Hello,

I want to share with you a troublesome experience that happened to me twice this week.

3 days ago, on October 25th, a customer asked me to register an add-on domain for him. Namely: cleoweb.net The domain was free and the order confirmed. A couple hours later, the customer sent a Paypal and I tried to register the domain name. It was TAKEN. The domain was registred the minute I searched to it. From the Whois:

Domain Name: CLEOWEB.NET
Registrar: BELGIUMDOMAINS, LLC
Whois Server: whois.belgiumdomains.com
Referral URL: http://www.belgiumdomains.com
Name Server: NS-1.ORDERBOX-PARKING.COM
Name Server: NS-2.ORDERBOX-PARKING.COM
Name Server: NS-3.ORDERBOX-PARKING.COM
Status: ACTIVE
Updated Date: 25-oct-2006
Creation Date: 25-oct-2006
Expiration Date: 25-oct-2007


Yesterday, I searched for another domain name for another customer: linuxez.com Guess what? the very moment I tried to register it, I was told that this domain is not available! I searched on various registars, no Whois records where available still but the domain was indiacted as freshly registred. This morning, the Whois records were updated and indicate:


Domain Name: LINUXEZ.COM
Registrar: NAMEKING.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.nameking.com
Referral URL: http://www.nameking.com
Name Server: NS1.MALTUZI.COM
Name Server: NS11.MALTUZI.COM
Status: ACTIVE
Updated Date: 27-oct-2006
Creation Date: 27-oct-2006
Expiration Date: 27-oct-2007


Yes, the registar indicated the domain as taken because my search action generated the very registration of this domain name by a third party. I discussed the issue with my associates and it has been believed that some registars redirect their prospective customers searches results to a third party that uses a human or an automated system to register these domains if they looks intersting.

I am taking the matter very seriously. Please share your experience.

Where were you searching for the domain availability for the client originally?

Directi - myorderbox

Believe it or not I have experienced this too more than once. Do a search at 1 registrar (because they have a better search tool) and when we try to register at the registrar that we use <POOF!> it's registered and gone. All in a matter of minutes.

This was covered many times already. Just use either registry's own whois server or linux shell. NEVER EVER a registrar!!!

Use command line 'whois'

Use command line 'whois'

This is what I've suggested 1 post above... ;)

From what site are you doing the whois from?

I believe a number of people have also taken a likeing to www.iwhois.com

If you see a vacant parking slot, do you expect it to remain that way if you decide
not to take it on the spot and come back later?

Is there such a thing as idea theft? Who decides who has exclusivity to an idea?

i always check by whois.sc... never had any such problem ... few domain vr worth instant registration

The second domain name was stollen during the registration process. Yes, I can check from a server command line if a domain name is free or not, but I cannot register it from there.

This is absolutely strange! Did you contact Directi / Reseller club support and discuss this? If both of the times you checked the domain on their domain whois lookup and domains were gone then I am sure they should have some explanation about this.

We usually use whois.sc / viewwhois.com / xwhois.com and havent faced any such issue so far.

I always use
That win32 whois client avalible at
http://www.geektools.com/tools.php

No problems so far

A great tool is Sam spade (http://www.pcworld.com/downloads/file/fid,4709-order,1-page,1-c,alldownloads/description.html?findid=42756) for Windows. Lots of tools, right on your own 'puter.

The second domain name was stollen during the registration process.

I can understand your sentiment on this. But no, you can't claim the domain name
was stolen if it wasn't registered to you in the first place.

Unless the provider you looked up has some kind of privacy policy addressing this
specific concern, then they're pretty much free to do anything with the data that is
being fed to them as they see fit. If anything, you shouldn't use their service next
time to check for domain availability.

Nowadays there is no realistic expectation that what it is you want won't be there
for you if you don't take it on the spot for whatever reason. As some people in the
US put it, you snooze you lose.

I know some of you don't like what I posted here. But I'm being realistic.

Yes this has been an issue for a very long time, can't really trust some places because a lot of information IS mined AND sold.

snooze you lose, you should register them as fast as possible

The second domain was stolen during the registration process. I mean, that some registars redirect the searches to a real time analysis system. If you try to register an intersting domain, it is immediatly catched no matter how fast you are. Before you arrive to the payment or to the DNS form, the domain name has gone.

Care to name the registrar that did this so otehrs can avoid similar issues?

This is why I always use whois.sc, I have never had such a problem with them.

edelweisshosting,

I am sorry to hear that, but it is not the first time I hear it. It is not ethical, but I doubt one can do anything regarding that.

The domain name will be registered and if it does not receive the traffic, I assume 98% it will be dropped within 4 days, so I would advise to keep your eye on it.

I have seen this happen quite often in the last year or so. It isn't limited to one site's lookup either.

This is why I always use whois.sc, I have never had such a problem with them.

Other people have. It's not recommnded. Use your shell whois commands or iwhois.com.

A great tool is Sam spade (http://www.pcworld.com/downloads/file/fid,4709-order,1-page,1-c,alldownloads/description.html?findid=42756) for Windows. Lots of tools, right on your own 'puter.
Are you shure? It is by default using a "whois.crsnic.net" and that whois is exactly what was giving me a trouble. Every time I check a domain name through that whois the domain was taken a few hours later by Maltuzi and NameKing. After I changed a whois server I never got that problem again.

edelweisshosting,

I am sorry to hear that, but it is not the first time I hear it. It is not ethical, but I doubt one can do anything regarding that.

The domain name will be registered and if it does not receive the traffic, I assume 98% it will be dropped within 4 days, so I would advise to keep your eye on it.
Yes, that is true, it is ususaly dropped within 4 days.

But why do you doubt one can do anything regarding that?

Did someone tried to report this to NameKing or ICANN?

Re: SamSpade
Are you shure? It is by default using a "whois.crsnic.net" and that whois is exactly what was giving me a trouble. Every time I check a domain name through that whois the domain was taken a few hours later by Maltuzi and NameKing. After I changed a whois server I never got that problem again.
Well, I'm not using crsnic with it, so I'm not sure about that. I haven't experienced the same result while using crsnic though. It's happened more than once to you using that source?

^
Yes, it happend more than 10 times while using that whois, in just a few months, after I change it a year ago, it never happend again.

I'd be pretty convinced as well, if it happened that much. Too much for coincidence.

whois -h whois.internic.net domain.com

Problem solved.

This just happened to me. Yesterday I checked the availability of hotelchansantacruz.com (a hotel in Mexico) for my client on GODADDY.COM.

Today I tried to register it, and found it was registered by Maltuzi right after I checked availability! I confirmed this with a whois search at the site of their registrar, nameking.com.

So I sent an email to the address listed on maltuzi.com and left a phone message on the voicemail that picks up the phone number listed in whois. Within half an hour I started completed the ICANN dispute forms, and checked the nameking.com whois again to confirm their information and guess what? The name is no longer found in their whois registry! I went back to my registrar, Moniker, and was able to register the name.

This is an extremely unethical practice that GoDaddy and NameKing are obviously in on. Is there any way we can fight this? I'm willing to team up and go after these guys with anyone who's interested.

Yes, I also had the same scenario with GoDaddy and Nameking(Maltuzi) but I just couldn't be sure that GoDaddy is involved...

I always thought that GoDaddy is worst comapany in hosting/domain business and now I am sure. :)

Yes, you are right. This is completly unethical. Maltuzi has absolute power on domain name. Do you know any other registar that could register a domain just for 3 or 4 days then release it again?

Well, did a little more reading up on this. It seems that maybe GoDaddy is not the entire problem.

I read that when an availability search is made, the searching registrar sends the request out to lots of registrars to see if anyone has it registered.

So in this case, I think it's probably Maltuzi and their registrar, NameKing.com that are the bad guys here. The registrar must be involved, otherwise how would anyone be able to pick up and release names so quickly?

i always check by whois.sc... never had any such problem ... few domain vr worth instant registration

Wrong - 3 Names I searched whois.sc - domaintools.com
SAme Occur!

pixty.com - entered on wed. tried to register fri - taken
blogaga.com - also on whois.sc
last mon. istante.net , others.
eliot

Wrong - 3 Names I searched whois.sc - domaintools.com
SAme Occur!

pixty.com - entered on wed. tried to register fri - taken
blogaga.com - also on whois.sc
last mon. istante.net , others.
eliot
I think you may be mistaken?

Domain Name: PIXTY.COM
Creation Date: 30-mar-2005
Domain Name: BLOGAGA.COM
Creation Date: 15-aug-2006
Domain Name: ISTANTE.NET
Creation Date: 18-jan-2007

I read that when an availability search is made, the searching registrar sends the request out to lots of registrars to see if anyone has it registered.

I don't know where you read that. But every domain query made with a registrar
goes straight to the Registry of that extension to check its status, if any.

It doesn't surprise me. If you want to fight back I recommend wasting a bit of time and searching for "dummy" fake names and see if they register them and waste their money.

You can always fool machines.

Hi,
{Bear}
unfortunately that was OVER time not one instance!
after many times i figured something fishy.
this did not happen recently, but, trust me, i tell facts, I NEVER accuse unless i know.


I think you may be mistaken?

In fact, we can NO LONGER register intersting domain names. Imagine you find a free 3 letters domains or something sexy, you cannot register it because some bad people are over you on the business and they monitor all purshases on real time and decide if the domain is for you or not.

Well, did a little more reading up on this. It seems that maybe GoDaddy is not the entire problem.

I read that when an availability search is made, the searching registrar sends the request out to lots of registrars to see if anyone has it registered.





This is absolutely FALSE.

In fact, we can NO LONGER register intersting domain names. Imagine you find a free 3 letters domains or something sexy, you cannot register it because some bad people are over you on the business and they monitor all purshases on real time and decide if the domain is for you or not.

I don't think there's any need to try to create fear/panic in people.
Of course you can register any domain you want, as long as it follows the rules, and nobody will take it away from you.

With some registars you can't. Please read this thread carefully.

When you search for a domain name, some registars send your searches to a backoffice were actual people or a soft decide in real time if they let you register the domain name or if they grab it before.

I many cases I lost the domain name I wanted before I arrived to the checkout page.

I just typed a few names into my browser addy bar. Seeing as it couldn't find my second one, I stopped by here for a coupon code then surfed to godaddy and simply purchased it. I decided to use Paypal this time...very smooth transactional software...for me at least.

edweiss,

After a period of time after you search they grab it for about a week and then it's dropped, they don't actually keep the name permanently.

edweiss,

After a period of time after you search they grab it for about a week and then it's dropped, they don't actually keep the name permanently.
Unless it turns out to be a good traffic domain. Thats easy to figure out!

Did anyone ever see this? I know it's old but it addresses these concerns and issues...

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1991365,00.asp

(If this is in some way against forum policy, please remove it then and sorry)

that's a good one...
there were several stories here
maybe they were bought by a squatter :crazy:

I think you may be mistaken?

Domain Name: PIXTY.COM
Creation Date: 30-mar-2005
Domain Name: BLOGAGA.COM
Creation Date: 15-aug-2006
Domain Name: ISTANTE.NET
Creation Date: 18-jan-2007

Some registrars like ResellerClub is throwing up wrong results... especially in the domain suggestion tool.

On many occasions I got convinced I got a fantastic name only to re-discover it has been registered years back :D

I never use same companies all time to search for names. maybe they track by ip or so

lol...I did my own test.
I put ibebadmofo.com in my search and it WAS available.
Today searching whois, is was registered.

Domain Name: IBEBADMOFO.COM
Registrar: NAMEKING.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.nameking.com
Referral URL: http://www.nameking.com
Name Server: NS1.MALTUZI.COM
Name Server: NS11.MALTUZI.COM
Status: ok
Updated Date: 15-feb-2007
Creation Date: 15-feb-2007
Expiration Date: 15-feb-2008


NOW, isn't that a HOOT! What a JOKE eh!

SO, let this be a waring to everyone.
DON'T ever think about taking ANY time to register a name.
If you have a good idea, take it to Aplus.net
(I have never had a problem with them)
Though, do NOT waste anytime or someone will snatch it up...LOL

I tested several others too. I have yet to do the whois on them,
but no doubt their gone as well...ah, the days of coming up with ones own ideas
are long gone. Too many brainless people out there nowadays!

warmwetandnasty.com

strongtosmell.com

theyaresmelly.com

All taken by the same...lol...these are what I tested that were available when I tried them. Now, gone....
I think Nameking should keep the last one and make a site just about them!

I realize this is a dog eat dog world now, but c'mon...now "everyone" has to buy a name because they got an idea, no time to think about it cause someone will take it because they have no ideas of their own? Because their "program" just nabs it based on one inquiry?

I used to suspect this many years ago.
I always figured someone had a program that would snatch up a name if it had been inquired about several times. That’d make sense. It would seem that it might be a popular name then.
But, to buy friggin names when only ONE search was done on them…that’s just pointless and stupid!

NameKing is an ICANN accredited registrar.
Question is, (from original poster)
Is it ethical, right or wrong, as a ICANN accredited registrar, to register a name on the heals of someone checking it for availablity?

How long does one have to decide to buy it?
One minute, two, less or more then a minute?

I wonder though, how did that info get to the buyer...
Would this buyer also be the Nameking owner?

Said buyer of these domain names I tested below...
Name: Admin -
Organization: Maltuzi LLC

City, Province, Post Code: Mountain View, CA, 94040
Country: US

http://ibebadmofo.com/

Awwww, and I really wanted that name...sheesh

CNet is where I started my initial search

Ok, my last post on this.
Strange, I went to CNet and put in several searches. (Did NOT do anything else)
Most of them related to - cnetnametheives.com and sonanabebigonealso.com (utter nonsense)
I did this so I could see which name got registered. lol...figuring they would never allow cnetnametheives.com to get rigistered IF they had anything to do with it.

Ok, so I close the page and have a wee laugh with myself.
I then hear my in comming mail ding.
It's a friggin email from CNet.
An html News letter of theirs...hummmmm, weird!

I've never been to their site other then to check out the link from the above mentioned artical I posted about, and most recently going and doing the searches I just mentioned. Never had a reason to go there before this otherwise, and I sure do NOT subscribe to news letters, not with anyone and for sure never with them.
So, what the heck?
So, now I get a news letter from them?

That's totally too freaky...

Queried whois.nameking.com with "information.com"...
Domain Name: information.com
Registrant
------------------------------------------------------------
Name: Host Master
Organization: Oversee.net
Email: hostmaster@oversee.net
Address: 818 W 7th Street
City, Province, Post Code: Los Angeles, CA, 90017
Country: US
Phone: 213 408 0080

It says this at information.com: Search Results Will Never Be The Same.

You can say that again...

It's a well known fact that CNET's whois servers are compromised and the culprit is NameKing a well know cybersquatter. They use serveral aliases besides Maltusi. Chesterton Holdings being another 1 of their favorites. They are associated with DomainSponsor/Oversee.net. See this link... http://spamlinks.net/blog/archives/2006/09/chesterton_hold.html

probably tasting your searches...may be dropped in a week or so

i think dominsponsir owns nameking

i think dominsponsir owns nameking

http://www.icann.org/meetings/saopaulo/captioning-dnmarket-06dec06.htm

MY NAME IS JOTHAN FRAKES.

AS TIM MENTIONED, I'M A SENIOR ACCOUNT MANAGER AT A COMPANY CALLED DOMAIN SPONSOR.

IN THE INTEREST OF FULL DISCLOSURE AND TO MAKE SURE THERE'S INTEGRITY TO THIS SESSION, I DO WANT TO DISCLOSE THAT MY PARENT COMPANY OWNS A REGISTRAR, NAME KING, AND THAT THAT COMPANY DOES PARTICIPATE ON BEHALF OF ITS CUSTOMERS FOR DOMAIN TASTING OR ADD GRACE USE.

so they use the registrar company to get names for customer?

Ahhh, ok

For anyone wanting to know what domain tasting is:

http://www.circleid.com/posts/domain_in_bad_taste/

I say we should all do searches for domains we don't want. Let them register them all and lose a lot of money spent registering domain names that no one really wants anyway. They do have to pay for the domains they register, right?

--Tina

This is scary... suppose every registrar all consent to this practice, we all would be buying domains from brokers in the future.:mad:

That would be a good lesson for them, Tina.

It doesn't surprise me. If you want to fight back I recommend wasting a bit of time and searching for "dummy" fake names and see if they register them and waste their money.

You can always fool machines.

lol

Actually mind you though ive had problems maself with maltuzi musta tried to search for the most obscurest unguessable domain names and when i went to register it bang it was gone lol

I think this is not a way to fight them.

They don't pay a dime for the domain names! They are above average ICANN members and as such, they could register a domain for 3 days or a week and drop it to get their money back.

Do you know ANY registar that could register a domain name for 3 days?

Nice find, Dave.

They don't pay a dime for the domain names!

Last I checked, every registrar must have an account with VeriSign in order to be
able to register and manage domain names. VeriSign earns 5% interest from their
accounts.

I'll check again. But just posting that in case some people here think registrars are
not paying a dime.

This problem could go away if ICANN implemented a policy that registrars cannot sell or otherwise provide data to third parties. I have no problem with registrars selling additional services (DNS, etc.), but it seems to me to be a breach of trust to sell a customer's query information.

I have just experienced this problem today with a domain that I researched for a customer two days ago. It seems that just yesterday, that domain (a .com) was registered by a Chinese company using Belgiumdomains.com as the registrar. The domain now points at a page of ad links...

I use DomainTools.com have never had this happen. But I have had it happen when I used to search for domains at Dotster. Never search for domains at Dotster.

I say we should all do searches for domains we don't want. Let them register them all and lose a lot of money spent registering domain names that no one really wants anyway. They do have to pay for the domains they register, right?

--Tina
they register them and test the traffic for 5 days, if they dont see visitors/traffic they can simply delete it and they will lose $0 as its deletable in te first 5 days :)