I can use harsher words here, but I'll try to stay objective and let the reader draw their own conclusions.

I have been in hosting in "RackSpace" for the past two years. The prices are moderate and the customer service has been excellent.
I was tempted by "Rackshack"'s much lower prices. They offer much more powerful servers for more than half the price of RackSpace.
I checked out all of the major web hosting forums for more info into Rackshack before trying them. There were some negative comments, but I tried to put them down as "sour grapes" and perhaps expecting too much..
So I tried to check them out for myself, especially seeing as they offer month-to-month contracts, it wouldn't cost too much to try them out for a month, keeping my current server where they am.
Following is a brief account of what happened (I'll try to summarize and just stay to the facts; Note I have email correspondence from them which confirms almost everything I have written).

Friday - May 17th, app. 4AM CST, Rackshack has 1 server, Celeron 1.3 Ghz, 60 GB HD, Linux Redhat 7.2, etc. offer available for $99 plus $1 setup fee. They also have a series of other servers for $1 setup fee, ranging from $99 to $129/mo.
Their online ordering system "is not available". I send in a fax order. In the subsquent hours, I keep returning to their site, to find that there is always the one server available, and their online ordering system is not working.

At about 9 AM CST, I noticed that the server was gone.
I contacted RackShack by ICQ and then by email. After a lot of strange stories, they admitted via email, that the server was sold "online" and that even though my order came through many hours before the online order, they process fax orders after online orders.
I wrote them that I can understand that maybe this is something that crops up, hopefully infrequently, otherwise their system is flawed, and that they should just offer me another $99 server (which they had available) waiving the $99 setup fee.
They responded "no" and that in any case, within the next 7 days, if another Celeron came up, they would give it to me at the offered price.

There was an exchange of a many emails between Rackshack and myself, where they kept trying to have me chose a more expensive offer.

Friday May 24th - I checked their website, and there were 18 of the same exact servers available, the price is $99 + $1 setup. I saved a copy of the web page so I know that I wasn't seeing things; and no, it wasn't cached.. It now says Project 10K and the old page said something like Project 6K.
I emailed them asking "how about my server". Within 10 minutes I got a reponse saying that they are putting my order through, but I had made a mistake on the original form I sent in.
Before emailing them, I went back to their webpage, probably 10 minutes after I got their response, and the offer had all of a sudden changed from a $1 setup fee to a $99 setup fee!
Anyway, I immediately emailed them the correction and didn't hear from them again.

Monday May 27th - , I wrote them again. I got a response that they are sorry for the delay in setting up my server, but they will no longer be able to give me the server at a $1 setup fee.
I told them to cancel the order.

A few hours later (take a look yourselves), I went back to their web page and the Celeron offer is now at a $249 setup fee!!

So, even though I had an open order for a $99/mo., $1 setup fee, and the servers were available, and their own people confirmed they were going to give me this offer, they categorically refused to give me this server.

There is an expression for this sales tactic, but I'd rather not mention it.

Make your own conclusions.

My personal suggestion.. Stay away from them. Even if they can deliver (and it's a big IF), it would be hard to trust them with your server and your data!!!

So, let's see. You didn't get the deal you wanted so we should "Avoid RackShack" and not "trust them with a server and data."

Is that about it?

I sympathize with what you have been through. It seems similar to many stories. But I fail to see how that makes RackShack a business to avoid and not trust with servers and data.

There's two certainties at RackShack:

- You better know what you're doing because support either cannot or won't help you
- After your first server ordering more is easier

Prior to our local datacenter being complete we picked up a bunch of servers from RackShack when they were first starting out. To this day we still operate some of those servers - though most have been upgraded to better packages - as an effective backup to our own and have experienced nothing but excellent uptime and fast response from their NOC support for reboots (and only on one occasion a hardware replacement).

Base your oppinions on what you will. If you can deal with a hyper-automated system that obviously has some flaws in order to gain entry into their network I can assure you it's worth your while.

Sincerely,

-Matt

Rackshack has a very strong first come first serve (online orders coming before fax orders, as online orders are literally instantaneous) no rainchecks policy, I'm betting the person who said you could get it at the lower price didn't have the authority to do so. It's a logical sales policy for them to use.

Originally posted by skippynzn
Their online ordering system "is not available". I send in a fax order. In the subsquent hours, I keep returning to their site, to find that there is always the one server available, and their online ordering system is not working.
You must be from a country where they are blocking your access to the order form. I am from Australia and the online order form is blocked due to the fraud concerns RS must have with taking orders from this part of the planet.

The best way to get onto a Rackshack server is through Denis at www.saburovo.com

Cheers

Gary

Ok. let me respond to all of you, and I'll try to be more specific. I sort of wanted people to draw their own conclusions.

Easy questions first.

You must be from a country where they are blocking your access to the order form. I am from Australia and the online order form is blocked due to the fraud concerns RS must have with taking orders from this part of the planet.

No. The IP is not blocked. I was able to go to their online orders 4 hours later.. And many times after I was able to go their online orders. So, no, I am not blocked.



Rackshack has a very strong first come first serve (online orders coming before fax orders, as online orders are literally instantaneous) no rainchecks policy, I'm betting the person who said you could get it at the lower price didn't have the authority to do so. It's a logical sales policy for them to use.

First come first serve :) Come on!! I WAS FIRST! I submitted a fax order at least 4 hours before that online order got the server.

No rainchecks? I specifically got emails from three different RackShack people saying that I would get the server if it came available. It did come available, AT THE QUOTED PRICE, and they even started to process my order (at least according to them), then they all of sudden changed their position and said that they would only give it to me for the $99 setup fee.
BTW, at the quoted price, I could have even ordered online, but I hesitated since I had the other order still standing, and certainly didn't want to have two servers.

There's two certainties at RackShack:
- You better know what you're doing because support either cannot or won't help you


Third. Know what you are doing? Don't kid me. I have had racks of servers, set up by myself on colo as well as dedicated servers in Exodus, DN and Worldcom. I've been running Linux servers since 1995. I set up one of Europe's largest ISP in '95. I know what I am doing and I don't need their support, that's exactly why I thought that I could deal with Rackshack.



So, let's see. You didn't get the deal you wanted so we should "Avoid RackShack" and not "trust them with a server and data."
Is that about it?


Perhaps for you I have to be a little more explicit in their policies.

1) On Monday morning, Rackshack had 18 Celeron 1.3 Ghz Celerons available at $1 setup fee/$99 per mo. (The fact that I had a standing order for these, which was confirmed by three different sales representatives doesn't matter).. Later on in the morning, they had 17 servers left, and now the setup fee had increased to $99. On Tuesday (and also Wednesday) there are 10 servers left and the setup fee is now $249.
Can you imagine going into a supermarket to buy a cake, you see he price is $1.99. Then while you are in the checkout line someone else buys the cake and by the time you are at the cash register, the price is now $2.99. It's true, you don't have to buy the cake, but you probably would have some doubts about the ethics and practices of that supermarket.

I am sorry, but I don't understand when someone says that they have 18 servers available at $1+$99 and then change the price.

2) In all of the emails between Rackshack and myself, they kept suggesting that I take a more expensive offer, e.g. or a server with a higher monthly cost, or a server with a higher setup fee.
It turned out that even when I had a standing order confirmed by them, and the product became available, they refused to give me the product.
This is called in the U.S. "Bait and Switch". It's a clear case, and is not a valid business practice in the US or most of the civilized world.
I have no doubt that someone actually did get a $1 server, but obviously their policy is to try to bait people, they pull in a few on the $1, but try to switch most of them.

So, what does it mean "Don't trust you data with them".
Hey I keep all of my email and important documents on my server, although I do have local backups, it would be not so nice if I lost my data, and I am sure that everyone agrees.

Given the very questionable business practices/ethics of Rackshack (or you think they are ethical.. well then its worse, because they are simply incompentent), who says that one of those 18 celerons offered won't be "yours", by mistake..
Who knows, your Visa expired, but you had a new one issued and you haven't changed the expiration date, and they gave you a one-day notice and then reformatted your disks?
Are you sure that's not going to happen? Or they make a mistake with their highly-automated system and re-allocate your server "by mistake" to someone else.

Rackshack in a very consistent and strong manner have demonstrated that they are using shady business practices and that their technical capabilities aren't so hot either.
I think its clear indication that perhaps they are not as reliable as one might like.

Good luck!

My eyes got dried reading your post :nuts: .. but you have a point. :)

Originally posted by SoftWareRevue
So, let's see. You didn't get the deal you wanted so we should "Avoid RackShack" and not "trust them with a server and data."

Read it again - that's not what he said.

-Bob

Originally posted by skippynzn
1) On Monday morning, Rackshack had 18 Celeron 1.3 Ghz Celerons available at $1 setup fee/$99 per mo. (The fact that I had a standing order for these, which was confirmed by three different sales representatives doesn't matter).. Later on in the morning, they had 17 servers left, and now the setup fee had increased to $99. On Tuesday (and also Wednesday) there are 10 servers left and the setup fee is now $249. [...]

I am sorry, but I don't understand when someone says that they have 18 servers available at $1+$99 and then change the price.
I think the publication on the Rackshack website, with the number of machines available, the configuration of those machines and the price, that's an offer. So if someone submits an online order to buy one, or several, or the entire stock (all 18 boxes) the deal is perfect and Rackshack has to deliver what they have sold.

On the other hand as long as a certain machine hasn't been "orderd" (i.e. sold), Rackshack is free to change its price tag as they please, they can also simply withdraw the offer. I agree the practice of repeated price increments over a short periode of time looks like they're playing with customers, but actually you can't tell what made them change these prices and they have the right to change them; I agree it looks "suspicious" ;)
Friday - May 17th, app. 4AM CST, Rackshack has 1 server, Celeron 1.3 Ghz,...

Their online ordering system "is not available". I send in a fax order....

At about 9 AM CST, I noticed that the server was gone.

they admitted via email, that the server was sold "online" and that even though my order came through many hours before the online order, they process fax orders after online orders
When you place your order per Telefax this is an order in the common sense of the term, you don't accept an offer (because it's not sure if any items will be left by the time Rackshack gets to process your order), so the deal is only perfect when Rackshack accepts your order.
they should just offer me another $99 server (which they had available) waiving the $99 setup fee.
They responded "no" and that in any case, within the next 7 days, if another Celeron came up, they would give it to me at the offered price.
It appears evident that they had it available.

Hehe,... they just had such a Celeron for sale, they know that there will be new offers of this type, but still they're not willing to give you the price..., looks like when given the choice (i.e. when receiving orders by Fax) Rackshack will never ever accept to sell at the "bargain" price they advertise on the website.

However, by promising to accept your order if within 7 days the same item should become available again, they actually made you believe you'd get the deal, thereby preventing you from placing an online order in that case. For this reason I believe that Rackshack is legally bound by this promise. Remains the question if the person you were dealing with had the power to contract in the name of Rackshack.
Friday May 24th - I checked their website, and there were 18 of the same exact servers available...Is this within the 7 days? - I'll suppose yes...
I emailed them asking "how about my server".
Within 10 minutes I got a reponse saying that they are putting my order through...
Given the aforementioned, I'd consider that with this the deal is perfect or, in any case, Rackshack is now obliged to accept your order.

Monday May 27th - , I wrote them again. I got a response that they are sorry for the delay in setting up my server, but they will no longer be able to give me the server at a $1 setup fee.
For my understanding the contract was concluded Friday, with the conditions as originally orderd by telefax. Setting up the server is just part of the fulfillment.
I told them to cancel the order.
Hmm... In my opinion there was no order anymore, the contract was perfect. Your request to "cancel the offer" is to be understood as a request to annullate the contract, which RackShack has accepted.

However, this request to annullate the contract was based on an error of your part, if you had known the deal was perfect at the conditions you wanted, you wouldn't have requested it to be annullated. For this reason I think you can contest the validity of this transaction and insist in fulfillment of the contract.

Ok, I don't know US law at all... The above is what I believe to be the solution of the case in my country, but don't take it as a legal advice.
This is called in the U.S. "Bait and Switch". It's a clear case, and is not a valid business practice in the US or most of the civilized world.
As you describe it in your fist post, the various practices of RackShack definitely look "suspicious"...

In your particular case the very least one can say is that RackShack did screw up with the way they have handled your order. For this reason it is my opinion that they should stand by their word and offer you that deal right now, if you are still interested in it.

On the other hand as long as a certain machine hasn't been "orderd" (i.e. sold), Rackshack is free to change its price tag as they please, they can also simply withdraw the offer. I agree the practice of repeated price increments over a short periode of time looks like they're playing with customers, but actually you can't tell what made them change these prices and they have the right to change them; I agree it looks "suspicious"

Hmm. From a legal point of view you "maybe" are correct, but I am not too sure about it. If you say that you have 18 servers available at $1, then implicitly you are saying that they are there as long as the servers last. In a store in the US, it would work this way. Normally they say something "until supplies run out. No rainchecks accepts".

However, by promising to accept your order if within 7 days the same item should become available again, they actually made you believe you'd get the deal, thereby preventing you from placing an online order in that case. For this reason I believe that Rackshack is legally bound by this promise. Remains the question if the person you were dealing with had the power to contract in the name of Rackshack.


Not only did they promise (3 different people and 3 different emails). After I sent them an email saying that I saw they offered 18 servers at that price, and so could my order be fufilled, but they started to process my order! They needed an extra confirmation from me, which I confirmed, then I didn't hear from them again, until I wrote them later on.


Hmm... In my opinion there was no order anymore, the contract was perfect. Your request to "cancel the offer" is to be understood as a request to annullate the contract, which RackShack has accepted.


However, this request to annullate the contract was based on an error of your part, if you had known the deal was perfect at the conditions you wanted, you wouldn't have requested it to be annullated. For this reason I think you can contest the validity of this transaction and insist in fulfillment of the contract. .


No.. It was not an error on my part, as they renigged on the deal.
They sent me an email saying that the price was no longer $1, but it was now $99! My original order was at $1 setup, the product was available. There was no reason not to honor my order.

At that point, I had very few choices: a) accept the $99 setup fee (which 2 hours later became $249), b) go to the BBB, c) get a lawyer. d) just let it go..

I let it go and brought it public here.

There will be more to come!!! Wait a week or so and I'll have some very interesting information on Rackshack.

Originally posted by skippynzn
At that point, I had very few choices: a) accept the $99 setup fee (which 2 hours later became $249), b) go to the BBB, c) get a lawyer. d) just let it go..



I'd have to vote you go with D. The BBB is useless in my opinion. I've tried dealing with them in the past to no avail.

Originally posted by skippynzn
. . . . . . Perhaps for you I have to be a little more explicit in their policies. . . . . . . . . .

So, what does it mean "Don't trust you data with them".
Hey I keep all of my email and important documents on my server, although I do have local backups, it would be not so nice if I lost my data, and I am sure that everyone agrees.

Given the very questionable business practices/ethics of Rackshack (or you think they are ethical.. well then its worse, because they are simply incompentent), who says that one of those 18 celerons offered won't be "yours", by mistake..
Who knows, your Visa expired, but you had a new one issued and you haven't changed the expiration date, and they gave you a one-day notice and then reformatted your disks?
Are you sure that's not going to happen? Or they make a mistake with their highly-automated system and re-allocate your server "by mistake" to someone else.

Rackshack in a very consistent and strong manner have demonstrated that they are using shady business practices and that their technical capabilities aren't so hot either.
I think its clear indication that perhaps they are not as reliable as one might like.

Good luck! Again; I sympathize with your experience.
If the same had happened to me, I'd be livid. However, I wouldn't be starting threads saying, "Don't do business with RackShack" becuause I tried and couldn't. Therefore your data won't be safe with them."
Whatever you think of their sales tactics, to me, fails to demonstrate their inability to safeguard my data.
I don't have a server with them. And don't know if I ever will. But, it's not because I find that their pre-sales conduct makes me think my data won't be safe. It's because of my direct experience with their sales and support staff that takes them off my list of companies to do business with.
Personally, if I were you, I'd do everything possible to make them uphold their end. And that certainly wouldn't include any talk on any message board.

Good luck.

I think I've just seen too many RS threads. :(

Though the situation stinks, I find it hard to blame RackShack. When you offer a cut rate deal (and some of their deals certainly are) you are skimping somewhere. Rackshacks backbone has a good reputation so that would indicate they are light on manpower (or womanpower), which a few complaints seem to backup. Hard to argue with success. We chose a different model and probably make much less money.

Third. Know what you are doing? Don't kid me. I have had racks of servers, set up by myself on colo as well as dedicated servers in Exodus, DN and Worldcom. I've been running Linux servers since 1995. I set up one of Europe's largest ISP in '95. I know what I am doing and I don't need their support, that's exactly why I thought that I could deal with Rackshack.

My comment was not directed at you nor did it attempt to make any assumptions regarding your abilities as a server administrator. I can understand you're frustrated with RackShack's sales staff lacking in their ability to modify an automated system but please don't assume that others think you're stupid because of it, we've all suffered the same at some point.

I think the point's been made that you have had a bad experience with RackShack. When it comes down to it though provided you've been given a refund there's not too much else that can be done. Your story's been told (and don't get me wrong it's an important one for first-time customers), money's back in your pocket, and fortunately there's plenty of other companies now offering RackShack-esque pricing on their servers.

-Matt

Originally posted by skippynzn
No.. It was not an error on my part,...

At that point, I had very few choices: a) accept the $99 setup fee (which 2 hours later became $249), b) go to the BBB, c) get a lawyer. d) just let it go..

I let it go and brought it public here.
So you renounced on the contract because RackShack didn't deliver what they had sold, and you didn't want to go through all the hassle of a lawsuit because of this,... Fair enough...

Still I think that RackShack, having done wrong, should fix this by offering you that deal right now if you're still interested in it.

Originally posted by skippynzn
First come first serve :) Come on!! I WAS FIRST! I submitted a fax order at least 4 hours before that online order got the server.

No rainchecks? I specifically got emails from three different RackShack people saying that I would get the server if it came available. It did come available, AT THE QUOTED PRICE, and they even started to process my order (at least according to them), then they all of sudden changed their position and said that they would only give it to me for the $99 setup fee.
BTW, at the quoted price, I could have even ordered online, but I hesitated since I had the other order still standing, and certainly didn't want to have two servers.Since you apparently didn't read my whole post, let me mention the additonal points again, first when it came to the first come first serve, I very specifically said fax orders after the online orders in the timeline, fax orders when they actually get to it, which is due to the fact that the online system is quite literally an instantaneous order (you have access to the server right after the order), so the online system would always come first. I also mentioned that I have seen that they don't do rainchecks, and that the person who said it probably didn't have the authority to do a raincheck, which I believe because Headsurfer himself has menioned many times that they don't do rainchecks.1) On Monday morning, Rackshack had 18 Celeron 1.3 Ghz Celerons available at $1 setup fee/$99 per mo. (The fact that I had a standing order for these, which was confirmed by three different sales representatives doesn't matter).. Later on in the morning, they had 17 servers left, and now the setup fee had increased to $99. On Tuesday (and also Wednesday) there are 10 servers left and the setup fee is now $249.
Can you imagine going into a supermarket to buy a cake, you see he price is $1.99. Then while you are in the checkout line someone else buys the cake and by the time you are at the cash register, the price is now $2.99. It's true, you don't have to buy the cake, but you probably would have some doubts about the ethics and practices of that supermarket.[/quote]Like it was mentioned, they can raise the price at any time, as long as the particular server hasn't actually been sold (and as long as you haven't been billed for the server, it is by no means actually sold). The $1 setup was always meant as temporary, both by the posts in the forums AND the way the website was written. The cake situation is very different from a supermarket, online places have the ability to raise a price at any time, before an order has actually been placed, without any issues. Supermarkets generally only change a price when they are closed, online stores generally don't have that option.2) In all of the emails between Rackshack and myself, they kept suggesting that I take a more expensive offer, e.g. or a server with a higher monthly cost, or a server with a higher setup fee.
It turned out that even when I had a standing order confirmed by them, and the product became available, they refused to give me the product.
This is called in the U.S. "Bait and Switch". It's a clear case, and is not a valid business practice in the US or most of the civilized world.
I have no doubt that someone actually did get a $1 server, but obviously their policy is to try to bait people, they pull in a few on the $1, but try to switch most of them.It would be a bait and switch if you started the order online and it was $1, and by the time they actually charged the credit card they charged you more, but changing the price before the confirmation of a order is a different situation.So, what does it mean "Don't trust you data with them".
Hey I keep all of my email and important documents on my server, although I do have local backups, it would be not so nice if I lost my data, and I am sure that everyone agrees.

Given the very questionable business practices/ethics of Rackshack (or you think they are ethical.. well then its worse, because they are simply incompentent), who says that one of those 18 celerons offered won't be "yours", by mistake..
Who knows, your Visa expired, but you had a new one issued and you haven't changed the expiration date, and they gave you a one-day notice and then reformatted your disks?
Are you sure that's not going to happen? Or they make a mistake with their highly-automated system and re-allocate your server "by mistake" to someone else.That's just a simple lack of knowledge of the company you are speaking of, in EVERY situation I've heard of someone's billing being late, they initially only take the server offline, and assuming the situation gets resolved (which they do attempt to contact you), they get it plugged it, they don't just immediately cancel it simply because a credit card stopped working.Rackshack in a very consistent and strong manner have demonstrated that they are using shady business practices and that their technical capabilities aren't so hot either. Consistent and strong? By what? One set of encounters by one person in the pre-order process, hardly.

Dude, no one bought your cake. You never had a cake, and you were never at the checkout. You faxed an order in for a cake, to a company thats set up for online ordering.

Now, I can see how you feel slighted, but honestly. Think for second. Do you really believe that a concerted effort was made to bilk you out of an extra $98? Like they knew when you were looking at the site and changed the prices on you? Or maybe they turned off the online ordering in order to pull the old bait and switch on you?

It's a big company. Employees are rarely on the same page. Things are automated. Mistakes get made. Things go pretty smoothly if the automation is on your side. Sometimes it's not.

If you are looking to pinch pennies, you'll be saving far more than $98 if you make the switch to RackShack. But it sounds like you are off to a bad start. Why not just stay put with RackSpace?

Originally posted by driverdave
Dude, no one bought your cake. You never had a cake, and you were never at the checkout. You faxed an order in for a cake, to a company thats set up for online ordering.
Indeed, if one wants to draw a general conclusion from this thread it's that telefax orders for rackshack "specials" are a no no...

However, in this particular case, skippynzn is right because he was promised that his telefax order would be honored if that same special should be available again within 7 days. This means that for 7 days he had a standing (and confirmed) order, he could not use the online ordering system when that item became available again because doing so he would have placed a second order while he only wanted one server.

For this reason (and not merely because an order was faxed) it is my understanding that this sale was perfect when RackShack started to offer that item again.

They sold an item and then refused to deliver it.

Well, some companies are employing sales jerks (http://www.jerk.net/salesjerk.htm), looks like RackShack is one of them. But their boss should maybe give them an update on what they can do and what not, for example that they should avoid to make bull**** statements like "we can't give you that deal now, but if we make it available within 7 days you'll get it"; and that if "by mistake" such statements are made, those promises are at least to be respected.

You explained it well. If all of that is true, RackShack definitely did you wrong and engaged in bad business practices. They should have given you a better server at the same price. That's the way good businesses operate when they make a mistake.

There are 2 sides to every story though. I wouldn't mind hearing Rackshack's version from the owner of this forum, Headsurfer.

Anyone see the ad on hostingtech where affinity totally rips on rackshack?