What do you do when a customer asks "where do you get your servers from"? Do you lie to them and say the first company that comes to mind or do you tell the truth and say your a reseller?

There's only one thing worse than a theif...and that's a liar.

Cheers

Gary

I agree, but its a good thing to find out, because some customers might have a negative reaction to being hosted by a reseller. I never had a problem being hosted by a reseller but it would have been nice if they told me when I asked instead of when I left them.

Originally posted by Zero
What do you do when a customer asks "where do you get your servers from"? Do you lie to them and say the first company that comes to mind or do you tell the truth and say your a reseller?

If you are asked the question "where do you get your servers from" you can, truthfully, name your provider. Based on that question.. you do not need to tell them that you are reseller or if you use a dedicated server, as they didn't ask that. If they wish to know if you are a reseller, only answer when they ask that question (ie " are you a reseller ?").

Only answer the question given.

Originally posted by Warp


If you are asked the question "where do you get your servers from" you can, truthfully, name your provider. Based on that question.. you do not need to tell them that you are reseller or if you use a dedicated server, as they didn't ask that. If they wish to know if you are a reseller, only answer when they ask that question (ie " are you a reseller ?").

Only answer the question given.

True but if someone said mchost.com for example the person would go check it out and find they only offer reseller packages no dedicateds. So in this case it would better be stating who mchost gets their servers from.

Yes, just say, "Our servers are in Rackshack". But if you are asked directly, then you should admit to being a reseller. Most people ask to test your honesty. :)

Truth sucks, but id tell the truth to my customers :) i was mostly checking to see what you people think of it.

Originally posted by Myacen
True but if someone said mchost.com for example the person would go check it out and find they only offer reseller packages no dedicateds. So in this case it would better be stating who mchost gets their servers from.

We do actually offer dedicated servers, just not yet officially. You will find that 95% of all resellers don't want to reveal that they're resellers. In my opinion, thats fine. If you sell home-made cookies and someone asks where you got them from you're not going to point them to the big store a few blocks down the road. There is also nothing wrong with being a reseller. Resellers usually provide more features than other hosting companies ...such as design services, personal support, etc.

IMO, reselling is the wrong word for hosting companies who use mchost as a supplier. Mchost are in the business of managing boxes and then leasing out sections of each box to hosting providers who then source, supply and support their own clients etc. You might lease a part of a server or a whole server. That does not make you a reseller of mchost hosting.

This is a long way from reselling accounts to clients that a web host has setup for you.

Robert, it's reselling mate. You're not provided with a dedicated section (ala virtual dedicated server) and you have no control over the top end of the server (well, that's not always the case and we've seen the nasty results of that :-).

The other situation you speak of...onselling accounts set up by the provider...is what's done in the capacity of an affiliate or a partner.

Cheers

Gary

You could look at it in that angle but it's a big Universe mate with lots of angles and different ways of looking at things. We're talking web hosting here, not universal laws of nature or anything. Who makes the rules and the definitions that you speak of anyway?

I see them as a supplier and you're leasing part of the server etc. I don't see myself as a reseller for mchost. They supply me with access to the server and I in turn source, supply and support my clients.

I am about to jump into the dedicated realm. My cashflow and level of clientel warrants this. They still supply me with access but it's a different level of access. I now have the whole box to myself. But according to your understanding and interpretation, I am not a reseller anymore.

Anyway, tossing up between Rackshack, Dialtone, Dv2. You've had a good run with rackshack I understand. I like their Compaq line of servers. The dual PIII with 1GB Ram looks sweet. :)

I work only with local customers that are launching a website for the first time so I don't get asked often. When asked, however, I state that our webserver is rented from a service provider. I use MCHost so that is basically truthful.

Yo Zero

Well, you can tell the truth, lie, or (now this is my favourite), say that you have partnered with a hosting company to bring your customers some of the lowest prices in the industry!


Now, why do I give my tips away like that?

Originally posted by Turboz
Yo Zero

Well, you can tell the truth, lie, or (now this is my favourite), say that you have partnered with a hosting company to bring your customers some of the lowest prices in the industry!


Now, why do I give my tips away like that?

But you havnt technicaly partnered with them.

Originally posted by Zero


But you havnt technicaly partnered with them.

well no one likes to host with a reseller that doesn't have a clue

Originally posted by Zero


But you havnt technicaly partnered with them.

But your customers will never know that :)

Originally posted by Turboz


But your customers will never know that :)

unless they ask them :)

You don't have to tell them who you partnered with

"We've partnered with a leader in the industry to bring you some of the lowest prices the hosting industry has ever seen"


Get my drift?

:)

Their's a way around every problem.... It's just impossible to advertise your hosting business :(

Tell them yes you are a reseller if they push for it. But also explain to them that a lot of people are resellers. CompUSA didnt make that Compaq that you bought last month for the office and neither did Shop Rite make the Hershey's Choclate bar.

If they ask what kind of servers you are using, tell them we are running dual P3's and SCSI hdd's in RAID 1 for data integrity with daily tape backups. _IF_ thats what the sites are really on, wether or not you are reselling them they didnt ask, but if they do be honest and say yes, and than explain to them how lots of people are resellers because if you had to go to 30 different stores to do your grocery shopping, it would be a pain.

Actually I dont think this is a question of being a reseller. In fact most times you will actually get better service from going with a reseller than you would the original host because reseller's tend to be me personal with their clients. This is not always the case but there is nothing wrong with being a reseller as mentioned numerous times in this particular thread.

The real problem comes when you falsely state things that are not true in hopes the client will never figure it out. My advice is to be up front with them because they will figure it out and when they do you will be the one to pay in the long run. Where as if you are up front and honest with them, even if they dont choose you because of this, you will have gained trust in them.

Keep in mind even though you may have personal name servers and the like, there are numerous other ways of revealing who your upstream source is, and lying about it only will make things worse.

I second everything Brian says in the previous post.

Assuming you're aiming at establishing an online business for the long-term, then IMO your most valuable asset will be your credibility. Even though you can establish a degree of trust early on, credibility will take longer to establish thru performance.

Therefore I believe that the only effective long-term approach is honesty. Honesty - from a customer's viewpoint - is about much more than not being dishonest. It's about being up-front, and making clear that you have their best interests at heart.

For example, you can be "not dishonest" by revealing extra charges in your ToS. But we all know many people don't read ToS closely, and your customer won't welcome a surprise in their monthly bill. Alternatively, you can be 'honest' by stating the extras in your front page marketing spiel where customers are guaranteed to see it.

This is not just a moral choice - I believe clear honesty will put much more money in your pocket long-term. The ultimate marketing tool for any online business is to have your customers singing your praises to their contacts - which will not happen to any extent by being 'not dishonest'.

Originally posted by Aussie Bob
IMO, reselling is the wrong word for hosting companies who use mchost as a supplier. Mchost are in the business of managing boxes and then leasing out sections of each box to hosting providers who then source, supply and support their own clients etc. You might lease a part of a server or a whole server. That does not make you a reseller of mchost hosting.

This is a long way from reselling accounts to clients that a web host has setup for you.

Thats a good way of seeing it.

In the end, almost everyone is a reseller in one way or another....

Thats a good way of seeing it.

In the end, almost everyone is a reseller in one way or another....

I agree. Except I see them as *retailers*. Most pay a fee to buy wholesale or buy a large amount of space at wholesale and retail it to their customers.

I see no diiference between this and what Walmart does.

If were in the position and someone asked "are you a reseller", I would politely say "no, I'm a retailer". ;)

~bud

Originally posted by Editor
There's only one thing worse than a theif...and that's a liar.

Cheers

Gary

I agree with Gary.. Tell them what you are doing and with who, it will be worth it in the end.

Those who buy in bulk are "a reseller of disk space and data" essentially, opposed to a standard reseller who resells ready-made plans that they have no control over at all.

It's the public's perception that in the end matters, and if someone wants to answer no, then fine and then deal with the next question asked possibly which could be "do you own your own servers" and hence rests the problematic answer. Do you answer no, but ...... or say we lease space and data on servers?

It would be the perception of the customer to decide what is true, or false based on the viewpoint given as to the answers given, but this is also where the "host" can either shoot themself in the foot, or elaborate to the potential customer that they are a registered business, and so on to ease the concern a customer may have in their mind that the "host" may not be around for too long.

This is the continual trouble for the customer, and we as hosts whether larger or smaller should think about that point a little more, than just being a glancing thought . This problem is self inflicted of sorts with those who decide "I want to be a host" yet are able to get their disk space and data, yet think about the other important things like being a business and having a clue where they are going.

Those that do the right thing arent doing it just for legal reasons but also for the sake and benefit of the customer.....and those people should be rewarded for their insight, and hats off to you !!!

Point is that it goes further than just lying, and looking at the whole picture, to understand why it's become a customer's issue.

Very well said and thank you. ;)

I think the best answer is to say we have our servers with ----- compnay. Since I will be planing to use several companies plus my own dedicated Raq server I will tell them that our servers are hosted and maintained by such and such companies. No need to hide anything. After all
Every host is reselling some one elses resources!

I tell them the truth, which is that I use RackSpace.com servers, which still hides the fact that I resell for InfiniteDimensions.com

I don't completely hide the fact that I resell for InfiniteDimensions.com, and I would certainly not lie to a customer, but on the other hand it does me no good to advertise the fact that I resell for InfiniteDimensions.com, because then my potential customers would think 'Well wouldn't I be better off signing up with InfiniteDimensions directly?'

Whilst telling every customer who you resell for is likely to turn you into a referrer rather than a reseller, getting caught lying could be very bad for business. Decide where the line is just like you would with a moral dilema. What makes everybody happy?

The honesty I've seen in this thread gives me a renewed sense of hope for the web hosting industry. Bravo.
What do you think of saying We're "powered by" xxxxx hosting company? It's worked well for the hosting I sell with my applications.

In my case, I do actually have a strong relationship with the hosting company whose resources I resell. I didn't just sign up to a company that looked good, I actually got to know an individual personally and then began reselling his hosting companys resources. I would never wish to be one of the resellers who resell for faceless companies. I cannot stress enough how much it has helped my company that I have this strong relationship with the company from which I purchase the resources that I sell.

In fact everyone of us on these forums are resellers (or retailers as stated).

Also I liked the ideea to be "powered by". Though this will get you in the direct competition with your reseller so ... in real world you have to be honest to the point where you still can make money and stay in business.

The fine line between lie and truth must be carefully drawn and maybe we can create some sort of
WEB HOSTING UNION
to supervise each other and create a positive opinion to all our companies.
;)

(i'll make a poll about this)

Iv'e thought about this long and hard before deciding to resell our hosting companies product along with our own.

Basically those who have stated that all of us are resellers are correct up to a point. The company I work with owns their own NOC. They were inside the Verio network and then moved into their own operations center. I'm not reselling a resellers package. This allows the reseller to sell resources with the support of a major player.

Resellers resell just as the company who owns (leases) the NOC resells. No one truly owns the bandwidth. Bandwidth is "resold many times over" before you ever pull up the page that it uses.

The NOC is leasing the building and much of the hardware and purchasing larger amounts of bandwidth than I can afford. I then turn and puchase one of their allotments and sell under my own brand.

The question was a good one. Just as "Who's Terms of Service" should we use?

Fortunately, the company I work with is well known around here. They offer a managed reseller environment that allows the reseller to "offer a good service" to the public.

Now why would this company not want to just sell the resources for themselves?

Simple, Becuase I wouldn't be there to sell it for them. They mostly manage the servers and maintain an openline of communitcations with those they host. Tech Support.

I enjoyed this thread and the question. If anyone asks our company (and yes we are a registered company) I most likely would answer that we work closely with several companies including "NOC OWNER" to provide the service we do.

It's not shameful to be a reseller. It's a great opportunity. The problem is the lying and the kids who jump into this who offer to much for too little, have no experience in the business world, no legally state registered business, and find themselves having to explain why they don't have "real tech" support.

Management, business experience, education within these realms, a license to do business, and a form of business insurance allows one to call themselves a reseller or a company.
(Insurance statement simply becuase of local laws requiring businesses to carry coverage including false advertisement rider. This may vary state to state.)

Look at Verio. You would have no idea who rents from these people. Huge corps resell verio resources all day long and you don't even know it when you hit their page. Wouldn't think of large corps being "resellers" now would you?

So unless my host can prove to me that they own and produce their own bandwidth and that they own outright the building, servers, routers, etc....... Then THEY TOO ARE A RESELLER.

"No one owns anything at all. We are just using it as we pass through!"

:) The term "Reseller" doesn't sound so bad now does it?

In definitive terms, you are somewhat correct and at the end of the day, it all comes down to the perception of the customer as to the relevance of such terms. This fact to them upon finding a resource like this would place some doubt in their minds if you look through posts made by those wanting to resell, and this is where analysing the customers viewpoints and wants is where the buck stops.

At the end of the day, they want a product or service that is delivered, relaible, and feel comfortable in the fact that the retailer as such will be there tomorrow or in 6 months if they have saved 5 or 10 % and paid upfront. To the uninitiated customer, they wouldnt have a clue to this and would be blind to the fact of there being any difference, although more are doing more research nowadays, hence the stigma.

Well, *I* will not do business with certain vendors. ***** is one. If I ask and am lied to, and find the system is hosted through *****, I will DEMAND a refund, etc.... In such a case, it wouldn't take me long to determine it is a ***** system, and your lie would just cause trouble.

Just say the truth. MANY companies are resellers, and EVERYONE sells bandwidth they themselves got from some other company. So just join the pack and admit it.

Steve

Just a couple of observations from someone who's status under this board is newbie but who's experience is anything but "new".
Its really easy in a forum like this to begin making assumptions including assumptions about the type of customer asking the question.. I haven't noticed anyone's answer starting with "it depends on the technical knowledge/background of the customer..."
If the question i s from a tech junkie who wants to know all the specs of the server etc.then tell them you resell using whatever the specs are.
If the question is from someone wanting to assess your "viability" tell them the truth too
If it's from me...tell me the truth cos I sure as hell can trace your network, your carriers, your domain name registra, your IP blocks owners etc etc....
in other words don't be clever, don't be deceptive.. just tell the truth as it relates to the level of your customer's enquiry since nothing sours faster than dealing with someone who lied to you to get your business.

Hello
I think we have only been asked twice if we are resellers (ever)
so I am not sure you are going to get asked that often.........

Gordon

Originally posted by GordonH
I think we have only been asked twice if we are resellers

And? Are you a reseller?
:D
Just kidding.

What about if a customer directly asks you who your provider is? Is it safe to say "I would prefer not to disclose that at this time" and just let the customer leave if they for some reason decide they must?

Ok, you've got 2 boxes at RS, 1 at DV2 and 3 at Pwebtech. Are you a "reseller"?

In my opinion and in simple layman terms:

1) If you don't have an actual reseller account (getting bulk shares bandwidth/disk space on a server), then you do not qualify as one in web hosting terms.

2) If you have server(s), you qualify as a supplier(provide reselling sometimes) as you are getting it from the wholesaler(provide server service only)

3) Likewise the wholesalers are getting it from the manufacturer(bandwidth provider)

One can be in any category if they have or provide all the above which is very unlikely.

For discussion case, yes I guess everyone is a reseller(if you buy & sell for profit ).

On topic, I believe honesty is the best policy, don't lie ....which means that you can bend it as much you want to suit your needs but don't break it.

OK
Who makes their own photons and electrons?

Ultimately we are all resellers.


Gordon

If asked I would not lie about it (myself), for one it goes against my morals even if it means loosing a sale and secondly honesty is the best policy. :)

When we were resellers we didn't sell exactly the same product as the supplier, we basically acted as brokers sourcing from various places to provide exactly what the customer required.
This was understood by the customers
It made thier lives easier and they were happy to pay a premium for the assistance.

Thats how we handled it.

Gordon

I haven't thought of that, it's a great idea suggested by GordonH although we see it all the time as in the broker and retailing business without realizing it.

Yup, I am going to work out something nice or maybe someone could suggest some good answers should the propective customer ask if you are a reseller the next time.

From GordonH's suggestion maybe telling the clients that we are brokers or retailers in simple terms , so we can provide the best features in a hosting package that we get from different sources not available from one provider.

Well....
I would tell them that I resell.... and also eksplain why I do it, and how this is good for the custumer...
Like, if you tell them about how mutch a server costs... The server, firewalls, backup, to make the room fire proof, to cool down the room and remove humidity, secure it against theft, maintance, tecnhical personell, 24/7 survilance, UPS, power generator etc.... I think they would get the picture....
As a reseller you dont have to worry about this, and your services might be cheaper...
It actually remindes me about outscoring... witch seemes to be popular these days

Well....
I would tell them that I resell.... and also eksplain why I do it, and how this is good for the custumer...
Like, if you tell them about how mutch a server costs... The server, firewalls, backup, to make the room fire proof, to cool down the room and remove humidity, secure it against theft, maintance, tecnhical personell, 24/7 survilance, UPS, power generator etc.... I think they would get the picture....
As a reseller you dont have to worry about this, and your services might be cheaper...
It actually remindes me about outscoring... witch seemes to be popular these days

It is not lieing,Tell people where your servers are (the datacenter) dont tell them who you lease them from ;).Its not realy lieing since you are just telling them where the servers are located.

Maybe you should look at the SPIRIT, and not the LETTER of the question! The ONLY reason *I* would care if you are a reseller is:

1. Do I deal with YOU directly?
2. Are you ultimately responsible and able to correct problems I have?

If you have FULL control of a DEDICATED server, and can change ALL the software, the answer is YES! If the system is tied to third parties, like *****, or you have limited access and/or capability, the answer is NO!!!!

SIMPLE, HUH?

If I was asked about my servers and was a, say, MCHost reseller, I would say this:

"Our server is on the x network" and replace x with whatever NOC MCHost hosts their servers with.

You wouldn't be lying if you said that.

I'm not a reseller so I wouldn't know how well that would go over, but it seems like it would sastisfy the customer.

what people dont know wont hurt them . I would never come out and say , yes i resell this companys product . These companys are here for us to cobrand and sell the product as if it was our very own . As long as your service ,support and prices are good , i dont think anyone would care .

case

Aristotle has written some 2000 years back that there are two kinds of falsehood [supressio veri and suggestivo falsi -hiding the truth and speaking a lie]

When I was a reseller of Splash, I put on my web site that our sites are hosted on a server that is a dual PIII with SCSI harddisk and it is located in nac.net

Which is 100% true - only I never told my customers that I share the server with others; if I am asked I tell that I am a reseller

Only Choon of choonhost.net will have the courage to put it in his signature! :)

I think the reseller has to use his judgement in a situation and say what (s)he feels is right under the circumstances

Besides, it is perfect coporate dharma to lie - all businesses lie , else you just cannot be successful in business. You have to ensure that your lies are white lies and the motive is to hide info and not to take advantage of the customer

Cheers
Balaji