i need advice, i want to get a new computer but i can't decide which i should get i'm limited on money but also i don't want my computer to die out in a year i currently have a p2 333 mhz and i'm looking to get a faster one

i know amds are cheaper so what do you guys think a decent amd system would be made for?
i'm looking at about 1.0+ ghz

and also how much do u think a p3 with a dual mb go for?
and do dual p3's really help?

regards

Originally posted by coolguy23
i need advice, i want to get a new computer but i can't decide which i should get i'm limited on money but also i don't want my computer to die out in a year i currently have a p2 333 mhz and i'm looking to get a faster one

i know amds are cheaper so what do you guys think a decent amd system would be made for?
i'm looking at about 1.0+ ghz

and also how much do u think a p3 with a dual mb go for?
and do dual p3's really help?

regards

Personally, I would go with a Pentium. I have had bad experiances with at least 10 AMD chips.

Assuming you went Pentium III, you are looking at:

Intel Pentium III Processor 1.2Ghz $160
Intel Desktop Board A&V/Sound/LAN $97

Plus any other extras...:D

Dual Motherboards are great for servers and computer systems that are of high usage and require a lot of CPU utilization. If its just going to be a personal/work PC, then a single CPU motherboard should be sufficient.

When you start talking about dual CPU's and a dual motherboard, you are looking into spending a lot more $$$$$.

I would go for AMD, but maybe that's just me.

I've personally had a great experience with them. I've put this old k6-2 of mine through hell but it's still held up great and I definately wouldn't expect anything less from a Thuderbird or Palomino core.

I've had trouble with my AMD Thunderbird...

I'm running the exact same desktop sofware as I'm running on a PIII and the Thunderbird seems to "slow-way-down" if I leave it on for more than 24 hours. I've tried swapping the memory and it has this huge cpu heatsink cooling fan.

What I mean by "slow-way-down", is that this usually fast machine might take five minutes to open or close Microsoft Word. Not a normal thing... the machine has never been connected to the internet... I've scanned for viruses and I've even formatted the hard drive and done a complete step-by-step reloading of all the software.

I would not buy another AMD processor...


Just my humble opinion,

Keith

Well. I would have to say go with AMD. (For a home computer)
The prices are cheap and they perform better. You don't have any problems with them if they are cooled properly (buy a nice heatsink). That's the number one problem with people who use AMD cpus, they don't cool it right. If they do have a nice heatsink, they have no fans or one fan in their case. Cool your AMD properly, and you'll be happy. I have ONE pentium in my house and that's an old server. I'm very happy. Pentiums aren't worth the cost for a home computer..IMHO.

But.. for servers. I would say dual pentium combo. Although AMDs would be probley fine, I'm stuck in that mode.

Well, I respect your opinion, JayJay, but with mine I've done everything but put in central air...

My PIII seems to have no problems in the same enviornment, however.

Again, this is just my experience with one AMD Thunderbird... maybe I just got one made on 4:59pm on Friday afternoon just before a holiday weekend. *Just my luck*

Oh well...

:)

hey.. it could happen ;P

man this is what i mean, some ppl say its horrible others say its the best!
i can't decide, for sure i know i have to get a good cooling system for an amd as it makes so much more heat than a pentium, but i live in canada so do u think leaving it outside in the winter will do?
lol j.k

well this is bascally what i'm looking for
a $150 cpu either a p3 1 ghz or some amd processor
a good mb, should be 70-100 ( i don't want 1 that i can't upgrade stuff on it, like my current one)
and the usual (40 gb, 256 mb ram, cd drive, floppy)
no monitor as i already have 1 so what do u think is a resonable price for all this?

<well this is bascally what i'm looking for
a $150 cpu either a p3 1 ghz or some amd processor
a good mb, should be 70-100 ( i don't want 1 that i can't upgrade stuff on it, like my current one)
and the usual (40 gb, 256 mb ram, cd drive, floppy)
no monitor as i already have 1 so what do u think is a resonable price for all this?>

AMD Athlon XP Desktop 1800+ Socket A CPU 266MHZ FSB Retail Box $132.00
Nice Heatsink $30ish
Motherboard.. all depends on what type of ram you want. You can find a good abit or asus for cheap. Depending what you like. I'd say $90.00 will get you a decent board.
Maxtor 40 GB 7200 RPM ATA133 - 6L040J2 $80.00
etc etc etc

You could probley get a weaker CPU to save on money.

Those prices are retail from www.compuplus.com

is that a 1800 mhz or is it smaller?
well it sounds good for a $132 cpu how much is a xp 1900 or a 2000?
and do u think that i would be able to make all of this under 500 and maybe have money for a vid and sound card?

thanks again

1800xp is really 1.5Ghz range.
They call it the 1800 because they say their CPUs perform the same as a Pentium that's 300mhz "faster". But you probley knew that.

www.pricewatch.com you can find some retailers.

I prefer www.compuplus.com but that's because they are in my state and my company orders from them.

Look up some prices and dump money into the american economy! lol :) :)

now that's the problem....i live in canada so i need to ask someone to buy these things for me from a store u think that it's cheap and then ship it to me as a gift ( no import tax ;)) and maybe if they can fix it up like put it together i can pay extra, anyone willing to do this for me?
i really doubt it but i'll just ask

Ive not had expeirnce with both, and have not had expeirnce with amd xp/thunderbird so my opinion is useless but I like AMDs cpus all the way! Mainly from benchmarks and other users opinions I have read.

I'd say get an AMD.

I have had both a P3 and now an Athlon. My Dad has a Duron. Here's a story if you care to read it

I got my p3 550, and my Dad's duron 700 (I think) and it probably out-performed my computer, granted, mine was a dell and his was home built. It had a ton of problems. I will admit that Pentiums aren't bad, but i'm not buying them again :/

I recently upgraded to an Athlon XP 1700+ and it has been well worth it. But it's usually personal preference and the amount of money you have to spend, but if you have the money, buy a faster AMD :)

AMD gets my vote.
I have to AMD CPU's. Athalon 850 and k6-2 550.
Both work really well, for me at least...

I'm the kind of person that would just buy a new machine and use the old 333 for a development box. Because it always seems by time you replace everything in the machine, you've spent enough for a new machine.

Everyone probably knows I'm a big fan of emachines by now. Their low end machine right now is only $399.

Intel Celeron 1GHz
128MB Ram
20GB HD
48X CDROM Drive

Of course, you specifically mention AMD, so they have one for $599 with

AMD Athlon XP 1600
256MB Ram
40GB HD
16X CD-RW Drive

They all come with speakers, a new keyboard, mouse, a v.92 modem, Windows XP, audio, and anything ranging from generic AGP 3D video to a S3 Savage 4 Pro.

As far as getting a two processor machine, it will help if you want to run an OS that will support it, and if you're going to be doing some heavy duty stuff on it, like multimedia.

I got a factory refurbished dual processor poweredge server from dell for about $1400. Had to add the stuff like a video card and audio. They still have the 3 year warranty. And if you want, just buy a single processor machine and expand to two later, as long as you buy the right model.

My vote goes to AMD! If you go read reviews at cnet.com or anandtech, the AMD 1600+ outperforms the Intel 2ghz by a considerable percentage.

It used to lose out to Intel in gaming but now it outperforms Intel in almost every aspect.

And not to mention it's cheaper.

My first AMD was a k62-300mhz, and now I have been running an Athlon 700mhz for about 2 years already and it's very alive!

Never been happier with my 1.33Ghz thunderbird :D

I've had no problems with my athlon 1ghz or the 1.3 system that i beat to hell ona regular basis.. So my vote is AMD as well.

Originally posted by xharine
My vote goes to AMD! If you go read reviews at cnet.com or anandtech, the AMD 1600+ outperforms the Intel 2ghz by a considerable percentage.

It used to lose out to Intel in gaming but now it outperforms Intel in almost every aspect.

And not to mention it's cheaper.

My first AMD was a k62-300mhz, and now I have been running an Athlon 700mhz for about 2 years already and it's very alive!

This is correct. AMD has always (at least in the past 5+ years) outperformed Intel processors of the same speed. The problem with Intel is they will state their speed (i.e. 1.5GHz) but won't even run at that speed. AMD will state their speed (i.e. 1.6GHz) and will run at that speed or better. Every benchmark test I've run has proven this all the way back to the 233MHz era. Not to mention all the reviews available on sites like cnet, etc.

I will not use Intel because of the speed differential and the price. But, it is entirely a preference.

BTW, my main PC is an AMD Athlon XP 1800+ and my server is an AMD Athlon Thunderbird 1.2GHz w/266FSB. I do have a Dell Inspiron 8000 laptop that has an Intel processor in it but I'm looking into seeing if that can accept a upgrade to AMD...:D

Get Pentium IV, i wont recommend AMD, it was some how faster than pentium before. But its not faster now.
If you want to buy from 1.4 - 1.7 Buy an AMD.
As i assemble and sell computers, i have tested all of them.
Here is the story.
I tested an AMD 1.4, 512 MB DDRAM, it was really double as the speed of pentium IV 1.4.
Pentium IV have really bad processors from 1.4 - 1.7, after that 1.8 was fair, but 1.9 was good. 2.0 excellent, 2.2 outstanding with all 450 MHZ bus speed. A little less than a double of AMD's.
2.5 Ghz is out, and AMD is still less in my country, here AMD 1.8 i think is the max. And is slower than pentium.

I would highly recommend Pentium IV 2.0 - 2.5 GHZ. with a 512 mb DDRAM. And dont forget to buy a good Intel Mainboard.
I have seen most of the speed depends on the mainboard, i got a bad mainboard with 2.5 Ghz processor, and it was slower than PIII 800 mhz.

If you cant afford 2.0 - 2.5 Ghz then the best for you is PIII 1.0 - 1.2 GHz. Its not PIV, i am saying PIII, bcs PIV 1.0 is really bad.

Check out these articles:

AMD's Athlon XP 1900+ (1.6GHz): Still #1 (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1554)

AMD's Athlon XP 2000+ vs Intel's 0.13-micron Northwood (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1574)

AMD is NOT slower than pentium, in fact the AMD 2000+ which is really 1.8ghz outperforms the Intel 2.2ghz......

400mhz diff but still performs better......

Originally posted by coolguy23
man this is what i mean, some ppl say its horrible others say its the best!
i can't decide, for sure i know i have to get a good cooling system for an amd as it makes so much more heat than a pentium, but i live in canada so do u think leaving it outside in the winter will do?
lol j.k

well this is bascally what i'm looking for
a $150 cpu either a p3 1 ghz or some amd processor
a good mb, should be 70-100 ( i don't want 1 that i can't upgrade stuff on it, like my current one)
and the usual (40 gb, 256 mb ram, cd drive, floppy)
no monitor as i already have 1 so what do u think is a resonable price for all this?

Just get a CoolerMaster heatsink & fan for your AMD and it will be fine.
Been running a 1Ghz AMD for general use for nearly 18 months now, its on 18+ hours per day, absolutely no problems.

oh yes and that is another concern, will i be able to leave my amd on for continuous days?
i've left my p2 333 mhz for over 2 weeks now with out resetting and hasn't really had any problems...is it the same result with the amd?

Every AMD I've had, it's gotten abused.

I have a 1.4Ghz in my main machine and I haven't turned this machine off since August or July. I forget.

I rebooted maybe like 20-30 times during then. But just reboots.

sounds good, seems that i have decided that i want an amd 1800 which i believe is under or just a little over 150
now i just need a good supplier
what's a good place to buy computer parts that have low prices and also ship to canada?

I haven't had any bad experiences with AMD processors, they seem like a solid platform.

coolguy, where do you live exactly? If around Toronto I would reccommend these 2 places - www.icctcomputer.com and www.pccanada.com I've gotten a couple computers from pccanada and dozens of parts from icct.

I would go for AMD as well. We have a K6-2 500mhz, Athlon 650, and Athlon T-Bird 1000, no troubles with any of them. :)

yes that is exactly where i live, toronto, ontario
thanks for the sites

another question....which is better? sdram or ddr ram?

Originally posted by coolguy23
another question....which is better? sdram or ddr ram?

DDR RAM is better, although a form of SDRAM. See quote below from whatis.com

DDR SDRAM (double data rate SDRAM) is synchronous dynamic RAM (SDRAM) that can theoretically improve memory clock speed to at least 200 MHz*. It activates output on both the rising and falling edge of the system clock rather than on just the rising edge, potentially doubling output.

also, what is the difference between pc2700 ddr ram stick and a pc1600 ddr ram stick?

thanks again

I will definitely suggest AMD to anyone for home or office use. These processors are great performers. AMD thunderbird is very hot processor but never had a problem with it. Well, I am AMD dude, I only had AMD in my company in all computers.

but for servers I guess AMD is big NO until it doesn't have overheat protection like Intel processor. :)

Personally I run both AMD + Intel processors at different places (AMD Athlon XP 1600 @ home, and PIII 800/PIV 1.4 @ work), and while both run superbly, my vote goes to AMD, as they are better in terms of value for money vs. processing power, ounce by ounce.

I would however recommend good cooling (such as Volcano) for AMD processors in order to extract maximum usage. I use the following combo at home and it cost me a bit less (and gave me a bit more power) than for a similarly-powered PIV combo:

AMD Athlon XP 1600
256MB DDR RAM
EPoX 8KHA+ mobo

Considering my AMD Athlon XP 1900+ burned out on it's first run (cooling was all 100%, so it wasn't my fault) I'd say Pentium, but then, I just bought a new Athlon, I must be crazy :stickout
Luckily the second one didn't burn out and is running smooth as a baby's bottom. Guess I just had I bad chip, only I couldn't proove it and lost my money. That's also why I'd say Pentium. A pentium chip is guaranteed against everything while AMD chips for all intents and purposes basicly have no guarantee what so ever.

Originally posted by Tazzman
...A pentium chip is guaranteed against everything while AMD chips for all intents and purposes basicly have no guarantee what so ever...

That is an incorrect statement. AMD chips are guaranteed as long as you use an AMD tested and approved processor fan. Most retailers or resellers won't sell you the chip without an AMD approved fan. Plus, depending on where you purchased the chip, they should have a return/exchange policy for this exact reason. If they don't then I wouldn't of bought the chip from them to begin with. This is just my thoughts on the topic since I have had to deal with returns/exchanges in the past for my company and have never had an issue whatsoever.

Check the below site for Athlon Recommended Thermal Solutions:
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/SellAMDProducts/0,,30_177_3641_759^1039^1050,00.html

Originally posted by coolguy23
also, what is the difference between pc2700 ddr ram stick and a pc1600 ddr ram stick?

Completely missed this question. The difference is the PC2700 memory is faster (in MHz) than the PC1600 memory. Some motherboards will only support up to a certain type of DDR memory. Although with technology ever-changing, it is more likely that if you see a motherboard that supports DDR memory, it will support all types. Hope that information helps.

the number after the ddr bit refers to the bandwidth available.
ddr 1600 runs at 100 mhz dual pumped to 200 and can push 1600 mbps
ddr 2100 runs at 133 mhz dual pumped to 266 and can push 2100 mbps
ddr 2700 runs at 166 mhz dual pumped to 333 (i know it should be 332 but they like 333) and can push 2700 mbps.

what the motherboard can take will depend on what it will allow you to run the fsb at and whether it can cope properly with running the memory asychronously without falling over too often.

Well, AMD and Intel... Both are great CPUs..
So choose what you will. I guess you won't go wrong with either one.

Now, personally, I have gone with AMD XP and Intel 3 series.
I have a PC with P3 then upgraded to AMD XP 1600 cpu with good cooling.

I haven't had problem from neither of them, AMD and Intel.

Don't listen to anyone that says AMD's cpus are unstable while Intels cpu's are stable. They are both equally stable. If you put crappy parts in any system it could make either system unstable. AMD is definitely the current price/performance leader and has been for quite awhile. The Top AMD Cpu and Top Intel cpu are pretty much even in performance so neither can really claim victory. Do not compare mhz ratings between the 2 as its quite clear that mhz does NOT = power. If that was the case Intel would blow Amd completely off the map, but as you can see AMD despite having a 500/600mhz disadvantage is all over Intel. So, mhz does not = performance. Also I have built plenty of AMD and Intel systems and have not had any problems with either. My current recommendation right now is with AMD. The price and performance cannot be beat. Perfect for any use you want. Home or Server.


Jason

I've been running AMD for years, and often with my older AMD, I had problems with the CPU fan -- and after soldering the wires too many times, and lack of time to get out and find one, I just left it off, and for a long time -- and the thing might have gotten hot, but it never had any problems without the CPU fan. Now, I'm running an AMD Athlon Thunderbird 1.4 GHZ and it's a better, faster CPU -- and I'd not dare run this without a fan, of course. However, my board has a setting in BIOS where I can monitor the temperature of the CPU and within the case -- as well as the speed of the CPU fan on the Heatsink (it's pretty simple -- the fan doesn't work, doesn't cool it enough or the CPU gets over a certain degree, it'll shut it down and prevent any damage -- but I bet that never happens). I've been running this for a few weeks, pretty hard, and I've not had any problems. I guess some people have had problems with AMD, maybe a bad chip or maybe the wrong voltage, or who knows what (by reports here), but I've never personally met anyone that had a problem with any AMD chip, and I don't know for sure if I know if anyone had any problems with Pentium either. I have issues with the Pentium chips, but not for their performance per se (just what can add to problems and things I disagree with in the design). I agree with most other's, when they say that either will be fine. If you want AMD, get it. Some places won't let you get a refund for a bad CPU, but any place that's decent will give you a replacement if it's bad (provided you have a real Heatsink made to work with it and don't go overclocking it -- they just want to be sure they don't have to replace CPU's from people experimenting and the like). I really don't see the argument here. AMD is good, fast and stable. Pentium is pretty much the same in a lot of regard, but I prefer AMD and have never had a problem. If I did, I'd probably just replace it with another one, before I'd go for Pentium, because I'd know it was likely just a bad chip, and not anything to do with the brand.