Hey there, I am very new to the arena, however, am very interested in producing a professional site and would like to learn how to do it myself. I read with programs such as WYSWIG and Dreamweaver etc. you can produce a site, however, I presume that they would create relatively basic picture and text sites. What should I use/learn in order to create a professional site that has such features as flash etc.? Will I need to learn to program in order to produce such a site?

I already have all the plans for my site mapped out and know exactly how I want it to look etc. however, I have no idea how to produce my ideas as I have no web design skills, and would like to know how to. In order to create a good site what are all the basics I will need to learn? ie. which programs will I need to have, what knowledge do I need to gain, where do I start?

Thanks.

You may want to look into a content management system (CMS) which is all the rage right now. It allows you to make a semi-pro site by simply entering text, data, pics, etc.

Dreamweaver is good for noobs, too. It creates the html code needed with a built-in wysiwyg editor.

Flash, however, has a steep learning curve. For flash files, you may want to have a foreigner in a different economy do this on the cheap @ www.rentacoder.com or similar. $10-20 is not unheard of as this may translate to $200 in another economy.

You have several choices :)

Thanks for the response!

I already have the idea for the site design etc. and am not going to use a template, and originally planned just to pay someone to create my site idea. I then decided that I wanted to learn how do it all myself so in the future I can update and play around with the site to suit my preferences etc. and am generally interested in the arena. Seeing as though time isn't a huge factor in my site creation I think if I could learn how to do at least some of the creation myself and have a general understanding it would be good.

I'm looking to create a more sophisticated site so would you still recommend Dreamweaver? you mentioned only 'semi-professional' sites are within reach with it. What are the limitations involved with Dreamweaver?

What do professional web designers use as an interface for site creation usually?

You can make pro sites with Dreamweaver I suppose...It's been four years since I've had it. They probably have a free demo that you can goof with to get a feel for it.

Pros usually hand code because some of these editors create unecessary and browser-confusing codes. A good site on coding basics is www.htmldog.com

Dreamweaver 8 seems to be very functional, and it seems you can work with flash on it. Have you reviewed it lately? or do you comments apply to a previous assessment of maybe an earlier version?

The main draw-back of using an editor like Dreamweaver would be unnecessary coding? What would that do exactly? cause error pages for viewers?

I presume if you created a site via Dreamweaver and you were unable to get the full effect your were after, a web designer could then help you out and alter it to exactly how you intended?

I was reading throuw the html tutorial that is provided at htmldog.com (thanks), and found it to be very intersting; I will continue to read it. I cam across a note saying: "Software programs such as these will never give you the same control over a web page as coding by hand." in reference to Dreamweaver. What does the extra code that these programs throw in do exactly?

Seems I had DW4 or something like that years ago before I learned some languages.
It's probably been refined by now but I remember one editor (not necessarily DW) would open a font tag, close it, then open another tag if you goofed with your text and back-spaced.
Some editors cause errors when javascript is used...again probably from backing up somewhere or somesuch.
Sure...You could get close with DW then have someone fine tune your site the way you'd like it. You could probably find someone at one of those new international coding sites to do your whole site on the cheap without having to even lift a finger.
Notorious editors for messing up include FrontPage & CoolPage.

Would it be more recommended to learn HTML and CSS and create a site that way, or to just use Dreamweaver? ie. assuming it takes a long time to become competent using HTML, would a novice HTML job be worse than a Dreamweaver creation?

assuming it takes a long time to become competent using HTML

HTML has very few elements. You could learn them all in an hour or so. CSS is basically the same but has some other interesting issues.

However, when building a website or a web page, there is an element of ART and that is what takes time to develop.

Start small and build on your skills. With each new page you do you will learn more and more and over time you will become fairly good at it.

The best part is when you see something you like, view the source of that page and see how someone else did it and you can learn that way as well.

:peace:

How would one go about creating sites such as these:

http://www.jager.com/index.cfm (enter the main site)


http://www.mtv.com/index.jhtml?rd=home

etc.

I suspect that they couldn't be produced on something like Dreamweaver? I also am unable to conceive how they would be produced via notepad, what interface would the web designers use?

First you start out by drinking a lot of shots then turn on MTV. :)

The jeger site uses Cold Fusion. The MTV site uses several things like flash, java etc...

If your looking to do a site like this I can tell you that MTV hires some of the best and hottest designers around. I used to work for them.

If your looking to do something like that and you are just starting out, you have very high ambitions.

Doesn't mean you can't do it, but are you available 12 hours a day for the next 6 months?

You have great taste!

:peace:

How would one go about creating sites such as these:

http://www.jager.com/index.cfm (enter the main site)


http://www.mtv.com/index.jhtml?rd=home

etc.

I suspect that they couldn't be produced on something like Dreamweaver? I also am unable to conceive how they would be produced via notepad, what interface would the web designers use?

You can indeed produce sites like these in DW or Notepad (you'd also need Flash as well). Dreamweaver is just a tool like Notepad, and the skill in creating a website like these comes with a lot of practice and experience. These companies would have spend huge sums of money for these sites as well, what you see ion your browser is only the tip of the iceberg!

Someone said start small and learn, that's the way to go. Start simply and build up your knowledge as you go along, don't aim too high to start with otherwise you'll get out of your depth!

First you start out by drinking a lot of shots then turn on MTV. :)

The jeger site uses Cold Fusion. The MTV site uses several things like flash, java etc...

If your looking to do a site like this I can tell you that MTV hires some of the best and hottest designers around. I used to work for them.

If your looking to do something like that and you are just starting out, you have very high ambitions.

Doesn't mean you can't do it, but are you available 12 hours a day for the next 6 months?

You have great taste!

:peace:

Cold fusion costs about $7k correct? What is the basis for the price, when people can create sites from notepad. I presume this is predominantly for professional web designers?

I looked at the Adobe site, it seems Dreamweaver doesn't have many capabilities on its own, you need to download a number of other programs such as studio 8 in order to enjoy all the features.

How far can you get with Dreamweaver and its add ons such as studio 8 including the flash program?

Cold fusion costs about $7k correct?Think of ColdFusion more like a database, just with lots of features. You really wouldn't use it to "design" a site per se, but to keep content and data flowing. It's a backend type thing. If you know absolutely nothing about XHTML or CSS, there's absolutely no point in spending that kind of money.What is the basis for the price, when people can create sites from notepad. I presume this is predominantly for professional web designers?I always "hear" about "professionals" designing websites with Notepad, but let's be realistic here. It's good for making minor changes in code, just like editing a file straight from the shell. It's not good for managing hundreds of websites, or hell, even thirty. I've been designing websites for over 10 years. XHTML/CSS are so second-nature to me that I can "speak" the code out verbally and "picture" the site in my head. That just takes practice and comes with working with code all the time. I use Dreamweaver 8, not because I can't code, but because of the other features it comes with. First, it manages all of my websites. I have over 100 websites on a hard drive and Dreamweaver manages all of them. The username/password for each client so I can login via FTP and upload/download files, server testing so I can interact with things like PHP and MySQL locally, check-in/check-out features so if another person is working on the same site we don't overwrite eachother's work, and so on. I don't use the WYSIWYG side of Dreamweaver, not that it doesn't work or anything, but it produces code that I otherwise don't need, and I know it well enough to not have to use it.I looked at the Adobe site, it seems Dreamweaver doesn't have many capabilities on its own, you need to download a number of other programs such as studio 8 in order to enjoy all the features.Macromedia Studio 8 is a bundled program, it comes with Fireworks, Flash, Macromedia, and some other programs. Flash is for, well Flash, if you don't know XHTML/CSS don't even bother trying that out first. Fireworks is for graphics, although it does do layouts, rollovers, animated gifs, etc., but for the sake of argument, it's a graphics program. Dreamweaver has tons of features, mainly the ones I listed, and there are hundreds of add-ons, both free and pay, that you can download. Things like menu creators, form integration, shopping cart systems, etc. I've never used them, but for someone who doesn't know much, it's a good thing to look into.How far can you get with Dreamweaver and its add ons such as studio 8 including the flash program?As far as your mind takes you. I've designed 500+ page sites using Dreamweaver. I could have used Notepad, but to manage all the files, do site-wide find/replace using regex functions, and all the other things, why bother?

Studio 8 isn't an add-on. Flash, Fireworks, Freehand, Dreamweaver, etc., they all integrate together. So I can be working in Fireworks and export an image into Dreamweaver, it will slice the image up into smaller images, add the code for the rollovers, name all the files, and build a page for me. I can make a Flash into and export it into Dreamweaver, etc.

Think of it like Microsoft Office if you will. Studio 8 is like Office, it bundles things like Word, Excel, FrontPage, Access, PowerPoint. All of these programs work with eachother, but all can be used by themself. Catch my drift?

I think you have a long way to go before you start checking out these programs. Learn XHTML first. Learn CSS next. Then learn to combine them. After you do that then you can jump into programs. I say you start with notepad, not the other way around.

I think I am missing something here.

How can anybody compare notepad to Dreamweaver? They are two different tools for completely different purposes. I own a web devlopment firm and I just can't imagine one of my designers using a notepad to develop a website.

It will take him weeks to code something in notepad what would have taken him only 3-4 days in Dreamweaver.

And, you can use Dreamweaver to create a fully XHTML compliant website if you want to. Also there is the option of switching between WYSIWYG and code view giving you the best of both worlds.

Of course, DW is general purpose web development tool and might not be what you need if you are into heavy PHP/ASP/JSP scripting.

Rather than getting sidetracked with complex programs, I think you should start at the beginning :)

Rather than getting sidetracked with complex programs, I think you should start at the beginning :)Couldn't have said it better myself. HE (or she) should be the one that starts off with Notepad. Once you understand how to code, THEN make your life easier :)

I am just going to commission someone to create my site, and will learn what I can in the process. Hopefully by the time it is up and running I will have enough knowledge to make minor alterations to it when I wish. I will continue to learn what I can and will hopefully be able to create them myself in the future.

I went to elance.com and attempted to post a proposal there, however, apparently you need to submit your credit card details just to verify your age; something I didn't want to do. Does anyone know another place where I can acquire a number of quotes for the proposed web page?

Thanks for the help.

I am just going to commission someone to create my site, and will learn what I can in the process. Hopefully by the time it is up and running I will have enough knowledge to make minor alterations to it when I wish. I will continue to learn what I can and will hopefully be able to create them myself in the future.

If you want to be able to update parts of the site yourself make sure the developers build in some sort of content management so you can easily update bits whenever you want. Also make sure the system is to your specification so you can use it!

I always "hear" about "professionals" designing websites with Notepad, but let's be realistic here. It's good for making minor changes in code, just like editing a file straight from the shell.

I've designed 50+ sites in the last few years and have never in my life touched a site builder. I use nothing but notepad and photoshop. I consider myself to be at a professional level from the extreme number of hours and experience designing sites. Therefore, I'm not quite sure where your comment comes from.

There is no better way to learn web design than starting with basic html in a simple text editor. Site builders don't teach web design, HTML tutorials do.

I've designed 50+ sites in the last few years and have never in my life touched a site builder. I use nothing but notepad and photoshop. I consider myself to be at a professional level from the extreme number of hours and experience designing sites. Therefore, I'm not quite sure where your comment comes from.How do you manage all of your sites then? Are you using a project management system or something? I've been doing web design for 10+ years and have over 100 sites under my belt. The only time I touched notepad was when I was first starting out.There is no better way to learn web design than starting with basic html in a simple text editor. Site builders don't teach web design, HTML tutorials do.I agree, I never said a site builder would teach you about web design. But as someone who understand XHTML, CSS, PHP, etc., the features of a program like Dreamweaver are invaluable. The way it finishes tags for you, sitewide find-and-replace, server testing with MySQL and PHP, check-in/check-out for when two people are working on the same site, color-coding syntax for HTML and especially PHP. It's a handy tool you have to admit. I use it strictly for coding, that's why it's setup in Coder view instead of Designer view. Plus, when you have to manage all those websites, it's just easier to have all the usernames/passwords stored directly in the program. Doing things like checking for invalid links and so on.

You save at least 2 minutes of typing just by the way DW automatically puts in the beginning tags: doctype, html, head, title, body, and character type. Auto-indentation, code formatting and cleanup. Notepad can't touch that with even a mile-long pole.

How do you manage all of your sites then?

Manage in what way? I have local copies and remote copies. If I want any changes made, I modify them locally then upload them. Most of the larger sites have seperate menus that are included via php making changes simple.


But as someone who understand XHTML, CSS, PHP, etc., the features of a program like Dreamweaver are invaluable.

I know XHTML, CSS, and PHP. The sites in my signature alone prove that. I still do all of the above in notepad.

I prefer to type my own code, 100% of it. That way I know exactly what I'm getting and I can say that 'I' made my site.

I apologise if I seem obnoxious, or down right ignorant/insensitive, but I personally think some of the comments in here are very discouraging to someone new to developing websites. Also, I haven't read all the comments, just skimmed.

Aim high. Back in 1998, I started designing websites and graphics because I wanted to be the best out there. I wanted to win awards, and I wanted to be recognised. I looked up to the likes of Meng (Someone I forgot his last name) and some other very talented 3d artists. I didn't know where to start and took me 4 years to find out! And another 4 years to get hold of the 3d software (It's expensive) and learning packages! So I'm not the best, but that's what I'm still aiming for!

Personally, I think if you want to get good, you have to reach for the stars, don't think "wow I just accomplished that step, let's try the next". Think "Yeaaa I've done that now bring on the rest!".

So, where to start?

www.w3schools.com is an excellent place to start. Learn HTML and CSS. Then move on to XHTML, and learn about accessibility over on the W3C (www.w3.org/WAI). I personally wouldn't listen to the mumbo-jumbo about not using an editor, if you want to, go ahead! I personally recommend HomeSite+ but stay well away from FrontPage. It's the most horrible editor you will ever come across!

As for the design side in a program such as Fireworks or Photoshop, I can only recommend practice. Some good advice, is to 'Print Screen' sites that you want to learn how to make, and try replicating them in said programs, remember, if you do you cannot re-publish them on the W3 nor do I encourage or condone the re-publishing of copyrighted materials.

Practice makes perfect. If you do purchase Fireworks or Photoshop, I suggest buying a book or some learning CD's, learn the interface and some tips & tricks, you'll never know when they'll come in handy.

As for once you've learnt how to, keep learning! You will never stop learning about how to construct, design or develop a website, never. Even if you solely choose the 'design' route, because there's always something new, and always something to invent.

Good luck, remember reach for the stars, there's unlimited possibilities!

Manage in what way? I have local copies and remote copies. If I want any changes made, I modify them locally then upload them. Most of the larger sites have seperate menus that are included via php making changes simple.So you just keep all your clients' usernames and passwords stored in your FTP program then I assume? I'm just saying it's nice to have a program that does that for you. With a quick shortcut key my file is uploaded to the server, no need to save the file, open up my FTP program, find it, and then upload it.I prefer to type my own code, 100% of it. That way I know exactly what I'm getting and I can say that 'I' made my site.Are you implying that the code I produce isn't my code?

So you just keep all your clients' usernames and passwords stored in your FTP program then I assume?

Hang on, are we talking about web design or client databases now? I don't see the relevance.

In my opinion, using a site builder is the same as hiring someone to do it for you. You tell the software what you want done, and the software codes it. Obviously different site builders will do different amounts of work so I can't rate dreamweaver on the scale since I've never used it or even seen it.

To actually learn web design, there is no better method than starting with pure and basic HTML in a text editor.

Find a text editor that will highlight code. It helps out a bunch and will reduce errors. Try something like html kit http://www.chami.com/html-kit/. This allows to manage your sites with easy upload through ftp. There are many others out there. For a good open source image program try gimp http://www.gimp.org/. Definitely check out http://www.w3schools.com/

Another decent source of info is http://www.htmlgoodies.com/ for the beginner.

Have several versions of different browsers on your system to test your pages with for compatibility especially when playing with css.

Make sure you have fun doing it and go out and play.

Programs I have listed are free or open source software. After you understand what you are doing then spend money if you need to.

In my opinion, using a site builder is the same as hiring someone to do it for you. You tell the software what you want done, and the software codes it.

I wish site builders and HTML editors were that sophisticated. Would have allowed me to do my work more quickly and efficiently. After all, thats what all tools are meant to do.

Hey there, I am very new to the arena, however, am very interested in producing a professional site and would like to learn how to do it myself. ...
In order to create a good site what are all the basics I will need to learn? ie. which programs will I need to have, what knowledge do I need to gain, where do I start?

Thanks.

Hi,

May I suggest Adobe GoLive CS2 for web page design and web site project management tool, and one or more of the following: Adobe Photoshop, Corel Draw, Corel Photo-paint to create the images used for yoour web pages.

I have read some suggestion(s) about usage of content management system, but it would be best if you know (or if you learn) some php and mySQL and create your own scripts to manage your web site content.