Upon visiting hostcentric.com a few weeks ago I was presented with a small pop-up advertising a fantastic and limited stock dedicated server offer, I clicked the pop-up and was impressed with what was on offer.

http://www.hostcentric.com/DedicatedHosting/Special_402.asp

PIII 667 Mhz processor, 128mb RAM, 20gb ide HD, 150gb bandwidth (was 512kbps capped pipe), 1 IP address, month to month contract, RH Linux.

The offer was $99.00 per month $99 setup. I have attached the proposal I was sent.

I realise the specifications were modest, but I was more concerned with the bandwidth which was 512kbps quality bandwidth (same noc as maxim.net, infact hostcentric own maxim.net).

I faxed the standard contract and proposal back etc... and was speaking to a tech a few days later giving me my shell password etc.. and running me through a few things. I was impressed intially.

Then a few days later when I went to strip out Apache and the other "software" that was on there and install my own versions I realised that I had not been given root password. I thought no problem I'll just e-mail Lowell and he'll give me it, must have forgot to give me it.

Here is the first response from Lowell.


This is a "managed" server so you do not have root access. If you need
something done in root you will need to forward your request to me and I can
open a ticket to Tech Support. We do have root access dedicated servers
available, but not at the $99 per month rate. They start at about $225 per


Was very confused on how a managed server could cost signifcantly less than an unmanaged server, but at anyrate I offered to give up any right to technical support and accept full responsibility for the server myself (i.e. if I screw up, its my fault, I pay).


Second response:


As you might expect, the $99 boxes have a standard configuration which enables the low cost.


Was he trying to tell me that they don't have root passwords???, anyways I wrote back tell him that root was a neccessity and that I know about Linux etc... Btw, the box was nothing special just a linux/apache/mysql combo poorly configured in my opinion with bash errors upon logging in.

Third response:


The main reason we won't give you root access to this box is because we have some proprietary configuration on it.


Laughable, if I wanted to grab the config I could, I had a standard shell account so I could pretty much read everything without changing/deleting it.

Anyways, he finally suggested the following:


>500 Mhz or faster processor (depending on availability)
>128MB RAm
>10GB or larger hard drive (depending on availability)
>10GB monthly data transfer
>Linux Red Hat 7.2
>mySQL database
>FTP, SSH
>Root Access
>
>$160 per month with a $150 setup fee.
>
>No Qmail
>No Frontpage
>No Technical Support


A drop in specifcations (almost half the size) and a drop to 10gb bandwidth from 150gb, a signing away of tech support and a price increate of $61 per month with an additional setup fee. Of course I instantly fax them a notice of my cancellation, it was clear they weren't serious about working with me and made no additional attempt to keep me once I told them I wished to cancel.

False advertising??? I think so, or at least very misleading, at no point was I told root access wasn't included. I know several managed dedicated companies who do not on default give out the root password but on special request and possibily a waiving of tech support would happily supply root password. Why on earth couldn't they do, surely its a case on opening the filling cabinet and e-mailing me the password, and keeping me happy for future business (now lost).

Another thought is, maybe it wasn't really a dedicated server, hence the reluctance to give the password despite my intention of future business with them, maybe they were using some sort of advanced virtual server software. Possible?

Let me know your thoughts guys and gals!

Plain Old Scam in my opinion

As I have repeatedly said, businesses should do what is right and make profits not "what our lwyers can get away with"

I am sorry to hear this, but very bad business ethics

Hmm their managed server is cheaper than unmanaged :eek:

Reverse logic? Lock it down with some strong defences. Don't provide root access. Expect this will result in less troubles over time.

A different approach...

Cheers

Gary

I am sorry to hear your problem. I have used Maxim for over 2 years and the service has been very good (maybe sometimes slow with reboots but you can always rent a reboot port from touchtone phone for $25 a month). You may want to contact sales@maxim.net directly - I believe that 'special' server is definitely located in Maxim NOC.

Let me know and I can pm main sales rep email.

ps. actually I visited their datacenter a couple of times as well - it's located in Fremont, CA and they have some cool chicks (don't say I told u!)

Sounds to me like they were cramming accounts on a VDS and telling each person they were managed..... Very Odd though...

Oh, BTW, IMHO you got screwd, sorry :( :eek:

Ugh, that stinks! If I were to guess (which I like to do occasionally :)) It seems like that was a VDS disguised as a managed server.

Greetings:

Similar in concept was several years back when we looked to get dedicated servers at some one else's data center instead of building our own.

One provider, very welll known then and today, we looked at did not provide root access.

The servers were in the $K per month but did not include root access.

We do our own server management, so we stated we needed root. They stated they will provide the server management.

We stated we didn't want their management. They stated it would not impact the price. We replied, we didn't care.

They then came back and stated if they gave us root they would have to charge a lot more.

Go figure. If it matters, we didn't go with them.

Thank you.

Hostcentric is very untrustworthy. I canceled my reseller account at the end of December when I got a server with Rackspace. My sites where always going down and a week later I would get an email response saying everything seemed OK. They continued to bill me 4 months later. I contacted them many times and they told me I would have to dispute it on my charge card. That didn't make much sense, since most banks charge about $25.00 for chargebacks. The only way I was able to stop them was to have my charge card canceled, and a new one issued. Now that you have canceled, watch your charge card.

I had a dedicated with maxim (subsidiary of hostcentric?) and they were professional and everything o.k. (everything with faxed forms etc. but fast answers to everything), just the speed to europe wasn't good

I certainly had root access, it was an unmanaged server

I was with Maxim for two whole years. When hostcentric took over, service became bad and their billing was confusing. I decided to move to colo.com and get Cogent bandwidth. Maxim added Cogent to their datacenter.

Originally posted by RackMy.com
Ugh, that stinks! If I were to guess (which I like to do occasionally ) It seems like that was a VDS disguised as a managed server.
This is the only logical explanation ...

Most likely we are satisfied with maxim.net.
We have about 20 servers and couple racks of colo space with them. They are really good when you're going to use their colo and bandwidth services.

I appreciate this open forum for responding to the varied "speculation" about what actually happened. No more quesswork required. 1st - Hostcentric's web page add for the $99 dedicated server in question clearly states it is a "managed" dedicated server. It is NOT a VDS or a VPS or any other facsimile. It is a stand alone, rack mounted, one user dedicated server with the resources listed.
2nd - The user, in his comments above, used terms like "crap" and "poorly configured" "with bash errors upon loggin in." However, here is the email he sent to Hostcentric dated 4-26;
Thanks for all your help.

I've logged into the server and everything looks great.

I look forward to bring business your way.

and again, in an email dated 5-3, he wrote:
Thank you for your offer, however at this stage I'm going to have to decline. I appreciate your help and perhaps will consider returning to Maxim.net/HostCentric when I begin to co-locate servers, the outgoing traceroutes looked very promising.

As far as the "proprietary" build on the server, Hostcentric has compiled special installs for Frontpage, Qmail and TWIG that, 1 could not have "been grabbed" by the user, nor which could be seen.

It seems only Gary from AussieHosts has a handle on marketing and pricing when it comes to "standard" product offerings. It's done all the time in other businesses. Standard, prebuilt products can always be offered at less cost than "custom" built products.

I hope this clears up the "speculations." Read the information when shopping for a product. It will usually tell you what is included and what is not. Oh, and BTW, the "managed" server is NOT in fine print. It is on the first line.
Regards,
Lowell

Lowell.... that’s a laughable argument at best... it sounds like you just want to make more $ out of the support produced on a 99 dollar a month server.

I seriously doubt you have anything so special on that server that it can't or hasn't already been reproduced by someone else.

But even then, there is so little text included with that little 99 dollar server page ad that I myself would assume I could get root upon demand, managed does not necessarily mean nor imply that the owner does not have root access.

So, next time you try and pull crap like this, be a little more forth coming on your advertisements and tell them that they don't get root access upfront.

Also, as far as your managed servers go, I'm sure it wouldn't be too terribly hard to get your custom compiled versions if people really wanted them, but then again, they are just that, custom compiled versions, I’m sure your not letting the source codes and/or un-compiled versions lay around on the server now are you? So most likely there would be a precompiled binary for that particular system setup, which isn't of much use to anyone except that server.

If the server is managed, would that not be a direct implication that all service to it, support issues, etc. are FREE? Why would you ask for more money if someone wanted you to just give them root and leave them alone with their new server? I smell scam.

You could try breaking into root, i know someone who could probably do it for you.

Just to clarify.

I mentioned the term 'crap' referring to other software on the machine that was uneccessary to myself. Nothing personal there.

I mentioned poorly configured because upon logging into bash I was presented with an error with regards to .bash_history

With regards to the e-mail everything looked great, top report was fine and spec was as listed, I was impressed with the server specs and it looks as if it would be an easy job to strip the software out and install my own versions. I wasn't going to diss them for install apache for me etc... I could easily rectify that and have a *fantastic* dedicated server (for the price).

With regards to my last e-mail I will certainly consider HostCentric/Maxim for colocation as bandwidth rates are excellent for a tier 1 providers. I never diss the connectivity and the traceroutes looked very promising. I wasn't going to start a war of words with Lowell because he was very professional just not very accomdating (see root server offer in place), and of course I wanted to make sure the contract had been cancelled and my credit card number changed.

With regards to my thread, I did feel a lot let down and wanted to let other know that the server did not include root access, I'm sure many people would naturally presume root access was included or at the very least available on request.

About the properity config, why could you not bill me for a clean install of RH, or offer me the same dedicated server with root access for the $160 per month. Still can't figure out the logic.