out!]
Shortly after this is resolved people will be flocking back to us, I assure you.
Oh you're going to be surprised what I've got planned. This entire situation has lit a fire under me to the point where I'm not stopping until CW dominates the market in hosting, with PREMIER quality data centers.

Anyway, the latest thing they're giving their customers is that their upstream provider has been having some big problem that slows down or completely cuts off access to the Cyberwings servers but does not allow the backup providers to kick in. One of their employees posted a message in their forums a couple days ago saying that in "2-3 days" they would be packing up all the servers from their brand-spanking new data center in Maine and moving them to a data center in North Virginia, which would entail three days of downtime. Now, we are told that they are not, in fact, moving but will be building yet another data center in North Virginia that will become their "flagship" data center and that they cannot discuss the details of their problems with their upstream provider, Lightship. Not only all this, but customers weren't even e-mailed until something like yesterday, and then only the customers that were somehow able to find out about the opt-in updates list got an e-mail. When confronted in his chats, Shawn refuses to acknowledge that he has been lacking in his communication and tells the people who question him that if they don't like it, they should leave. Talk about customer relations.

In all fairness, however, as has been said: If you don't have a mission-critical site, just want something for cheap to play with, don't mind being harassed by fellow "customers" in a "support" chat room while staff members stand by, don't mind poor communication, service outages, and wouldn't mind waking up to find it all gone one morning, then Cyberwings is for you! ;)

I leave you with this gem from the customer chat yesterday:
<CEO-Shawn> They already have a canned response to give out!
<Willowdream> [16:47] <t-mon> CEO-CONDIT Well, once again, I have not been a perfect man. I have made mistakes in my life. But out of respect for my family, out of a specific request by the Lightship family, it is best that I not get into the details of the relationship.

Come on now..I have been a customer of CW since Jan, and the past few days has been my only triubles with them. Every provider, every company, has problems now and then. I have been in chat the past 4 days so that I could get new info as it came out, and NO customers or CW staff was flaming anyone... All questions were answered when asked. Flaming by some customers did take place when the people asking the questions did it in a rude and childish manner! And in reality, no flaming was done, except by the customers that came in complaining and moaning with a major attitude... If you go in anywhere with a major attitude, you're not gonna be treated very well! People that came in and acted maturely and were nice got treated with the utmost resepct from everyone! I for one have no complaints about my CW accounts, and I have 6 of them! Granted there is a problem there, and they are working on it in a timely fashion!

One thing people should stop doing is going around spreading rumors, spreading lies, etc!!! Can you say "CHILDISH"!!!??! I have logs of most of the chatroom experiences, and 99% of the time it was the customers that came in rude and acted like a 2 year old child throwing a tempertantrum...If you act like a child, I feel you should be treated like one!

It's funny how it resembles a 2 year old child throwing a tantrum but a customer who has been waiting through a 7 day blackout gets angry. :angry: As far as I am concerned, CW could be "spreading rumors and lies" every time they declare anything. How do I know that they have their own data center, that they have a real staff? That this problem is not of their making? Why should I not be concerned that the business deals I have made with them and rely on are not shams to make a quick buck--it sure looks that way to me. If they are a professional hosting company, how on earth could they let their customers eat a 7 day total outage and not have some coningency plan? Heck, CW hasn't even bothered to move their support forums to a normal server, we can't read them or ask for help?

I recognize the tone of the chat logs, I have dealt with people like this in the past in web-related deals. They pump up the volume and try to come off as some kind of e-commerce giant when in reality it's all smoke and mirrors, they are better described as a fly-by-night operation. Yep, the chat logs show what direction this is headed in.

-----chat log July 16---
* @CEO-Shawn has recently had 2 of his customers trying to personally track him down in person and cause me physical harm. I have had telephone threats against me, my properties, my family. I will not be back in here this weekend to discuss any further information on this matter until I have other issues resolved. ETA for BW resolution is still Monday. This entire situation is ridiculous at this point - these issues are out
<Bob0_o|TryingToDoStuff> Wow, thats harsh
* @CEO-Shawn Some people have developed a lynch-mob mentality and I will not put up with this. I am directing all vulgar/harassing comments/customers to my attorneys for handling, I will not discuss these matters with people who choose not to be civil. REPEAT questions will not be answered, please see the chat logs. While I want to resolve the issues at hand, move forward, I will not do so when my physical self is being put
<Bob0_o|TryingToDoStuff> People go after you because you are personally involved with your company, which is respectable. Some people are whack
<+heat23_CWV> shawn your message was cut off... "these issues are out"
<whfirewalker> Shawn if you would communicate before the problem got this way people would not get so Pi**ed off
* @CEO-Shawn Our attorneys are in this chat room 24/7 since Thursday night and are monitoring all customers, all IP's, all comments, threats, etc. People need to realize how ridiculous this situation is getting, and my attorneys will communicate directly with people who harass & threaten.
--------------------------------------------


Yeah, right, like anyone could afford to pay an attorney to monitor a chat room :rolleyes:

I see he has said that while he is being stalked by outraged cybergeeks he will not "resolve the issues at hand, move forward". That is so laughable!! Soon it will be our fault and he will end with "I tried but you people forced me to leave the hosting business". Lol!

Originally posted by Subsim
Soon it will be our fault and he will end with "I tried but you people forced me to leave the hosting business". Lol!
Yes, that's exactly how it sounds sometimes!

As for you, swish, if this has been your only trouble with Cyberwings, even if you were lucky enough to be on a server that was not affected by any outage (were there actually any of those?), you obviously don't expect much in the way of support or customer service. As for the flaming, I've been in the chat room twice: The first time because my site had been down for hours and I was getting no response by other means, so I hoped I could get a response in the chat room. I asked for an update or information on what was going on and where the vaunted service ("not like those OTHER hosting companies") was. In response, I got a few people very forcefully telling me to give them a break, that they were working hard, etc. The second time was the other day, and I didn't stick around long enough to let anyone start yelling at me. But as for acting childish, I'm certainly not the one calling quite a few fellow customers liars and rumor mongers or the one who seems to enjoy exclamatory punctuation...

Additionally, they are NOT working on this problem in a timely fashion, because it has been going on for days. Even if their backup lines didn't kick in automatically for some reason, shouldn't they have at least gone and manually switched over?

Wonder how many customers of his are now backing up their databases and files every hour just in case Shawn vanishes from the hosting biz tomorrow. That's gotta suck!

I actually do expect alot from customer service...As for tech support, I don't really need it..I know whats wrong, fill out a help desk, it gets fixed and off we go! I have only used the help desk for account upgrades I purchased..But they have always been handled very quickly!

mrtorrent: I have to say, that if you must have come into the chat room with an attitude problem to get treated the way you did! ANd if a customer was stating lies, then he should be called a liar! How are they not handling it in a timely manner!!?? It was over a holiday this stuff happenned..take that into consideration....

I personally think, people just always want and always have to have something to complain about...Too many peole will never be happy no matter what..and that is sad!

So far, all I have seen is little nit picking statements....

Every business runs into problems sooner or later...Internet companies run into problems all the time.... I have hosted with a ton of places and have had the same problems everywhere sooner or later... But so far CW is ahead of the others I have hosted with..cause it has been 1 time..not multiple.

xela, that's the biggest problem we face. As I said, I can't access the FTP or phpmyadmin to download and backup my files. :(

And swish, sometime, yes sometimes, people complain because of good reason. Having my site remndered inert and down for 7 days (and counting) is reason enough to complain to me.

Subsim: Sorry about your awful experience with CW. Hope you backup your files successfully sooner or later.

Originally posted by Subsim
xela, that's the biggest problem we face. As I said, I can't access the FTP or phpmyadmin to download and backup my files. :(

And swish, sometime, yes sometimes, people complain because of good reason. Having my site remndered inert and down for 7 days (and counting) is reason enough to complain to me.
Nothing wrong with complaining...I meant and was referring to the way most, I repeat Most (not all), handled it and did it. You have to be professional and polite, not act childish. Subsim, you seem to be polite on here, so I would assume you weren't one of the nasy people that came in. :-)

Hey, where are all the people who swore up and down they are the greatest and all other hosts were just jealous and they were getting the best support ever ...and blah, blah, blah...Same story, different tune - great low priced host comes in, then has problems, then eventually fades away.. Are these customers the same people that put their hand on the stove once a week to remind themselves that hot=hurt???? Must love getting burned.

Originally posted by swish

Nothing wrong with complaining...I meant and was referring to the way most, I repeat Most (not all), handled it and did it. You have to be professional and polite, not act childish. Subsim, you seem to be polite on here, so I would assume you weren't one of the nasy people that came in. :-)

How is someone suppose to act in this situation then?

Bow down and kiss their feet?

In order to get some attention and get something worked out?

To me, I don't think so, the client is ok for him to get mad, etc, but to a certain limit and/or point and the company admin/staff/exec should take care of such situation as best as possible, to ease down these situations, as I have heard, someone comes saying bad stuff about in Cyberwings chat, all of the sudden you get banned and booted.

Is that how you suppose to handle a situation?

These people even if they paid $.01 they should get what was promised, with same professionalism, and courtesy. And the client has every right to share his opinions about the company, but it is just not right to kiss up to them to see if they are going to attempt to fix or do anything.

I want to chime in here as well, not to contribute to any bashing but to share my own well documented experiences.

Like everyone else, I was wary of the promises at such amazing rates but got transcript promises from Shawn directly telling me he would stand by the claims and refund all my money if they fell through. I then asked the simple question of where Cyberwings was filed as a company. .Then the **** hit the fan. (http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=40&threadid=802553&STARTPAGE=4)

I called the state of Maine and they told me all corporations, sole proprietorships or not must be filed with the state and that there was no record of any Cyberwings beyond a few expired name reservations. When I just asked Shawn to clarify what the situation was he retorted by calling my questioning "pathetic" and "petty."

Cyberwings has since then filed as a corporation with the state of Maine. Nit picking like you allege, Swish? Perhaps all of the off balance sheet accounting Enron and Worldcom did was nit picking as well. But not when it is with my money!

1 week downtime is a joke.

I'm going to ask for a $20 refund; I don't care if it's possibly the super-bargain of the year being only 1/10th the cost of comparable services at other places.

CW is going to go UNDER very SOON!

I have the distinct feeling they are barely paying lightspeed, their only ISP in the Maine DC. (THere is no reason an ISP would shut down a customer who is paying good money...)

Originally posted by webhappy
(THere is no reason an ISP would shut down a customer who is paying good money...)

I don't know much about the case at hand here, but I can say that ISP's don't always shut off providers for non-payment. I've known several hosts that have had their plugs pulled for either content or their customers sending spam. That is not to say that your assessment of this particular situation isn't right on the money. It may well be. But just for the record, ISP's do sometimes cut off customers that pay good money.

Originally posted by taoofbean
I want to chime in here as well, not to contribute to any bashing but to share my own well documented experiences.

Like everyone else, I was wary of the promises at such amazing rates but got transcript promises from Shawn directly telling me he would stand by the claims and refund all my money if they fell through. I then asked the simple question of where Cyberwings was filed as a company. .Then the **** hit the fan. (http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=40&threadid=802553&STARTPAGE=4)

I called the state of Maine and they told me all corporations, sole proprietorships or not must be filed with the state and that there was no record of any Cyberwings beyond a few expired name reservations. When I just asked Shawn to clarify what the situation was he retorted by calling my questioning "pathetic" and "petty."

Cyberwings has since then filed as a corporation with the state of Maine. Nit picking like you allege, Swish? Perhaps all of the off balance sheet accounting Enron and Worldcom did was nit picking as well. But not when it is with my money!

DO a little more research, CW has been for alot longer then that..It shows a date of last year... This had been covered in Chat..check the logs on their page.

Just because one registers a domain named hostingcompany.com several years ago does not make them an actual corprate entity. Swish I am very ssupicious of your blind allegiance or just blanket ignorance. Cyberwings just had their one year anniversary but where are teh papers that show this company (sole proprietor or not) was filed a year ago. Any business student knows it takes more than a domain name to be credible. Just because he has been hosting people since 1997 doesn't mean it was legal. I did check the chat logs, and Shawn's only response is to "call the state of Maine", and to kick anyone from the chatroom who asks the question.

Since you are such a staunch supporter swish, perhaps you could explain where information lies that explains where magic records exist that contradict my research. Shawn claimed the records existed and he would post them, where is the chat log that shows these thus far ficticious claims. You claim it has been explained but provide no details. The only thing explained is Shawn's continued statement that we have been around and we are not going anywhere.

You would have a hard time right now backing up your staunch support because as of Monday 12 est, there is no site found at cyberwings.com.

Man, this is getting WORSE!

Down. PERIOD. As of 9:50 AM PST on Mon, June 8.


Now my $20 could be gone?

Originally posted by lightnin


I don't know much about the case at hand here, but I can say that ISP's don't always shut off providers for non-payment. I've known several hosts that have had their plugs pulled for either content or their customers sending spam. That is not to say that your assessment of this particular situation isn't right on the money. It may well be. But just for the record, ISP's do sometimes cut off customers that pay good money.

I don't know. I was reading PC World, and they have an article about spammers, and some spammers claim to pay enough that the ISP looks the other way...

Anyways, I was looking at Anandtech.com forums, and it looks like LS was unhappy with CW's decision to move DC's to VA.

Who knows what is really going on now...

Oh man, these chat logs are hilarious. On CWstatus.com

For those of you who don't know, the only hope of getting any support the last 2 weeks was through IRC chat. I cannot believe these ultimatum statements coming from the CEO. If I don't feel loved by the community then I will stop hemorrahing cash into this poorly run business.

> Willow: Sure, I understand that, but people also need
to understand that I do not run CW for profit, in fact, I've lost money on this business, so without COMMUNITY SUPPORT & RALLYING behind us, I'm going to feel very disappointed investing ANOTHER $100,000 into this business. I'll do it, either way, but if I don't have the community support & involvement, I'm going to be VERY disappointed. I've already pumped $144,000 in
<05CEO-Shawn> ------ I'll do it, either way, but if I don't have
the community support & involvement, I'm going to be VERY disappointed. I've already pumped $144,000 into this business in 12 months.
* SnuggleB_CWI considers that $144,000 well spent.
<05Willowdream> i understand that shawn....trust me i do...I AM STILL HERE...if that is any proof to you of my support..
<05CEO-Shawn> Snuggle - until it comes out of your own pocket :) CW has not brought in that much, let's just say that.
<05SnuggleB_CWI> Same here. :)
* KGIII_CWV looked and has the logs of kilo's comments
<05Willowdream> but i just thought that it should be well noted that right about now....actions speak far louder than words..and quite a few of your loyal customers are waiting for action instead of more words
<05CEO-Shawn> I love my business, I love the community, but unless I see some major community-wide support here, I'll just bring Maine back online and let the rest work itself out. Regardless, future prices will be going UP and people will be paying more premium prices for our services."

CEO-Shawn: Talks with LS are not going well, services are not
active at this moment. I may be flying to Maine immediately to pickup our servers and plug them back in in Virginia tonight. We already have Class C's in Virginia ready to roll. Not sure yet how things will turn out, but we are all HOT under the collars today.

This quote from "NoCyberwings" caught my eye...

try out a better company like Eryxma or Affordable Host or one of the other ones that truly care about their customers more than the customers' money.

It reminded me of some a questionable character a while back prowling the cyberwings forums to trash cyberwings and promote a hosting company....Eryxma. Hmmmmm......something smells here......more than just cyberwings troubles!!!

Talk is cheap!

Downtime is EXPENSIVE!

irc.webchat.org

#cwtalk

In other words, Shawn states that if he doesn't get the community support he wants, despite the fact that his customers are complaining of too much downtime, he will be "dissapointed" and leave the business? Isn't that like blackmail, sorta?

Quoted from Yahoo! group CW_talk,

"Ok, I have remained silent up to now, but this guy is ridiculous! I
am an employee of Lightship aand I am here to tell you all that Shawn
has not spoken to any one @LS since Friday. furthermore, his account
is in arrears in excess of $30k. Also, his access to the Collocation
space where the servers are has been taken away untill his account
has been brought up to date. So those servers are not going anywhere
for a while..."

See for yourself at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CW_Talk/

I could of told you guys this forever. It never was LS's fault. Its always been shawn, and he uses LS to get people off his back.

It's worth the paper it's printed on.

Right now I am patting myself on the back. I was with Cyberwings since they started offering reseller accounts. Shawn seemed like an amiable fellow and I like helping people out who are trying something new or starting. Many people have done the same for me ...

Anyway, things with Cyberwings were absolutley great for the first few months. I did notice an increase in the amount of specials that were offered and I even availed myself of one of them.

My previous posts on this forum have shown that I did reccomend Cyberwings, but for people without mission critical needs.

What really rattled me was the downtime experienced about a month ago when the plesk servers they had at Rack Shack (I think that's where they were) mysteriously went down on a Friday.

Having another reseller account through someone at Rack Shack, I knew it wasn't a DC or connectivity issue as it only affected Cyberwings servers. Add to that the fact that Cyberwings had to talk to Customer Service and not technical support and I became nervous.

The information from Cyberwings wasn't worth anything. Lots of "we need to keep this confidential" "you'll hear from our lawyers on this" and other such non-sense. Some people were claiming that Cyberwings didn't pay their Rack Shack bill, but no one ever confirmed this.

When the servers came back online the next day it wasn't soon thereafter that Cyberwings held an online IRC sale. Prices were amazingly low and you had to pay now. Again, I was puzzled by this as more and more people were sending in money for lifetime hosting, unreal amounts of bandwidth and storage, etc.

I decided to look into another reseller account and settled on Voxtreme. I did have one site on Cyberwings that generates revenue and that was the account I wanted to move over.

Knowing what a pain it is to move 15 sites I still made the decision to move. I wrote a message to Shawn letting him know why, etc. Never heard back, but that was ok. I knew he was extremely busy recovering from the outage.

A month passes, I get busy with work and the sites and don't check the forum. I get an email letting me know that someone has responded to a message I left about Cyberwings. It's an old message, so I look and learn of the current issues.

My first reaction was joy ... joy that I was able to move my domains off. My second reaction was darn. Lots, I mean lots, of people host with Cyberwings due to the price and I know the frustration they are going through.

Now, I read the latest messages about their upstream provider and how some people are saying that Cyberwings is in arears. It makes you think that something might be there.

Hopefully people will learn from this when their attempting to make a hosting decision.

Originally posted by Dourque
This quote from "NoCyberwings" caught my eye...



It reminded me of some a questionable character a while back prowling the cyberwings forums to trash cyberwings and promote a hosting company....Eryxma. Hmmmmm......something smells here......more than just cyberwings troubles!!!

Excuse me?

Find me those post please, now we wouldn't never do something like that.

There is one thing I remember, on how I came to hear about Cyberwings.

There was a client of ours who wanted a refund from you guys and you declined it, and well he wanted me to come in, since Shiekron didn't want to, and ask you guys to give him at least some of his money back because no money was refunded, and no service.

So I just came in to the chat room one time, and I didn't expect our client to be in there, was promoting us in there, and still asking for a refund. I didn't say anything just watched, and I just grew tired of the crap I heard in the chat, just left.

But I am sure that none of our staff members will go bothering any other hosting company like so, so please, stop.

I am a cyberwings customer. I have been for several months and never had a hitch with my website until the past few days. Basically, we(customers AND cyberwings) got screwed. Dunno who's fault it was, but Shawn IS commited to fixing things. He is not running away with the $. He is setting up a new data center with multi-homed bandwidth and is moving the servers ASAP. You can read www.cwstatus.com (official site) for more info about the problems.

Yes it is a nightmare, but NO, CW is not going anywhere. BTW, Shawn *owns* his data centers, the whole building. he's not some fly-by-night rent a rack guy. I dont like the thread starter's post because it ONLY mentioned negative comments.

OF COURSE people are going to be pissed off. Everyone is. But there are tons more users supporting CW than bashing. join irc.webchat.org #cyberwings for more info or just to hang out.

-Eric

eric, why do you even believe what shawn says? HE told you guys that he had dual oc48's in his DC, then he tells you he has 3 redundant connections, such as level3, verizon, and lightship. But then he has all this downtime and wants to blame it on LightShip? If it was really a LS problem, dont you think he would talk to LS about it, and in the meantime his "redundant connections" would kick in? I have yet to see a level3 or verizon connection kick in. I therefore have a hard time believing that he owns a data center, or that he ever will. My thoughts (That come from a very good source) are that the MAINE datacenter is rented out to Shawn by LightShip. I can almost bet money on this, and if you want to doubt me, then just wait and see how things go, because they wont change. Once a liar always a liar.

Originally posted by eric650
Dunno who's fault it was, but Shawn IS commited to fixing things. He is not running away with the $. He is setting up a new data center with multi-homed bandwidth and is moving the servers ASAP. You can read www.cwstatus.com (official site) for more info about the problems.

Yes it is a nightmare, but NO, CW is not going anywhere. BTW, Shawn *owns* his data centers, the whole building. he's not some fly-by-night rent a rack guy. I dont like the thread starter's post because it ONLY mentioned negative comments.

-Eric

How do you know this? Just because you read it on a single sheet webpage from some busted-ass hosting company? We'll see, but I am not holding my breath.

Originally posted by JaysonH
My thoughts (That come from a very good source) are that the MAINE datacenter is rented out to Shawn by LightShip. I can almost bet money on this, and if you want to doubt me, then just wait and see how things go, because they wont change.

I certainly wish Lightship would make an official statement, pull the plug, end all this nonsense. Scams like this perpetuate because the cons are not exposed. Doesn't Lightship know that Shawn has many people thinking they're the scam? They need to make some statements to defend their own reputation.

In a pyramid scheme, early investors get paid from the funds of later investors. It works fine for a while, then the whole thing collapses.

Some statements are so outrageous, we know them to be false immediately, some sound so true we know them to be so.

Any reasonable person reviewing the statements in this thread will know where the truth lies.

But I am sure that none of our staff members will go bothering any other hosting company like so, so please, stop.

Hostinspect, I did not say it was an Eryxma employee. However, I do have screenshots of the posts from the CW forums. I'll have to send them to you once I get home as I don't have access to them here at work.

Cyberwings Update:

Cyberwings Latest

Update: the move to the new DC in Virginia will be going ahead ASAP. It is worth reading the following information before asking questions in the channel. ALL servers in the Maine DC will be moving with an estimate dwntime period for this move is 2-5 days.

Main points to note

<CEO-Shawn> IF YOU BEAR WITH US so we can get INTO VIRGINIA, your rates will not go up if you are a CURRENT CUSTOMER - only future ones. And I FULLY INTEND on giving out a WHOLE BUNCH of free services when we move.
<CEO-Shawn> IP's will be ready by Wednesday as well - at the latest. (IPs are to be posted in chart format on cwstatus.com)
Rackshack servers are not moving at present (see announcement below for more details)
CEO-Shawn WHILE I WOULD LOVE to take questions, I have to get on the road and start making some transitionary moves with these issues at hand. PLEASE understand that even while I am away, I am working on these issues and everything WILL be resolved & better than ever when I am done.
Shawn's full announcement:

[21:24] <CEO-Shawn> Cyberwings would like to take the next step in hosting services by creating a Premier Cyberwings Data Center (PCDC) in Virginia, USA. Some people would say that we should have started out by creating this PCDC which can house hundreds of servers, have 10-14 redundant carriers in the same building, etc., however, when Cyberwings was first started, it was not known as to whether we would be this successful in our goal to create the World's largest and friendliest hosting community. The costs of building such a Data Center are significant enough to ward off any small business from doing it initially, but as we have grown, it is becoming a necessity. Obviously, our success has surpassed even my wildest goals in the first year. No company founder can predict that kind of growth, especially in a market where "Dot Coms" were supposed to be "Dot Bombs" and "old news." The people that have been with us from the beginning know that I have always been a very active part of our company. I have made myself available, night and day, for the past year, to help customers, assist with issues, etc. With the enormous growth we have experienced, there just was not enough of me to go around. We brought on 7 additional staff to assist, but still, people really wanted to deal more with me since I had been the person they dealt with for the longest time directly. While I still try to spend a good amount of time answering people's questions, interacting with our customer base, I cannot spend as much time as I used to. The staff we have on board are very well qualified to assist, however, and I hope everyone out there will rely on them for a lot of the basic questions that most anyone in our company should be able to answer.

Everyone has been asking me what my goals are for the future for Cyberwings. In the past, I will admit, I have not been very good at documenting my thoughts, my goals and my dreams when it comes to Cyberwings, but I wanted to do that now, so that people can see just how much thought & consideration I have put into this company and how much dedication I have to seeing it succeed. Here is my list of goals I have put together, and would like to get everyone's support on:

1) Develop the PCDC in Virginia to house dedicated, colocated & web hosting servers. The PCDC will have 1 primary data carrier and 3 redundant "On-A-Usage-Basis" data carriers.

2) Increase our pricing slightly (yet enough) to generating enough profit (instead of breaking even) to expand our PCDC even further in the future. Implement yearly & monthly hosting options with the appropriate price breaks in place for annual pricing, yet offering the flexibility of monthly hosting for those who choose that option - still at a very reasonable cost.

3) Add 3 additional staff within the first month of the PCDC in such roles as: 2 Reseller Liaison personnel and 1 additional support staff. I will continue to not draw an income from the company, and only act as the President & CEO directing the company towards future goals. My reward from this business is building the community, watching it grow and flourish. That, to me, is far greater a reward than any financial gain I could possibly achieve.

4) Continue to offer three levels of web hosting - Individual, AYW & Reseller.

5) Expand into Colocation & Dedicated Servers (Rackmountable, Towers, etc.) within the first month of the PCDC being operational.

6) Introduce ModernBill w/ Authorize.net (or possibly directly with our Merchant Accounts) Integration to our web hosting community so that all billing functions can be automated within a simple control panel. This would provide a simple, trackable customer management solution for our personnel and also for each customer to be able to login to view their invoices, upcoming billing dates, contact billing personnel, etc.

7) Introduce Toll-Free Premium & Toll-Number Premium Support packages so that resellers & customers alike can obtain telephone support from our staff. While we do not wish to provide 24/7 Toll-Free Telephone Support as a free service (it would be a cost-per-call or per minute basis or just a regular TOLL number you would dial), offering some type of telephone support in the future is a goal.

8) Within 3 months of the PCDC being operational, formulate a migration plan to move the servers from RackShack to the PCDC in order to provide faster support, more direct control over the servers and more expansion capabilities for these customers.

These are just a sample list of the goals I have in mind for Cyberwings over the next year as things really start to take off.


As we have grown, and piece-mealed our growth together by adding space, developing our first data center, etc. we have noticed two things:
The first thing that we have noticed is that we cannot seem to expand fast enough to keep up with our most recent volume of sales. Instead of adding space and data centers as we go, let's build the Premier Cyberwings Data Center with enough capacity to expand into it for at least 3-4 years. The second thing that we have noticed is that we have a very, very loyal customer base who very much wants to see Cyberwings succeed. Your support in the past has been critical to allowing us to expand as much as we have. In the future, as we embark on this new project, your support, both in faith in the company and financially, will be critical to our success. I have no intention on turning my back on a project, the World's largest & friendliest hosting community, that has come so far in a very short 12 months. We appreciate you, and we hope you appreciate us and our services as well.

With your support and my committment to this company, Cyberwings can become what no other hosting company has ever achieved - a true community, not just a "commercial power house." Being a commerical power house has definite advantages - but being a corporate commercial power house with a huge level of community involvement is taking it to a whole new level. We want this. You want this. Let's do it.


How else can you assist
Very simple. Just support us in our goals. Please realize that with such a major, drastic transition in our business, we will all be a little on edge while we make these changes.
I will gladly grand 2CheckOut or PayPal refunds to anyone who wishes to leave our services, however, I fully intend to give ALL Resellers, AYW & Individual accounts some FREE services after we get settled into the PCDC in order to give you time to get your businesses & sites back to a functional mode. Patience with me and with our staff will greatly assist us. Consider this a blessing in disguise in many ways - CW being given the opportunity to take a major step back, revamp our business processes, put the proper resources in the right places, and take another bold, bigger shot at this community. We are not exactly a small community at this point, so this will effect a lot of people. I'm right here in the trenches with the rest of our crew working on the issues.

As for the naysayers out there, I'm ignoring you. If I had listened to every naysayer and negative comment out there on the Internet about Cyberwings and our processes, our business plans, etc. in the past then we never would have made it this far.

All I want, all I need, is 10 minutes to dump my database :)

Originally posted by squawkBOX
Cyberwings Update:

As for the naysayers out there, I'm ignoring you. If I had listened to every naysayer and negative comment out there on the Internet about Cyberwings and our processes, our business plans, etc. in the past then we never would have made it this far.


Just how far is that ?? Hey the results are on the board , and CW's look very very poor . Have a nice day .:confused:

Update - http://www.cwstatus.com

Lmao, they already have their brand spanking new "flagship" datacenter up? That's record time, considering he just announced his determination and decision to do so about two days ago. Positively hilarious..

I love it, we can request a refund via the help desk, except the helpdesk is kind of offline, along with all other Cyberwings- hosted sites. I've sent tomd@2checkout.com an e-mail (couldn't find any contact info for consumers on 2checkout.com), anything else I should do?


* CEO-Shawn - Please remember that I have another option - I can easily refund every customer in 13 months and leave the business, and still be just fine. I'm doing this as a SERVICE, NOT a money maker, so I am putting up with an EXTREMELY HIGH level of frustration "as a service".

Hey I live in VA - I may have to stop by and see if this 'flagship DC' is all that its cracked up to be :rolleyes:.
If anyone finds out the address, please pm me.

The new data center location has not been released, I am not sure why.

Shawn just today said that he got biometrically scanned for access at the datacenter. That kills me.

I got my refund today by being very polite and demanding it that moment. Shawn refunded my money instantly in a PM. Amazing after 2 weeks of trying it came down to that.

Good Luck, I am done

Cyberwings is done, cooked.... servers are all down.

The servers wont be moved because they are probably is some co-location lockup waiting for him to pay the bandwidth bill.

If that idiot SW managed to get his servers out of hock it would be a miracle.

I don't know if that's true (although it appears reasonable to assume). I spoke to a tech at Lightship today, he said that there is no issue with their end, it must be something with the CW equipment. I don't know how accurate that is, for what it's worth.

I will say that Shawn is claiming that they will "will post a list of OLD IP's and NEW IP's on cwstatus.com within 24 hours."

Well, if this is a scam it is past the run with the money stage, it appears that CW is not quite dead yet :) Of course, that's just a hunch (and a prayer!).




THE LATEST NEWS:



Shawn came into chat room approximately 2:45pm EDT with the following announcement:



New DC in Virginia is complete. Lines will be activated today, I've already had my hand-scanned for access to the building (BioMetrix Security System). Servers will be heading in shortly. No ETA when the actual "move" will happen, but it will. 4 New Class C's are being assigned today, will post a list of OLD IP's and NEW IP's on cwstatus.com within 24 hours.

Dual T3's from AT&T & Sprint are in activation on a usage basis only as secondary providers. 100MBit Line from Cogent is activate and lit as of right now.

Virginia DC - 155,000 sqft, Dual T3's from AT&T & Sprint. Primary 100MBit Line from Cogent. 5 Class C's readily available (currently only using 2 1/2).



EVERYONE will get new IP's. ANYONE that has a 216.204.XXX.XXX IP will get new IP's from us.

If you are using ns1-ns25.groupns.com we will take care of those DNS changes automatically.



Q. If everything is ready to go in Virginia, when are the actual Maine server moving?

A. <CEO-Shawn> not sure as of yet.

CEO-Shawn has already poured $121,000 into CW in 12 months. I'm going to put another $100,000 into our Re-Launch and make this what we should have been in the first place.

CEO-Shawn - 600MB of transfer per HOUR CURRENTLY compared to 6,000MB per hour on our new lines at full capacity.

CEO-Shawn - For people who wish to have an EXAMPLE of how fast our new services will be, go to:

And then again, who knows. This is now floating around:

Thank you for your written correspondence regarding Cyberwing
Communications, your internet service provider.

We would request that you contact them directly in the future
regarding service, support and business related issues.

Lightship acknowledges your issues and we regret to inform you that
we have terminated our service and relationship with Cyberwing
Communications.

Lightship Telecom continues to be confident in its own ability to
provide high quality and reliable internet access, web-hosting and
co-location services to business customers throughout New England.
We have many satisfied customers to whom we provide services on a
direct and wholesale basis.

Additionally, we believe that we have worked in good faith, as with
all of our customers, to assist Cyberwing in resolving technical
issues.

We sincerely regret any inconvenience this has caused you or your
business.

Please contact Lightship Telecom should you require further
assistance.

Sincerely,

Lightship Telecom
877-548-7447
www.lightship.net

I am a current cyberwings customer. I have only been there since May 5, 2002. I didn't pay $4.00 for a year or something like that. I paid $155.00 for a year for one account.

I've been offline the past 10 days due to moving into my new house. I had just finished moving and setting up my domain at cyberwings after my last host had HD failure. I have a Business site there, not some personal homepage.

I have files in MySQL database that I need in order to restore my business site on another host. Is there anyway to contact LS to get my files from the server?

I can't even FTP into my domains! I tried to access the cyberwings.com site and can't even get it to load. I just want some information.

Thanks in advance!
Regards,
Deborah

Well, that copy above of the email from LS is basically saying they won't (or can't) help out.

I've been in exactly the same situation you are in right now and it is not a nice place to be. The only thing you can do is wait for Cyberwings to get back online, then immediately grab a dump of your database.

What you do from there is up to you. Sorry to see this happen to anyone. It's a really lousy position to be in.

Yeah, just give me a 30 minute window and swoosh! all my files will be on a reliable host.

At this point I am not sure what to believe. I own a very popular submission service and web tools service. It's getting hard to keep telling clients that I have no idea what's going on with the server from cyberwings because I can't even email support because helpdesk is offline too.

I would like to give Shawn the benefit of the doubt. He's a nice enough guy and really easy to communicate with.

I can hold out for just a few more days, my business has been down now for almost 2 weeks! If it isn't up fairly soon, as soon as it is, I will have no other choice than to relocate to another server. It's business, it's not personal. Personally I have nothing against Shawn. I just wish though, that he'd have taken the time to at least email his client base with an explanation of the impending circumstances to head off wide spread panic and pandemonium.

Relocate now if you want to continue your business.

Jeez, your awful patient. I'd a been outta there a whole lot sooner than that.

Originally posted by savvy1
At this point I am not sure what to believe. I own a very popular submission service and web tools service. It's getting hard to keep telling clients that I have no idea what's going on with the server from cyberwings because I can't even email support because helpdesk is offline too.

I would like to give Shawn the benefit of the doubt. He's a nice enough guy and really easy to communicate with.

I can hold out for just a few more days, my business has been down now for almost 2 weeks! If it isn't up fairly soon, as soon as it is, I will have no other choice than to relocate to another server. It's business, it's not personal. Personally I have nothing against Shawn. I just wish though, that he'd have taken the time to at least email his client base with an explanation of the impending circumstances to head off wide spread panic and pandemonium.

It's not that I am "awfully patient". I was offline for nearly 10 days due to moving into a new house. Upon reestablishing my Internet service, I was able to read about a ton of emails from clients who were pi$$ed at not being able to access the member areas of my sites.

Checking in with my server monitor service, I discovered that the very same day I went offline because of moving, my server also decided to take a rest as well. I have been back online only 4 days now so that's why I am trying desperately to find out what the hell is going on with all of this.

Am I mad? Of course! If he [Shawn White] doesn't get things up and running as promised by tomorrow (from what I've been told) then I will promptly demand a refund and meanwhile seek out reliable well established and verifiable hosting elsewhere.

I first, unfortunately, need to get my MySQL database information from all 7 databases as they hold all of the clients current information. Until the servers are up, I am even helpless to do that much. I have to wait, whether I choose to or not.

From all outward appearances, there is truth in what Shawn stated. There is an NOC located in Ashburn, Virginia, that's owned and operated by WorldCom and they use a biometric security system! They co-locate servers for many hosting companies. I am hoping that this will all be resolved fairly soon. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

Just FYI, the e-mail that subsim posted was sent to me by Lightship at ~ 6pm EDT yesterday in response to my e-mail inquiry to info@lightship.net. I posted it on the AnandTech forums and forwarded it to a few people that requested it, but forgot to post it here, sorry.

wow this stinks...i've got my personal site with them and ya it was cheap at $7.50 a year and $9 sumthing for my domain name and so far so good but now that they are down with no warning and no prior explanation i'll probably be relocating.:(
Tho my site isn't down?. http://www.gardenofhearts.com
:confused:

Lexi -- looks like your site is on the plesk servers that Cyberwings has at Rackshack. If you look at posts in the earlier thread you'll notice that there wer mysterious issues with their Rack Shack servers that weren't technical in nature.

You are one of the lucky ones I think.

I haven't heard any updates on how the older accounts on those boxes will be handled.

You are still online because you're a little luckier and located on the RackShack server in Texas :D


:angry: hehe someone beat me by a millisecond :bawling:

There's an update at cwstatus.com and things look promising. Will wait and see. I was sent this comment by LightShip today via email in response to email I had sent them last night:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Subj: RE: Contact Us Form Results
Date: 7/10/02 10:23:09 AM Central Daylight Time
From: Info@lightship.net (Lightship: Info)

Good morning, Deborah. To answer your questions: Cyberwing's servers are physically located in the Lightship Data Center in the state of Maine, however those servers are the property of Cyberwings. As such, please contact Cyberwing to access files residing on those servers.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I am hosted on one of the PLESK servers, but in Maine. My site is down, down, down.

http://announce.esubmit-it.com
http://arachnid.esubmit-it.com

From the looks of things, Shawn is trying to get these issues solved. I am hoping for the best.

Most recent From
http//:www.cwstatus.com
I'm glad I Don't have any Miss. Crit. Sites Here But Maybe everything will work out OK.
Also There is a link to an active chat room on this site.

I'm not pro or con just trying to help get the right info. out

JFWS

CEO-Shawn has the new Class C's for our new data center, lines are active, things are well. We intend to be fully online in Virginia by Saturday (shooting for Saturday, but.... by the end of the weekend).. IP's will be posted by tonight, tentatively right now. I just need to confirm which IP Blocks we're going to use first, etc. We have 1,024 IP's ready (4x256 - 256 addresses in a class C block)

CEO-Shawn is hoping for everything to be at least ACCESSIBLE via FTP, etc. on Saturday - DNS propagation may take a bit longer.

CEO-Shawn: EVERYONE will be much happier with 100Mbit lines and Dual T3 backup lines - much faster. Instead of being able to transfer 600mb per hour on our Maine DC, we can tranfer 6,000MB per hour in our Virginia DC.
Current content from Maine will move to Virginia as well, yes.

I'm glad I Don't have any Miss. Crit. Sites Here But Maybe everything will work out OK.


I sort of have my doubts. I don't think that they're a pyramid scam like someone speculated earlier, but I get the impression that they're making it up as they go along and they don't have any kind of a well thought out business plan or strategy.

A few months ago I got one of their accounts, just for the hell of it. I never had time to do anything with it. But I was on their mailing list and after the first few emails I could tell that they had no direction and were just all over the place.

Even if they manage to resore an old backup on some new servers, how long until thier new provider shuts them off for non-payment again and it starts all over?

How long until they run out of suckers willing to let them run up huge bills without paying?

I'm curious about what happens to the building that housed the data center in Maine?

Ouote:
"how long until thier new provider shuts them off for non-payment again and it starts all over? "

How do you know that this is the issue.
Please post some Proof.

JFWS

The e-mail above that states Lightship still has thier servers is proof enough.

If they can pay the bill, why dont they go get the servers?

The email in question above was sent to me in response to a query I made to LightShip. They did not say that the servers were being withheld, confiscated, held in leu of payment, or any other indicator that suggests that Cyberwings does not have access to the servers. You are reading information into the statements that is NOT there.

Obviously, if LightShip was to keep possession of the servers they would have given me specific information as to how to retrieve my business data from my mysql databases, as such I no longer have access to the IP to do so.

Originally posted by savvy1
They did not say that the servers were being withheld, confiscated, held in leu of payment, or any other indicator that suggests that Cyberwings does not have access to the servers. You are reading information into the statements that is NOT there.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CW_Talk/message/10

In the Yahoo! Group above, a person claiming to be Lightship employee made the following post,
"Ok, I have remained silent up to now, but this guy is ridiculous! I am an employee of Lightship aand I am here to tell you all that Shawn has not spoken to any one @LS since Friday. furthermore, his account is in arrears in excess of $30k. Also, his access to the Collocation space where the servers are has been taken away untill his account has been brought up to date. So those servers are not going anywhere for a while..."

Can't believe everything you read on the Internet. ;) But unfortunately, it seems a lot of people don't see how that applies to what comes from the mouth (fingers) of CEO-Shawn.

Cyberwing's servers are physically located in the Lightship Data Center in the state of Maine

Well, that answers one thing and exposes another lie: He did not actually build his own data center in Maine, nor is he building one in Virginia (now says he's leasing space in another DC). As a result of this, one can look at the rest of his claims and take them with the appropriate grain of salt - a really, really big one.

Cyberwings Update

CEO-Shawn has the new Class C's for our new data center, lines are active, things are well. We intend to be fully online in Virginia by Saturday (shooting for Saturday, but.... by the end of the weekend).. IP's will be posted here when available. I just need to confirm which IP Blocks we're going to use first, etc. We have 1,024 IP's ready (4x256 - 256 addresses in a class C block)

CEO-Shawn is hoping for everything to be at least ACCESSIBLE via FTP, etc. on Saturday - DNS propagation may take a bit longer.

CEO-Shawn: EVERYONE will be much happier with 100Mbit lines and Dual T3 backup lines - much faster. Instead of being able to transfer 600mb per hour on our Maine DC, we can tranfer 6,000MB per hour in our Virginia DC.
Current content from Maine will move to Virginia as well, yes.



CEO-Shawn will update the nsX.groupns.com IP's himself - so anyone using nsX.groupns.com won't have to worry about updating your reseller IP's right away - in fact, if you WANT, you can change ALL of your customers over to nsX.groupns.com and when we do the changes all of their sites will just work.



CEO-Shawn - Again, I hope everyone is happy with our progress we are making so far, please bear with us during these times, this WILL all work out. I just got off the phone, we will have our IP's posted online along with a MAP of OLD Ip's to NEW Ip's.



CEO-Shawn is leasing space from a data center in Northern Virginia - will not release who/where for privacy/confidentiality issues.




Cyberwings has been in this business for 13 months. Except for the past 1 month where services have been rocky, and 1 week where they have been OUT, we have been providing 100% of our services we sell, period. We're not a scam, nor a fraud, and I will not respond to accusations that we are. Our history proves otherwise, period. 1 month of icky times and 1 week of outages while we are trying to fix things, proves bad luck,



QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS BETWEEN CHAT ROOM PARTICIPANTS AND SHAWN WHITE:



Q. When you say content from Maine, are you moving boxes, or transferring data?

A. I'd prefer not to say just yet. Sensitive issues there.



Q. When the move will start and if we will get one last uptime before its cut off

A. Unfortunately, no.... but the DC in Virginia is live and I will personally be on site 24/7 until it's running.Everyone can honestly expect everything to stay down through Saturday while we do what we need to do.





Q. Shawn, can I take it that for reasons of sensitivity you'd rather not reply to a note in Yahoo Groups and Anandtech purporting to be from a LS employee? A lot of folks out there are talking about it.

A. I've seen that. I'd like to know who at LS because it's (A) False and (B) A Breach of Confidentiality regardless. They won't even put their names where their comments are, what cowards, because they know we'd be in the right. Proof is we're leaving LS, moving to bigger and better, and they don't like that.



Q. If we have both NS nameservers and our own nameserver (so 4 NS) on our accounts, will they work with the CW ones?

A. I'd recommend you had the NSX.GROUPNS.COm ones to your domain record - then they will automatically work when we move to the new DC.



Q. Are those of us with AYW plans going to need to do anything to have our sites active on the net again? Will me need to change the nameservers information with our registers?

A. No, most likely not.



Q. Will the 100Mbit lines and Dual T3 backup lines be for just cyberwings or is that shared?

A. Just for Cyberwings.





Q. When and how are backups done (paraphrased questions).

A. All new servers have dual hard drives in them and we will be doing DRIVE to DRIVE copies of all servers daily. Right now, plesk backup software then transferred off site. We will be doing DRIVE TO DRIVE COPIES in addition to PLESK backups & offsite transfer.



Q. What are the specs of the new servers.

A. Servers will be the same or far better than they ever were. Period. Our CURRENT specs are PIII1ghz on some boxes w/ 1GB of RAM and AMD TBird 1800 on some boxes with 1GB of RAM. So yes, same or better.

CEO-Shawn repeats - Lines are LIT at the New DC - Dual T3's from AT&T & Sprint, 100MBit Primary from Cogent, 4 new Class C's (1024 IP's) in place (4x256 - 256 addresses in a class C block)

Ok, so we realize that there is a problem for many of us. I have been unable to access ANY of 3 domains that I have hosted at cyberwings for over 24 hours. I can't even get to the cyberwings homepage....

I'm wanting to change my DNS entry so that at least one of my domains is pointed at Yahoo, because I'm actually still "hosted" by them as well, however the DNS is pointed at the nsX.groupns.com name servers. My problem is that I can't get to "cyberwingsdomains.com" to change my DNS.

Can anyone tell me how I can change my DNS entries without having to wait for Cyberwings to get their act together?

Jared
tweekir@yahoo.com

Yup:
http://www.secureserver.net/default.asp?prog_id=Cyberwing
works (godaddy registrars, which Cyberwings uses)
whilst Cyberwings is down.

D

Is Shi* like this that upsets me the most who the hell does
CEO-Shawn thinks he is. If I was in his position I will most definitely will not have that CEO before his name. Because he is a nobody, he is not a leader, he is just a piece of crap who tried to make a quick buck and thought that if he gave everything for nothing things will work out.

To me right now I see cyberwings as a congregation :stickout shaw is the pastor and all of his followers how can there be some customers that still believe anything that comes out from his mouth its just been plain stupid. Hosting company's do have problems but if they pay their bills ontime and they have the records set straight there is no reason that a company will have a month of troubles its just plain old crazy. Now I get a kick out of cyberwings congregation members who still praise the allmighty ceo-shawn that felt for cyberwings bs plans and prices they are just unrealistic not even a stablished company can provide such cheap prices but as we all say here on WHT you get what you pay for.

To hosting clients: Don't always go with the cheaper host do your home work if you see a provider that is offering prices way below the market price don't fall for it.

To hosting Providers: Take cyberwings as a good example of what can happend to you don't offer what you can't provide or you will end up just like cyberwings trying to bs your way out after the shi* hits the fan.

As you all can see cyberwings is getting better and better their site has been down for a couple of days now. We can all learn from this people...........

Disclaimer: This post does not apply to all clients neither to all hosting providers. We have some great providers out there. No purchase necessary to read this post.

Well it seems like CW doesnt like there customers talking about there downtime.

I was simply stating some facts about there downtime, and talking to a user about some posts on here and it seems that one of there interns, Comatoes_CWI, banned me..

Quite funny I believe, just shows the immaturity of the staff that he chooses.

I strongly advise everybody to stay away from them, he _is_ a scam.

I strongly advise everybody to stay away from them, he _is_ a scam

Not wishing to start a fight but I find that comment strange coming from you, Adam. I don't know CyberWings, so I can't comment on their business practises but I do know you were completely out of order trying to pose as a client of your hosting comapny in order to make a quick sale.

To anyone uninformed of Adam's business strategies, one of them included giving potential buyers for his business "Tier-2 Hosting" a contact link for one of his clients. Which would have been fine and dandy, had that contact not been Adam himself. Pretending to be a client, puts you in no position to comment on CyberWings at all :angry:

Originally posted by savvy1
The email in question above was sent to me in response to a query I made to LightShip. They did not say that the servers were being withheld, confiscated, held in leu of payment, or any other indicator that suggests that Cyberwings does not have access to the servers. You are reading information into the statements that is NOT there.

Obviously, if LightShip was to keep possession of the servers they would have given me specific information as to how to retrieve my business data from my mysql databases, as such I no longer have access to the IP to do so.

Read the words. "Physically located in the Lightship Data Center"..."data is property of Cyberwings." And we have seen the relationship terminated. And we have not heard that the servers are in Shawn's possession - you think he would not have been shouted from on high if he had the servers and data in his possession? Try to get a straight answer on this question...I dare you...Lightship might be sitting on the property but not allowed to get the data for you since you are not there customer...Shawn is...

http://216.239.51.100/search?q=cache:vT7AZzG4Le0C:www.cyberwings.com/hosting/individualhosting.html+cyberwings+i10&hl=en&ie=UTF-8


That's in a Google cache ...

Unbeliveable prices , unbeliveable deals .. must get me some of that :eek3:

But wait there's more :

With the bandwidth & overall quality of our new data center being a much higher quality than ever before, we will be offering colocation & dedicated servers much more than we ever did. Here is an example of the prelaunch deals we are having - you do not have to take advantage of any of these, but they are here for people who wish to: AMD T-Bird 1800 Dedicated w/ 1GB of RAM, 60GB HD, 5 IP's included - $400 one time fee.

E-mail prelaunch@cwstatus.com if you are interested in either of these prelaunch offers, we will respond with instructions on how to reserve your spot - but our primary focus will remain on getting everyone back online, then we'll process the orders from PreLaunch. I've had over 60 requests for prelaunch deals, so I wanted to respond to those.

:dunce:
==============================================

With everybody's sites down, about all I can say to that is:
"That's our Shawn!"

What better time to have a fire sale than during a fire.

I strongly advise everybody to stay away from them, he _is_ a scam.

I don't know what Adamtuttle is after with when he says those harsh, purely speculative words, knowing that he is not even a client of CW? CW is trying their best to fix everything despite the odds, and they're on their way to it. This kind of business will experience such an unlucky period. Now throwing such an unfair comment at this stage of their rebuilding is even more immature.

As a former customer, how is this unlucky?

Originally posted by fantasmic0
With the bandwidth & overall quality of our new data center being a much higher quality than ever before, we will be offering colocation & dedicated servers much more than we ever did. Here is an example of the prelaunch deals we are having - you do not have to take advantage of any of these, but they are here for people who wish to: AMD T-Bird 1800 Dedicated w/ 1GB of RAM, 60GB HD, 5 IP's included - $400 one time fee.

what you failed to quote was that there were only THREE of these on offer, and that they were leftovers from maine

It's not the fact that Adam is bashing other folks, without having any connections to them. What's worst is he behaves just as bad as them, he talks about them being a scam, when he is one himself. In short, he's being a hypocrite.

what you failed to quote was that there were only THREE of these on offer, and that they were leftovers from maine

"We only have 3 of these servers available (they are left over from our Maine DC and since we are going with rackmounts, we just want to put these mid-tower servers in place and let them run - they're great boxes.)"

Do they have the same meaning? :confused: I think not. :)

i would suspect that their Microsoft clipart they inserted into the support section would be a good pre-sign of this. :D

Well, CW told their customers they would be up by Monday (6 days ago), then Saturday (yesterday)... and we are still down and left in the dark. Buncha noise about datacenters, blocked IPs, and oh yeah, more sales :rolleyes:

Going to start doing Google searches for reader submitted hosting reviews now.

Does anyone know the latest status with Cyberwings regarding refunds? Is anyone getting legitimate refunds from CW or from their own credit card companies?

If you have submited a ticket to perl-desk at CW go look at its statis.
There is a message from CEO Shawn

My ticket # is over 2000 I haven't seen a penny as of yet.

JFWS

Originally posted by JFWS
My ticket # is over 2000 I haven't seen a penny as of yet.

JFWS

I would really like to persure this and find out , and give credit if it happened, who actually , has got the real refund ! You are 100% right and should start a new thread with these results. Myself , :) not enough time to follow through, but having been inconvienced by this whole thing, really think that a true and honest , "Who gotit " thing would heal the soul. :eek:
My opinion , go for it somebody.....

I dont Cyberwings is doing ANYTHING except giving out a few token accounts to get everyone to shut up, then just letting the tickets pile up.

If they had been giving refunds or setting up accounts there would be lots of reports here and there is just 1 so far out of many thousands of scammed users.

[JFWS wrote:] "If you have submited a ticket to perl-desk at CW go look at its statis. There is a message from CEO Shawn

My ticket # is over 2000 I haven't seen a penny as of yet."

***********

[Anne] I submitted a ticket - # is slightly over 1,000. CW originally responded that they needed more information. I gave them all of the information that they requested, but they have done nothing further with my ticket. It's still on "HOLD". 10 days have elapsed since any action. I've been checking the status regularly.


Status HOLD
Priority 1

Elapsed Time 11 days
Since Last Action 10 days

****************

The following is the standard 'announcement' that everyone probably received because it didn't relate to my ticket request for a complete refund.

**********

Announcement
Author: admin
Time: 1-8-2002-2:19

Subject: Individual to AYW & Refund Update


Announcement: We are finding that a lot of people are filing for their Individual accounts to be converted into an AYW account, and then, back to back, they are filing for a refund on their Individual accounts. If you file to have your accounts combined into an AYW, you do not also qualify for a refund. We are checking every payment ID, in PayPal & 2Checkout, to be sure that payment ID's we are converting into AYW were not already previously refunded. We will also be going back over every ticket individually to double check every payment ID when our rebuild project is over to be sure those who got refunds do not also get service - or worse yet, double refunded. Chargebacked refunds will not also qualify for a direct refund from us as well. We are double checking all direct refunds prior to them leaving our office.

I will be in our chat room this evening to talk more.

Shawn

************

The above was dated 8-1-02, and nothing further has been posted.

I agree with classics, and I don't think that Cyberwings is doing anything, but I wanted to make sure that people aren't just quietly receiving refunds and not notifying others. I would be surprised if that were the case.

I am also anxious to hear what kind of response people are receiving from their credit card companies when they ask for a chargeback.

I just rechecked my PayPal account and read the following information that was posted on my account by PayPal:

**********

Transaction ID: xxx
Seller Name:
Cyberwing Communications
Seller Email:
cwings20022002@yahoo.com
Transaction Amount: xxx
Transaction Date: xxx

PayPal Case ID: xxx
Reason for Dispute:
Non Receipt
Date of Complaint: xxx
Status:
Case Closed

Status Details:
Our investigation of this complaint is now complete.

The seller did not respond to our requests for tracking information. Therefore, we attempted to award you a full refund. Unfortunately, there were insufficient funds available in the seller's PayPal account to complete the refund.

PayPal does not consider this a satisfactory resolution of this complaint. We have taken action against this seller's account until the complaint has been resolved.

No further action is required of you at this time.

We value your business and regret this experience. To make sure future transactions proceed smoothly, we suggest reading our Security Tips.

Any portion of the payment which was funded with your credit card will be refunded directly to your credit card. Credits to a credit card generally take 2-3 business days to post, and may not be immediately reflected in the card's balance.

********

[Anne] This is great news! I thought that I would have to post a chargeback to the credit card company myself. I was beginning to think that I would never see any of that money again. I won't be getting all of my money back because some of it was paid before the 30-day limit that PayPal has, but I'm very happy to be getting anything back, and I would recommend that everyone contact PayPal for a refund if they used PayPal. I suspect that because of the number of people who are affected by this CW fiasco, PayPal might be willing to overlook the 30-day limited period for a request for a refund.

Also, notice that there is a different Cyberwings e-mail address. It used to be: sales@cyberwings.com or paypal@cyberwings.com

I wonder if this is the new PayPal account that Cyberwings created because their old account was closed by PayPal.

I have renewed respect for PayPal.

It seems services like PayPal and C2It etc are good at trying to assist the customers . But this still shows no sign of any refund FROM Cyberwings:(

MP2100 wrote: "...this still shows no sign of any refund FROM Cyberwings"

**********

[Anne] I agree, but I suspect that if PayPal/eBay has to pay for the chargebacks of enough people, it will definitely go after Shawn White/Cyberwings to recoup PayPal/eBay's losses, and PayPal/eBay certainly has a lot of legal clout. It probably has full-time lawyers on staff to routinely handle cases like this.

I went to PayPal and submitted for a refund but my 30days
Was up. But the complaint is recorded with PayPal.

I was naive I could have gotten my money back but I Thought
The guy was just a bad businessman and was going to fix everything.

All I can Say whata Dope.

JFWS

Not to sound trite.

But...

Orders placed thru 2checkout.com were/are protected.

Anyone requesting a refund has/will be serviced.

You won't receive a "there are no funds in this account, so you are out of luck" comment.

Simply a case where a 3rd party processor is more protection to a buyer.

So what happens if a customer goes negative with 2checkout? What happens when that $1000 hold back gets burned up with chargebacks and they keep coming? What's the sequence of events?

This is in general what does 2checkout do to protect itself from a loss? We see what Paypal does, they just don't pay out "oh sorry that account is zero so well, we agree he stiffed you but, well, SORRY!".

Long post. heh.

Originally posted by TomD


Orders placed thru 2checkout.com were/are protected.

Anyone requesting a refund has/will be serviced.

Well I, for one, have not received anything from you. I requested a refund over a month ago, received a response saying you would forward it to Cyberwings, of all things, and then heard nothing after that.

Someone actually got a refund (http://www.cyberwingsowesmemoney.com/refund.html) .

but not exactly the way Shawn said it would be, but it so real.

Originally posted by Disty
Someone actually got a refund (http://www.cyberwingsowesmemoney.com/refund.html) .

but not exactly the way Shawn said it would be, but it so real.

Why is s/he waiting until monday to cash it??? I'd get my money right away before the money order could be invalidated.

Originally posted by TomD
Not to sound trite.

Anyone requesting a refund has/will be serviced.

You won't receive a "there are no funds in this account, so you are out of luck" comment.

Yeah right...In my case, I emailed 2checkout's customer service twice asking for a refund and once using their online submission form - all during the week of July 18th for a cyberwings order placed on July 4th. I never got a single response...ever :rolleyes:

hornsmoker -

Here's somone who got service restored
Read this post
http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?threadid=61019&goto=newpost
JFWS

I emailed my first request on the 8th of August and had a reply the same day telling me they had refunded my credit card.

Subject:

Credit Card Credit Transaction Cancelled
Date:

Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:36 EST

From: cc_credit@2checkout.com
To: nsurfer@inter.net
CC: cwings20022002@yahoo.com

« Previous | Next »
View all headers


The following order for has been cancelled and your credit card credited.

Order Number: 16409 - xxxxxxx
Credit Amount: 93.00

A credit can be issued for a variety of reasons. Typically it is done at the request of the buyer for one of two reasons:

1. Non performance of service by the seller after repeated requests to the seller to remedy the situation,
2. A stolen credit card number was used to purchase the goods or services.

If you have questions or wish to dispute this reversal please contact 2Checkout.com Inc.

2CheckOut.com
______________________

Subject:

Important: information for order 16409 - xxxxxxx
Date:

Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:37 EST
From:service@2checkout.com
To:nsurfer@inter.net

« Previous | Next »
View all headers



======================
This is a copy of an email sent to the merchant,
if this issue has not been resolved in 2 bueiness days
or is not being resolved please feel free to
contact us service@2checkout.com
======================

Dear SHAWN,

The customer Net Surfer has contacted 2Checkout.com with a
complaint (details below). Please review this information
and take corrective action by as soon as possible. You can cancel
any order from the Merchant Admin Area.

Complaint Details:
Order canceled and refunded per request of customer

Order Details:
16409 - xxxxxxx
Net Surfer
Address
E-Mail Address
Date: 2002-06-07 00:34:25

Rather than quote a few of the messages above, I'll just post the following.

The response to Cyberwings people is as follows:

"If you require your account information/ transaction number, contact cyberwings directly. You are their customer.

We can cancel your account for you, or you can get your account information from cyberwings if you choose to stay with their service."

We are simply not going to tie up people giving them information that Cyberwings should be handing out.

No one requesting a refund has been turned down. If you haven't received a response to a "refund request", submit it again thru the ticket system.

It is immaterial what the account balance is at. That is not the concern of the consumer.

TomD, I'm not quite sure what relevance your message has. I, for one, did not see anybody respond to this thread asking for their account numbers or for the balance of anyone's account, and I, for one, did not request any of this information in my e-mails.

I twice e-mailed 2checkout.com requesting a refund. To the first e-mail, sent at the beginning of July, I received the reply "I am forwarding your email to Cyber Wings to investigate the problem," and then received no further responses. To my second e-mail, sent more recently, I have received NO response.

If I must, I will submit a request through "the ticket system," but even if you finally get that one, 1 out of 3 is pretty poor, I think, but better than not at all, I suppose..

Hello,

I'm just wondered when this issue gonna end up ?? All the WHT threads are just spammed with CW issues. Yes, I can understand you people that been rip-off** by them.

As a friend said, have it as an experience ! People have said and I will say it once again: You get what you pay for.

So don't expect them to give you reliability, high performance, ease of use and superior technical and customer support.

Have a great day!

My dealings with 2checkout went well, all of my e-mails were promptly returned (1-2 days) and i was issued a refund.

Just wanted to thank Tom and crew at 2checkout and their customer protection :)

Does anyone know what the situation is with CW these days? Shawn hasn't given his ex-customers an update.

What's going on?

Originally posted by Smiloid
My dealings with 2checkout went well, all of my e-mails were promptly returned (1-2 days) and i was issued a refund.

Could you kindly tell me the email ID to which such refund requests are to be sent to 2checkout and the details to be furnished. I recorded a support ticket and waiting for an answer.
Thanks
S.K

billing@2checkout.com
Or Tom himself, tom@2checkout.com
I too got my refund from 2checlout and waiting for another.
Yes Tom has been very helpful. A big "thank you" for you, Tom.

thanks

Originally posted by kichu

Could you kindly tell me the email ID to which such refund requests are to be sent to 2checkout and the details to be furnished. I recorded a support ticket and waiting for an answer.
Thanks
S.K

Neither is the best place to send requests for refunds.

Use the ticket system to request these refunds.
http://www.2checkout.com/contactus.htm


All employees have been instructed to answer tickets as 1st priority.