I don't know how people actually pay for this software. We used v2 and it had many bugs and it was confusing to use. Brandee promises v3 as the best thing ever that will have all the features we want, so instead of jumping ship just then we wait, because it will be released very soon and they are about done with the testing. This run-around continues for 6+ months and finally the software is released BUT the data in the database is a new format, and you cannot simply update, you install the new version and "import" the data.

Sounds great, no? Well version 3.0.8 they say the importer does not work, to wait for the next version where it will be re-writen. Mind you I find this out AFTER I re-purchase the new version.

Version 3.1.0 comes along and I personally set it up and import the data. Everything is messed up, because I did not make any changes to the imported data and there was no documention that indicated any changes had to be made. Then I notice the worst part, EVEN IF I had followed the correct, yet undocumented, procedure customers credit card data is not imported! We would have to request that every single one of our clients re-enter their data into our system, which would be very un-professional to do. I contact their support thinking that somehow this must be a mistake, but no there is no way to import the credit card data!

So I report the issue to their bug reporting system and Brandee personally makes it his goal to have my ticket modified so that instead of being a high priority bug, as it should be, it is a feature request and a tweak, AKA the lowest possible priority.

And to add insult to injury, one of my employees tries to login today to their forums and they were given the error message:
"Sorry, an error occurred. If you are unsure on how to use a feature, or don't know why you got this error message, try looking through the help files for more information.
The error returned was:

Your account has been temporarily suspended. This suspension is due to end on Jan 3 2006, 04:33 PM."

So not only do they start off the year with the worst VaporWare, but they also ban me and my employee from their forums!

Just a word of advise when looking for software, COMPARE, COMPARE COMPARE! Use every single trial version you can find, make a list of features, don't just jump ship with one program because it is cheap and at the time seems to do what you want, take a month to decide and dont do what we did, find a decent-looking program to later find out it is actually worse than you expected!

Hum... I'm using the trial and I have nothing to complaint... support is good so far... and even when compared with modernbill...

Think you had bad luck there!

Agreed, you may have just fell through the cracks on this one. However, we have heard many, many horrible things about V3, which is why we haven't upgraded as of yet, not until they have it all worked out. Good luck and let us know how it goes in the future.

I don't see how this is related in any way to their employees? Brandee is the owner. As for the version being vaporware, that's also false. It exists, but it does have some bugs, especially with the importer, and that's made it unusable for me.

For all it's faults, I'd say WHMAP's support is quite good. I've never failed to get help from them when I've had problems, and they go out of their way to help once they do.

And that's my main gripe, I really haven't explored the rest of the software because IMO the most important thing that should be working now is the importer, but they insist there are no problems with the software or importer and that this is a "feature request" (instead of a bug) and not only that that I am the ONLY ONE who has requested that customer's credit cards be imported.

This just got one step out of hand. I try to login to the admin area and I find this:

http://www.envisionstudio.net/whmsuspend.PNG

I can understand that they are pissed that I pointed out the truth, but to suspend my license!!?? That is flat out assinie!

That may not be the cause, and I'd strongly suggest you contact them for clarification before assuming this is the case.

I have tried to contact them but they are unresponsive. I find it odd that on the same day I am banned from their forums **AND** our license for their software is suspended.

This just got one step out of hand. I try to login to the admin area and I find this:

http://www.envisionstudio.net/whmsuspend.PNG

I can understand that they are pissed that I pointed out the truth, but to suspend my license!!?? That is flat out assinie!

That has to be illegal. You paid for the license, and they cannot just take it away because you tell people how they have been treating you. A similar thing happened to me with Whois.Cart(). You need to tell them to either reactivate your license or refund your money. Tell them that if they don't, you are prepared to do a chargeback or take legal action.

So lemme get this straight, you initiated a Paypal chargeback and expect the software to work. My experience is that Paypal will find in your favour thus giving you the software for free.

Furthermore you ring Brandee at home at midnight. I don't think you've painted a very fair picture.

I've been fed up with WHMAP and it's slow progress but I don't think I'd stoop that low.

No, my wife purchased a PHPManager license in 2003 and that license was converted to WHM AP v2 after they purchased NeoManager.

The PayPal chargeback was for the worthless (due to the non-working importer module) v3 license which should have never affected the v2 license we own which was even licensed from a totally different installation of PHPAudit (the v2 license was from http://www.whmautopilotlicensing.com/ and the v3 license was from http://www.whmautopilotlicensing.com/m/)

I don't even care if they take long, if they deliver 100% of what they promised last year in 8 months from now AND everything works I would be thrilled, but they delivered 1/2 of what was promised and it doesnt even work!

And I did not call anyone at home at midnight. Brandee's home number is publicly listed. I had jotted down his home # and business numbers on a notepad. It so happens that his home number and business fax number are 1 digit apart (home 555-1212, office fax 555-1213) and I entered the wrong number by mistake when sending a fax at midnight. The fax number is listed on their web site, but instead of looking it up I just sent it to the number I had written down, even totally forgetting I had his home number as his main office # is also one digit off for the phone number of "Image Link USA" a web host that he also owns.

Mistakes happen, its not as if I was intentionally trying to harrass someone at their home and have my issue resolved any faster, it was my fax machine trying to talk with has! Tell me you've never sent a fax by accident to someone's voice number, or mis-dialed a number on your telephone.

And none of this changes the fact that:

1) I was banned from their forum: http://www.envisionstudio.net/whmapforumbanned.PNG

2) Our PayPal address is on a totally different domain than any login at WHM AutoPilot's site and the PayPal dispute was for an order placed on a totally different system than that of which the license that we were actively using and was suspended. For that to have happened someone must have done something.

3) I made an honest mistake, I sent a fax to a wrong number and I went to sleep, my computer did the rest: http://www.envisionstudio.net/faxerrors.PNG

1) Were you rude or disruptive on that forum? That could be the reason for that. I didn't see your posts, and they aren't visible from what I could see. This is quite telling:
This suspension is due to end on Jan 3 2006, 04:33 PM
Sounds like you were causing a problem, and they gave you time to calm down. Just a guess, mind you.

2) This could be an honest mistake, or with the conversion to the new licensing system the 2 licenses were somehow mixed up. When I recently sold my non-PHPMAN license, my WHMAP went down with the same message. Turns out during the conversion to 3, I'd used the wrong one for my install. I suggest a ticket.

An existing thread on this issue can be found in our forums: http://www.whmautopilot.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9405

The user has also previously posted about the ‘importer issue’ to WHT, one of which can be found at http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?p=3578661#post3578661 where he referred to us as ‘the mafia’. You can also see my reply to the user which was one of the several times we explained the situation to him (might make more sense after reading the below).

A quick 'flip side of the coin' regarding this saga:

1) The user did indeed purchase a phpManager license, which was indeed eligible for a free upgrade to WHM.AutoPilot until February 2005. In this case, the user didn't submit the required details through the automatic converter before that point unlike hundreds of other users who did take advantage of the free upgrade. Due to the fact phpmanager only cost $49/59 and users were being issued with a license worth $149, we placed a time limit on this to ensure all users who wanted to convert did so, rather than having a few users each month for the next year asking to convert over. Users were given several months to convert over, with the deadline actually extended from Jan 31st till Feb 31st. Andrew had plenty of time to convert over, but decided against doing so for whatever reason. As such, his phpmanager license remained active for his use with the assumption he wanted to stick with phpmanager and not move over.

2) With the release of WHMAP V3, we began asking leased WHMAP users (which Andrew was one of) to reconfirm their leases as many licenses were active and being used but users weren't paying the monthly fee. This was the case with this user, and so when we asked for him to re-initiate the Paypal subscription, he asked for the free phpManager upgrade “since we were now asking him to pay”. Initially we refused due to the fact he was asking several months after the conversion deadline, however, we eventually relented and issued the license in good faith.

3) The user then wanted the ability to import credit card data. This wasn’t previously requested by our user base, hadn’t been brought up during the beta process and again wasn’t brought up during the specific period we asked for feedback on the importer. As per our standard policy as a commercial software developer, we requested the user submit his request through our online tracker for evaluation by the development team so that it could be added to the development roadmap for an appropriate release. The user did so (twice), and at the same time ‘spammed’ several other (unrelated) entries in the tracker asking us to look at his issue and ‘fix’ the importer.

4) After the spamming was deleted from the tracker and the user asked to stop, he then moved onto our forums and the support desk asking at least a dozen times when the “bug in the importer would be fixed”. We explained several times it wasn’t a bug, it was a feature request, and that it would go through our standard development process and be implemented in due course. We asked several times for him to be patient while it’s worked through; however, the user continued his ‘onslaught’ on the forums disrupting other legitimate user’s threads.

5) At this point, the user (or his employees) began calling Brandee Diggs home number at various points including 12:00am and throughout the night at such ‘inconvenient’ times, waking up his wife and 3 children on several occasions. He was asked to stop phoning the house number a couple of days ago and only use the published office phone number, however, the calls continued.

6) At some point yesterday, the user made a complaint to Paypal and disputed his lease payment(s). At which point, Brandee Diggs (the owner of WHM.AutoPilot), suspended his forum account, licenses and other access to systems relating to our product. The user’s ONLY payment to OPEN Management Group, LLC. has been for the leased license which he later reversed – his other license was a phpmanager upgrade several months after the deadline, which we were and are under no obligation to provide. I do believe however after the above thread on our forums, his license was re-activated and the issue is now being dealt with through our official support channels.

I would ask for members of the WHT community to judge this situation based on the above and the long standing experiences of the vast majority of our customers, which is usually that we provide outstanding support whether it be 2pm or 2am. Yes, we had serious problems and delays with our V3 release, however, the vast majority of our users will tell you they stayed with us during the ‘rough times’ due to the excellent support we have provided to them in the past.

To be honest, I never had a problem with WHMAP. I just moved to Mb becuase I can get it free.

A great and wise person told me one time:

"the difference between my company and your company is that you chose to check me, I can choose to deny you"

You stepped over the line and invaded someone personal life during holidays, were extremely rude and committed a fraudulent chargeback on a script you actually owe money on. You should beg for mercy, pay any upgrade fee and ask Santa for forgiveness.

"fraudulent chargeback"? How so? The v3 leased licensed purchased was worthless, why pay for it? We already owned a v2 license and that new lease should have no effect on it. If we decide to use v3 after the bugs are fixed we will follow whatever procedure they request, I think there is a $20 fee to upgrade the license to v3 and when the bugs are fixed I'd be willing to do so to give it a try and hope it has improved.

"fraudulent chargeback"? How so? The v3 leased licensed purchased was worthless, why pay for it? We already owned a v2 license and that new lease should have no effect on it. If we decide to use v3 after the bugs are fixed we will follow whatever procedure they request, I think there is a $20 fee to upgrade the license to v3 and when the bugs are fixed I'd be willing to do so to give it a try and hope it has improved.
We provide free trials of both V2 and V3 so that you can evaluate both versions prior to putting any money down. Signing up for the lease, using it, deciding it wasn't for you and then charging it back is fradulent. It is no different to having a client purchase hosting, using it for a couple of weeks and then charging back their payment.

Except we could not use it, nor obtain a date when the software will work. I still await such a date.

Except we could not use it, nor obtain a date when the software will work. I still await such a date.

The software works, the credit card details are nt retrieved by the importer yet - 2 different things.

We rarely give dates for specific features. There are too many variables to give specific dates for specific features. With new modules, it's a bit easier as they generally don't depend on updates anywhere else in the system.

If I may be so blunt, had you not spent the last week badgering us for a date, calling Brandee during the night, and insisting your feature request was actually a bug, the credit card importer actually might have been completed in time for the next release.

I did not speend the entire week calling Brandee during the night, I sent a fax to the wrong number ONE NIGHT and my fax machine attempted for ONE HOUR. This was AFTER Brandee had posted that the CC importer would not be included.

I submitted a trouble ticket for other issues in which this issue happened to be mentioned. I interacted with YOU, Alasdair on the forums and we had a few conversations in private messages. YOU, not Brandee.

If you guys are working on it, I would be glad to beta test it for you. And if it was barely included in the last release, why was it not stated? Why not a timeline "within the next month it will be developed, hopefully to be included with the next release" I didn't ask for a specifc date and hour when it would be released, I just wanted a general timeline, this month, next month, within 6 months, in 2 years, etc not "Jan 13 at 14:20 EST".

And seriously, how hard is it? If I had the source for the importer, v2 and v3 i'd do it myself in about 30 minutes.

1) When importing a client, lookup their uid in authnet_master_cc, if there is a match where master_cc = 1 then decrypt the credit card in card_info
2) While writing the imported client data to the new database, encrypt the cc data and store it in the correct place in the database.

Dude,

Grow up, let them do their job and stop harassing those who are trying to help you. With your actions here, I can only imagine what a pain in the arse you can be. Let the thread die and they will handle what needs to be handled. You're only making a bigger arse of yourself and getting absolutely no where with WHMAutopilot.

Seriously......before you go and hit that reply button, STOP and think. Posting on this board is only doing you harm and NOTHING in this thread will affect Brandee or WHMAutopilot.