I posted this towards a remark made by: VoxxitDesigns

Just because people charge less then others, it doesnt mean the quality of their work is poor. I charge little because designing sites and coding is something I love doing. I dont pay bills, I have no real need for money. I only ask for money so I have something to spend if the time comes. I know many here only have one job-webdesign, I know they charge alot because they need to pay bills and support themselves. Im just stating, I would charge the same if I had to pay bills and such, but I dont so I charge very little.

So do you think if a designer charges lesser then someone else, is his work "bad" compared with those who charge more?
Alot of business have started by charging a competitive price for things, but as the company gets more demand and a acceptable supply, the company is making more money then needed to support themselve(s). Often times, these companies start charging lesser for things they had charged alot for. Just because I charge $40 for a blog coding/design, and another charges $150, does that mean that what I do is bad?

No, by no means at all does it - but, by majority, it is. It is a statistical fact that most, lower-priced work is worse than the higher priced. You go buy some of, say, Netto's own bread for 29p, it won't be as good as, say, Hovis' best brand for 79p.

Sure, your work may be great, but in some cases, people will actually prefer to pay more because they think they are getting more quality.

Another example, you go to a host who will sell you a certain package for $0.99per month, but then you see the same package for $6.99per month. Knowing the hosting market, which one would you choose? I know I'd choose $6.99 because, in the majority of cases the fact is: "The more you pay, the better quality you receive.".

It is 90% of the time true what will7 said, but TDNet has a point there too. I guess that if you get to see the job done before you pay upfront then word of mouth will spread about the service or good that the particular person or company is providing to their market. Personally I believe that there are a many web designers that prefer been in front of a monitor playing halo than make $50 on a design. the true is the many people who come to this site or any other site looking for a work done are not part of the Microsoft, yahoo, aol, cnet,...ect...marketing department, therefore they can’t afford to pay $500 plus.

I never ask any money from my clients until I give them the final product (I know its not safe but I trust my clients, hopefully they trust me).

I know that cheap most often means crappy work (some hosting companies Ive been with). I guess I just wanted to see how many people believed in the "If its cheap, its bad!" saying (if there is one).

Reminds me of that one detergent, its cheap and the celebrity's butler uses it on her clothes or something.

I have to disagree here. A great designer should tell his/her client that "if you don't compromise on my price, I won't compromise on your quality."

If you are are a student in school, and you are just getting your feet wet in the industry, it is common sense NOT to charge an arm and a leg for design. But, being experienced in the market and knowing my stuff, I know that I can, and indeed should charge more than Joe Schmoe because my prospect client won't want to compromise quality because they got a cheaper price.

Most high paying clients look for quality, and I agree that some jobs aren't worth the higher price. There is a place for everyone in the industry, it seems, anyways. I just believe that my time is worth much more than an inexperienced designer, or someone who "does it for fun."

Cheers,

Josh

You must really not like competition...

I have been in the web development industry for almost 4 years now, I have charged people up to $7000 for designs. At the moment, I have no real need for money, if the client cannot pay me, I still create the site for him/her because I love doing it. Just because Im not greedy and want to make as much cash as I want doesnt mean that Im giving my clients bad services, I give them the same service as I would give someone who paid me $500 to do the same thing. I dont believe 4 years and still being in school is considered "getting your feet wet" in the web development scene.

Alot of astronauts love space and things out there, they love being outside of the planet staring down at it. They usually go up because they want to, its something they enjoy doing, would you call them bad employees because they enjoy doing their work?

With all due respect, and to tell you the truth, I don't really consider competition from people who offer complete design for $40. That just isn't my definition of competition.

Doing something for a love of it is fine, that is why there is a thing called "pro bono". Also, I wouldn't even compare doing something as a freelancer and pro bono, to completing a project as a design COMPANY.

Also, your analogy of web designers to astronauts is outrageous. Do you know how much those astronauts get paid?

Cheers,
Josh

Originally posted by TDNet
I know many here only have one job-webdesign, I know they charge alot because they need to pay bills and support themselves. Im just stating, I would charge the same if I had to pay bills and such, but I dont so I charge very little.

They don't charge more only because they have to pay bills, it's because they fell their experience, knowledge and time is worth $x.

And, I highly doubt that your statement would hold true that you would charge the same if you had bills to pay. You have to think of software/hardware costs, server costs, internet, marketing, office space and more.

-- Josh

TDNet: If your views are actually true, and that you "don't need the money", that opinion tells me that there's something wrong somewhere.

The way I see it, there's one out of two - You have all too much money on your hands, so you decide to waste some of it by taking jobs that other need to survive, just for the fun of it.

Or the other and more likely option is, you don't have enough faith in your skill so you aren't sure if you can charge as much as you want and should for your work. Please note that I know absolutely nothing about you, your confidence in your skills, nor have I seen any of your work - This is just my general take on people with your opinion.

Either way, I'm glad there aren't too many of you out there if the first option is true, because that would mean a lot of us would be jobless, if talented designers gave away their services for free, just because "they don't need the money". Talk about shoothing yourself and all your colleagues in the foot, but I just don't see how someone would do that. I mean one thing is to design a website for friends and family, but to take full projects and not charge because "you don't need the money", that makes no sense in my opinion.

Thankfully though, I'm sure it won't make much sense to the majority of the customers either, so I'm not too scared about my future just yet ;)

?? even if I didn't need money I would charge them. :)

I don't charge much compared to others. I'm overwhelmed with work right now. I also develop relationships with the customers I have. Which brings back more business.

A funny example of what you're talking about: (true story)
This guy had these 4 tires out in front of his yard for about a month with a sign that said "FREE TIRES!". They sat there and sat there, nothing. Finally the guy changed his sign to "$10 per Tire" and they were gone within a week.

Generally, the people with less money (teenagers) will come to designers with low costs to get stuff done even if the quality isn't all that great as an expensive designer is. The people who have money will spend it even if it's the same quality as the person whom charges less. It's a vicous cycle, but that's how the ball bounces I guess.

-Ben

Thanks for all your opinions (and some truths). I like what you said bentruyman, free things usually dont go as fast as cheap things. I think Ill just wait until I have a good enough portfolio to show then start taking in clients. I dont really care what they pay as long as its a reasonable amount for my work.

The teens and low cost designers is very true, I advertised at a few collages and schools in my area and about 150 teens contacted my company for design work, while about 3 adults contacted us (out of the probably thousands that saw the ads).

If someone wants to continue the argument, go ahead, if not just let this thread die. No use in posting senseless things in here anymore, I lost, Voxxit won, end of story.

Originally posted by TDNet
I think Ill just wait until I have a good enough portfolio to show then start taking in clients. I dont really care what they pay as long as its a reasonable amount for my work.

Exactly how I am.

I have a job already. I'm not an independant yet. I pay $100/month (teenage male, go figure) for car insurance and $17.95/month for web hosting. I just do this for fun. The work I do isn't corperate quality, but I haven't personally met anyone face to face that has the same skills I do in Photoshop/PHP/or HTML even. Though I've met many online, still. The work I do is still of great quality when I'm finished, just because I hate having a site for a client that ends up like crap. If they're not happy, I'm not. Hopefully this kind of attitude will bring in more clients. Like I said, it's worked so far.

As I gain a larger portfolio, and whenever I end up finishing my site, I'll probably charge a bit more. Maybe not.

-Ben

Originally posted by Lars-Christian
You have all too much money on your hands, so you decide to waste some of it by taking jobs that other need to survive, just for the fun of it.

Do you apply that logic to everything? For example, open source software?

You really shouldn't worry about the occasional skilled designer that will do a project for free or for a small fee. They won't be your downfall.

MilesToGo,

I personally never said that taking on a pro bono job was bad, as I am doing one now. I just don't make a habit of it, and I usually have to see some return investment in it (such as a link back, etc.)

Josh

Another considering when clients look at a designer is stability--not everything is about price.

If a designer is offering all of their work for very little (or free) a legit business who will need followup work may look elsewhere. All businesses need money to survive--it is not about greed. And a real businesses have a lot of costs for design work: Software, Hardware, office space, phones, insurance, vacation, retirement, additional taxes, profit, advertising, and so on.

If a business does NOT take these things into consideration, and charge accordingly, then they may not be in business long. And while this may not concern every client, the brick and mortar and eCommerce businesses I have worked for do. I do get asked how old I am and how long I have, and plan to, continue in the web development business. And while some may be in a position to remain in the business without charging much, many of us do this for a career and have families to support.

And experience tells me good clients like to pay. I have found in the web industry that when clients want a lot for little cash they tend to be pretty demanding and not worth your time/money in the long run (especially in hosting). When clients respect my time, skill, effort, and the fact I am a business things seem to work best. And in return I give them quality service at a fair price.

But that is how I look at it, I am trying to provide a service to businesses not just lines of code and pictures they throw up on the internet (not saying you do this). I am not offended by those who charge nothing, but I do not consider them competition and most businesses looking for a long term relationship with a web developer / design studio would feel the same way. Stability is valuable, and stability often required money.

Originally posted by MilesToGo
Originally posted by Lars-Christian
You have all too much money on your hands, so you decide to waste some of it by taking jobs that other need to survive, just for the fun of it.
Do you apply that logic to everything? For example, open source software?

You really shouldn't worry about the occasional skilled designer that will do a project for free or for a small fee. They won't be your downfall.

You took that so out of context it's not even funny. You forgot to mention the fact that I also stated that it was my opinion that there's nothing wrong with doing a free job, but there's a difference between taking one project for free, and going around acting as a full fledged designer, only you offer your services for free, and there's most certainly nothing wrong with charging low prices, or nothing if you prefer, to build your portfolio.

And I also believe I stated that I wasn't exactly fearing it to be my downfall. Perhaps you missed that too?

Oh and while we're at it, I do certainly hope that FireFox results in IE's browser engineers to lose their job :P That's if they wasn't fired years back when IE was the only browser.

what a strange discussion ....

post your portfolios and price ... we'll soon decide this