I'm not sure if this is the correct forum to post this, but I thought I'd just let everyone know. If it's not in the right forum, feel free to move it.

I bought a banner advertisement on www.imageknockout.com from a user here named TemplateAlien. This advertisement spot was $50/month. Only days after purchasing this spot the imageknockout.com site went down.

Here are some emails between the seller and I (his name is Matt):

Matt: "Thank you for your kind bid. We have added you onto the banner rotation for one month. We will continue to let you stay here each month as long as your subscription is paid. Thank you!"

When their site went down I emailed him and asked what was going on, he replied:

Matt: "Sorry... 1&1 is our hosting company. The server was having ddos attacks so we are waiting for 1&1 to call us back for us to help. We should be back up relatively soon. Do not worry, we will give you 1 month added advertising. Thank you."

Towards the end of January the site was online again and he offered to give me a larger banner. However, less than 3 days later the site was down once again and has been down ever since. I emailed him several times and he did not respond until I threatened him, saying:

Me: "Why have you not responded to my emails? If you don't reply to this one I'm making a thread on WHT and applying to Paypal for a refund."

He then responded with:

Matt: "I was out of town. Settle down. Our host is terrible and it is down again." That was the last message I got from him after sending him several more emails.

I tried to apply for a Paypal refund, but I guess you can only wait a maximum of 45 days after purchasing the service to get a refund, and I was too late. So, besides my need to rant, I figured I would just let you guys know. Once again, his username here is TemplateAlien.

Well, 1&1 has a great uptime, so it sounds like you got screwed pretty well. sorry to hear that you got the bad end of a deal.

Paypal would not refund your money, anyway. Thy have a "no refund" policy for "soft goods".

Better luck next time!

Stiffed,
and hard.

Probably some little kid $50+ richer, using your money to ruin his/her teeth.

j-

Yup, it's too bad...I just hope no one else buys advertising from him.

Paypal would not refund your money, anyway. Thy have a "no refund" policy for "soft goods"... It would count as a service, would it not? I've seen people get refunds for services before.

Yup, it's too bad...I just hope no one else buys advertising from him.

It would count as a service, would it not? I've seen people get refunds for services before.
A service is considered a soft-good (intangible) and paypal will not provide a refund for them.

Oh ok, oh well

A service is considered a soft-good (intangible) and paypal will not provide a refund for them.

If the person clicks the tangible checkbox in the complaint form, it'll go through. Then it's your job to convince PayPal otherwise -- usually they'll ignore you and give the customer the refund since you can't provide a shipping tracking number. Once I wrote in the tracking number field "NON-TANGIBLE, ONLINE SERVICE" and the dispute was closed in my favor for being a service (not covered by dispute policy).

There are no boxes where you can write your side of the story. You get three options to respond to a dispute: Accept Liability, Provide Tracking Number (little one-line input box), Provide Proof of Previous Refund (please fax proof kind of thing)

PayPal's dispute system sucks.

If the person clicks the tangible checkbox in the complaint form, it'll go through. Then it's your job to convince PayPal otherwise -- usually they'll ignore you and give the customer the refund since you can't provide a shipping tracking number. Once I wrote in the tracking number field "NON-TANGIBLE, ONLINE SERVICE" and the dispute was closed in my favor for being a service (not covered by dispute policy).

There are no boxes where you can write your side of the story. You get three options to respond to a dispute: Accept Liability, Provide Tracking Number (little one-line input box), Provide Proof of Previous Refund (please fax proof kind of thing)

PayPal's dispute system sucks.
They could do that. However, it only takes a simple e-mail to paypal to clear up the issue. Some merchants may not understand that though.

They could do that. However, it only takes a simple e-mail to paypal to clear up the issue.

I've tried that on three separate disputes, none of the emails received a personal reply (just an auto-reply of receipt), all of them referenced the dispute number. Those three disputes were all automatically closed in favor of the buyer because I couldn't provide a tracking number for a physical good that never existed.

That is unfortunate and has never happened to us before. Perhaps you are contacting the wrong address or you should give them a call, they are always much more helpful over the phone it seems.

Me: "Why have you not responded to my emails? If you don't reply to this one I'm making a thread on WHT and applying to Paypal for a refund."
You lowered yourself to his level by saying this.


John

Not really, was I supposed to sit there, say nothing, and be happy that I lost $50?

Is this post worth the $50 to you?

Making any type of threat after 2 email responses is a bit excessive.

How many days did this happen over? Obviously not many if this happened at the end of January..plus Paypal wouldn't rule in your favor...I'd suggest a better approach next time.


John

I've tried that on three separate disputes, none of the emails received a personal reply (just an auto-reply of receipt), all of them referenced the dispute number. Those three disputes were all automatically closed in favor of the buyer because I couldn't provide a tracking number for a physical good that never existed.
Odd, I got personal replies...and a phone call.

Is this post worth the $50 to you?

Making any type of threat after 2 email responses is a bit excessive.

How many days did this happen over? Obviously not many if this happened at the end of January..plus Paypal wouldn't rule in your favor...I'd suggest a better approach next time.


John
Actually, it was over 6 emails over a period of 20 days that went unanswered before I made such a threat. The website had been down about a week before I even emailed him asking what was going on. These first several emails were very friendly, and I did not threaten him with anything until after weeks of unanswered emails. The entire incident took place over a period of 45 days, I purchased the advertisement at the end of December. Also, it is not that Paypal did not rule in my favor, it is that Paypal immediately and automatically closed the ticket after filing due to the fact that it was after a 45 day period. They did not investigate it, and stated that it would be put into the customer's file incase another incident occured.

I find it disheartening and a little bit offensive that you believe you know exactly what happened after me posting a quick summary. I do not believe you have a right to reprimand me in this.

If you paid through PayPal using a credit card you can contest the charge with your credit card company.

If you paid through PayPal using a credit card you can contest the charge with your credit card company.

You can, but chances are that Paypal will promptly cancel the Paypal account. When you contest the charge, it's Paypal that you're issuing the chargeback against.

Why did you select a site that seems to be offline more than its available to advertise on in the first place ?

I'd suggest a better approach next time.


<sarcasm>

Yes, perhaps you should have chosen to allow someone to rip you off and then not bothered to warn anyone else who may have considered doing business with this person.

That would have been a much better and more community-minded solution to your problem.

</sarcasm>

Personally, I thank you for posting this thread.

Why did you select a site that seems to be offline more than its available to advertise on in the first place ?
Well, I watched the site for about a week before I decided to purchase the ad. Everything was fine until after the actual purchase, unfortunately.

And, thank you tke71709.