I love the idea of a consortium.

Taking that a step further, I would suggest a Membership type consortium where all members would pay an upfront fee and share in the profits. New members would also pay a membership fee. The forums would remain open to the public just as now.

This could literally become "the place" (probably already is) for gathering of reputable hosts. Membership would require committment to a Hosting Standard of Ethics and could be terminated by the remaining members (with a predetermined buyout) under certain circumstances.

I think Matt has built something very special here and believe this could be a way to maintain what has been built and take it to the next step.

I don't suggest the membership be exclusive or very limited. I like the idea of opening it up to all professional hosts and suppliers, thereby reducing the costs and broadening the appeal. Certainly wouldn't want it to become a marketing mechanism for a limited few, but remain an impartial board.

Any who are interested in pursuing this approach please respond here as well as PM me with your interest.

I will be evaluating the feasibility based on the level of response. Also, in private you might include ideas on how much you as a member would be willing to pay and for what % of the whole.

To Matt: Once I get initial indications, I will contact you and discuss further including asking price.

In my suggestion, the site would be incorporated with members technically as shareholders. Although a for-profit company (non profit is just too difficult) the goals would not be profit but rather continuing to build a reputable hosting community.

Hi,

With a bit of ironing out the above idea could work very well, I would definately be interested.

Keep us informed of any further ideas and if you need any help organising things I may be able to help.

Cheers.

Will give this thread a couple of days to measure interest before deciding on next possible step.

Like the idea!

"Certainly wouldn't want it to become a marketing mechanism for a limited few, but remain an impartial board" - that line says it all.

However as I am non-US based, how would it work technically speaking with regards to shares etc?

Am I reading this right? Are you talking about a for-profit virtualized chamber of commerce for web hosting? Very interesting idea, and this seems to be a very valid business concept. It already exists for other industries (industry specialist panels) so why not this? The Global WebHosting Panel, defining industry standards and providing special interest groups, etc. Cool idea, if I read it right! :D

Scott

Am I missing something here? Did Matt announce his intention to sell the site or is Incognito just thinking out loud?

And that started me to thinking out loud. Actually, I had long thought about some sort of industry association. And this just would seem to provide the perfect starting mechanism.

Sounds Like A Very Interesting Idea!

Ben

Originally posted by alchiba
Am I missing something here? Did Matt announce his intention to sell the site or is Incognito just thinking out loud?

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/announcement.php?s=&forumid=4

This does sound interesting, please keep us up to date on this.

My personal view is that WHT is great as it is currently. If WHT is sold, my opinion is that it would continue to thrive if the new owner(s) continued to run it in a way similar to this.

WHT should remain free to users.

The advertising revenue should take care of all the costs and make a nice profit.

I know that if there was a membership fee it would turn me a way, and actually I would not sign up.

What will happen is a free one will come out and this will be different

Joe

Originally posted by voxtreme-matt
My personal view is that WHT is great as it is currently. If WHT is sold, my opinion is that it would continue to thrive if the new owner(s) continued to run it in a way similar to this.

Well we can't be sure about that. I would guess a lot of big webhosts and/or host directories like tophosts etc would be interested in buying this forum.

I say WHT is too good for us to risk that something like this would happen. Even though Matt says "I would like to sell to someone who I can trust, someone who would maintain the excellent community spirit and integrity of the site, and further enhance the reputation and success of WebHostingTalk. " I would not be angry with him or surprised if he sells to someone not so trustworthy so to speak ( cause it might be so that they give a MUCH better bid ) ( not saying we can't trust your words, Matt, just the opposite - you have the right to sell to anyone you'd like is my point ).

Well, who all would like to team up and make an offer?

Depending on the amount of cash, I might be interested. :) Just, a note, that my interests are purely on the personal side.

Originally posted by voxtreme-matt
My personal view is that WHT is great as it is currently. If WHT is sold, my opinion is that it would continue to thrive if the new owner(s) continued to run it in a way similar to this.

I agree, and I really wouldn't be interested in putting in a pay for post operation either. Im not interested in paying for a membership to help others with there problems, I would however be interested in paying for advertising ops.

this will certainly turn away any new users and possibly current users.

I agree with the idea of "membership" but with a twist, which I will call "vendor-visitor" (why? I don't know. It just sounds good.)

"Visitors" should be entitled to a free membership. Free membership includes being able to post freely to any boards at all, but not being able to start a thread in certain forums (to my knowledge, this is possible in vBulletin.) As a result, a visitor doesn't gain any "advertising" benefits from being the first to post in the "Web Hosting Specials" forum. (I guess what I'm trying to say in a nutshell is that anyone who isn't a web host should be entitled to a free membership.

"Vendors" should be entitled to post and start threads wherever they like and would pay a membership fee to do so. A "Vendor" is anyone who is a web host or reseller. Possibly "vendors" could get access to certain other features within vBulletin that "visitors" couldn't (such as members-only forums, maybe certain vB codes, I don't know.)

In a nutshell, if you're using this board for purposes of gathering information and contributing to a forum (personal reasons), it should be free. If you're getting advertising benefit from it, you should have to pay.

Incognito: while I can see the merit and logic in a members-only methodology, the "co-operative" strategy where members share in the profits leads to one question: what happens in the event of a loss? The owner of the board has clearly indicated that he has run up a significant amount of debt in running it; and while I'm certainly not implying that he's selling this board in the interest of selling someone the proverbial bill of goods, the potential for loss still exists. Who absorbs this loss? Are membership fees raised? Do advertisers cover it by having their rates raised?

Just some semi-random thoughts.

Originally posted by JTY
Well, who all would like to team up and make an offer?

Depending on the amount of cash, I might be interested. :) Just, a note, that my interests are purely on the personal side.

I may be interested as well, I think it needs to be better organized but first there needs to be interest.

I am not 100% positive on the pay for membership idea as I feel this may cause alot of current members to jump ship, with the proper planning this could be eliminated and remain as it is.

I guess the first thing that needs to be done is to figure out who would be interested in this potential purchase both monetary wise and organization wise, and then go from there.

One thing to keep in mind is this board is popular because of it's members not the owners (no offense Matt). So I think whatever is done should alse reflect their views whether or not they contribute monetary wise or not, because they do contribute to it's content and popularity.

I also like the idea of some sort of Industry committee though but again this has to be done in such a way that it's members are indeed concerned with the industry and not just trying to line their own pockets through it.

I can be contacted via PM and will provide personal contact info then for whomever else is interested in this.

I personally think the forum is great the way it is.
I think what has made WHT run so well is that its not run by a web host. I also feel that its good moderation and excellent rules have made WHT the biggest out there. I would be very sad to see anyone having to pay for membership privledges here, as there are other Web hosting forums that are free, and people will move on. There are about 15 members that IMO are the most knowledgable and helpful on the forum, and I think if they had to pay for membership, they could leave. Then the value of this forum would drop, and others would stop visiting.....

You do realise this is not going to be going cheap, at 1.4 million page views a month there could be a lot of advertising revenue made from that. If you say $5/cpm thats $7000/month revenue and potential buyers may have to pay upto 12 times that i.e $84,000 . Impressions could be sold for more than that possibly $10/cpm so you could be talking $150,000 to buy this.

I am also very interested...

I think if you did something like that, you would not want to charge a membership fee, make it like a corporation or something, just make money from advertising, and devide it up between, the share holders, every 3 months or so. However you would still need to keep this forum, just as good, and even make it better if possible.


Just my 2 cents...

I think going pay would be a HUGE issue and it would loose the true meaning of this forum. I say stick with the top banner ad's and make what you can off that. As far as pay fees what would be next 0.05 cent an email? seriously.

Originally posted by SplashHost.com
You do realise this is not going to be going cheap, at 1.4 million page views a month there could be a lot of advertising revenue made from that. If you say $5/cpm thats $7000/month revenue and potential buyers may have to pay upto 12 times that i.e $84,000 . Impressions could be sold for more than that possibly $10/cpm so you could be talking $150,000 to buy this.

I think Matt's grin just got bigger :D

Originally posted by SplashHost.com
You do realise this is not going to be going cheap, at 1.4 million page views a month there could be a lot of advertising revenue made from that. If you say $5/cpm thats $7000/month revenue and potential buyers may have to pay upto 12 times that i.e $84,000 . Impressions could be sold for more than that possibly $10/cpm so you could be talking $150,000 to buy this.

if revenue were that high, the server admin would be able to keep the service running without a loss.... so he is probably serving the ads for a much lower price..

I will be a goner if this forum is sold in anyway.

Maybe Matt is just a guy who started of a hobby site and isnt a business man or sales man so isnt capable of getting the full potential revenue from the site.

True Alan,

But i don't see why he can't get a host with a good reputation to host the site and give them the advertising revenue (basically giving it to that host), because WHT is the best advertising a host could wish for... (as in targeting)

Err, the owner has made it clear in the thread entitled "Possible sale of WebhostingTalk" that Voxel Dot Net is hosting WHT at no charge.

I believe he aims to sell WHT in order to recoup some of his previous debts.

I to would be interested in ownership, however i belive keeping it free is a key element here. advertisement will/should be the only source of revenue. If any plan does come together pls keep me posted.

I'm willing to donate a server to webhostingtalk.com and keep it free if matt doesnt want to run it anymore.

I think it is a shame that Matt will have to let the website go after all of the sweat and work he has put into it over the years. I however would love to be a part of a team to take it over and make it thrive. As far as the paid membership I think visitors and guests should have a free membership because I think having to pay a membershipo would turn away new comers looking for hosting. However I think hosts should have to pay a membership fee to be able to advertise or offer their services. Face it any other form of advertising or lead solicitation is paid for by reputable companies. I feel a paid membership for hosts would maintain a quality of service providers that would be greatly appreciated at all. Please keep me informed if a group of members forms that would be interested in making the purchase of this site.

I like the suggestion made earlier about keeping it free for the public and charging hosts for the adversitising sections. Perhaps a one-time fee of like $50 (lower, higher, who knows) gives the company the right to post ads in the ads section and to have a business-related signature (or some other perk). The public should have all the rights they have now, though. Even some advertising rights like selling their domains or items they don't want anymore...

As long as this is properly organized, it should succeed in being profitable while still keeping (or enhancing?) it's current value to visitors at no cost to them.

Above all, though, I hope Chicken stays put or hatches an egg soon so someone can follow in his footsteps. :)

You guys forgetting something, the reason Matt wished to seel it is to get himself out of some debt (very understandable) .. so he need $$$$ .. not servers, or help ;)

The idea that people should pay IMHO is absurd. Many people don't really understand what this site is supposed to be. AFAIK, this board was created for users to help each other find good hosts. It has turned into a gathering place for hosters, but WHT's original mission can not be losed. I fear initiating a pay system will do that...

Well, I think I want to speak out loud and not keep in.

I keep seeing that people want membership dues .... so I'm going to ask, In exchange for what?

I don't see a publicly posted member guild lines and review board. All the association that I have been a member of, have a guild line group and all members of the association must agree to "toe the line" to those terms.

I don't see a general section of software reviews for the industry ( summary comments ). Or even a section on what all web hosting companies need to have in there systems ( bookmarks)

I see alot of people helping each other but that will happen in any community forum once it reaches critical mass. I happen to think that I might be part of that critical mass and hope to have helped a few.

I see alot of bashing and people thinking they have alot of rights.
I just don't see paying for reading all the little cat fights and bs. best example is the webhost guy that copies web designs from other sites. He come in to defend himself everytime and people just rip him to shreads. he knows he's guilty, what should happen he should be banned.

Let me open a can of worms here, within this month WHT placed a program that could scan a web host to find out how many accounts and whom might be hosted there. Do you know that if you did it and tried to conact any of the clients it would be considered "trespass to chattels". and a leaves WHT open for placing a loaded gun out there as the third party.

I bet you guys wished you kepted your log files. I told my clients to keep thiers logs and watch there first 100 clients on the report.

Sidenote : the legal theory of trespass to chattels with examples
http://www.eff.org/Cases/Intel_v_Hamidi/20011218_eff_trespasstc_analysis.html
http://www.legallanguage.com/lawarticles/Clarida002.html
http://www.bicklaw.com/Publications/E-Trespass/e-trespass.htm

an open forum like this let's these type of things happen, a membership association would not let this of happen because of the basic review board.

Mark has made an amazing community. I would buy him a beer without problems. but do I think that the community will grow to an association. Only time will tell

-Sqposter / Michael

This thread is rediculous, what matt chooses to do is none of our business. Furthermore the membership deal is a good idea but would never fly, too much work would go into maintaining it and its legal aspects to ever recoup it.

Originally posted by Dogma
The idea that people should pay IMHO is absurd. Many people don't really understand what this site is supposed to be. AFAIK, this board was created for users to help each other find good hosts. It has turned into a gathering place for hosters, but WHT's original mission can not be losed.

There are lots of other forums for users to find a host. What makes WHT really stand out is the hosters community. Thats where the real value is. Maybe it was not the original intention but that's irrelevant.

I think that a lot of revenue could be added to WHT if it comes under new ownership. I know that a number of people (myself included) have tried to buy advertising here and never received any kind of response. With a more active sales team, I'm sure that revenue could be significantly boosted. I hope whoever takes over makes ads easier to purchase.

I would not have given this forum a second look if I would have had to pay for membership. Its important to keep it free - thats why it is so popular!

Of course, the folks advertising specials might be willing to pay a small fee.

just my two cents.

To clarify one thing...no where in my thoughts would the users ever pay for the use of the board.

Only membership...those with certain rights, privileges and responsibilities including perhaps ownership interest would pay and even for them it would be minimal.

I haven't posted much on this forum but I've always enjoyed reading stuff here.

I'd like to make a few points please:

1. Leave the forums as being free. There is no need to charge. A few banners running/sponsored servers will cover costs

2. Any attempt to heavily commercialise this forum will cause it to be no longer a forum.

3. A consortium will probably end up with arguments/infighting/politics - no-ones fault - just the way things happen. Its probably best sold to a single owner.

4. New owner will have to simply keep the same ethics going as before.

I think possibly the intentions and ideas of Icognito have been misunderstood.

To me it still sounds like a feasible and interesting idea.

If you guys actually read MattF's message, you would understand that he is not looknig to pass ownership on to someone because he can't handle the costs...

He is trying to sell it to cover some of his personal debts. So this whole conversation is useless.....

I dont see why any of you are keeping this thread alive yet you have no clue what the asking price from Matt is....

I sent him an email though the board with a simple question of what he is looking to get out of it, as of today, 2-3 days later, i still dont have a response...

I spoke to him before he announced to this, he said he wouldnt sell it for anything less than $30,000. I would how ever expect it to go for much more than that.

Originally posted by SplashHost.com
I spoke to him before he announced to this, he said he wouldnt sell it for anything less than $30,000. I would how ever expect it to go for much more than that.

Why? it's the other 9'999 members that make this board what it is and what would anyone be receiving for such an investment - the servers are donated.

Anyway enough of playing 'devils advocate' surely it was Matts place to indicate an expected asking price, and as his post specifically didn't mention it, I don't think it was your place to either.

Why? it's the other 9'999 members that make this board what it is

Well... it doesnt matter what makes the board so popular, its matts board and he should be entitled to sell it for what its worth.


and what would anyone be receiving for such an investment - the servers are donated.


basically the potential to make lots more money back, read one of my previous posts.

surely it was Matts place to indicate an expected asking price, and as his post specifically didn't mention it, I don't think it was your place to either

That price was just what Matt said to me. And its only my opinion that it could be sold for much more.

I'm interested in buying it ...now if Matt would only get back to me. :rolleyes: :D

Why dont you try finding his phone number?

Now we are going to see mc host adds every where :rolleyes:

What does AFAIK stand for?

Originally posted by TheGAME1264
What does AFAIK stand for?

As Far As I Know

Why dont we let Matt post .

Joe

Greetings All,

If I were to buy WHT, the first thing i'm going to do is do away with the banners up top.

I will make sure that WHT is free and a neutral site to all visitors, webhosters and customers.

Alright, my bid is $__________. enter amount here<.


elijaH:)

My 1 cent.
Just change the owner to a single person, and keep everything the same as it is - no charges, same membership and rules. IMHO I don't see any reason to change anything at this point. The community is helpful, the performance is good, and afaik there is a little revenue coming from the site (?). Why change something that already works?

If it's working as well as everyone seems to think it is, he wouldn't be selling it.

He's selling it (i think) because it's like IRC. It's a parasite, an addiction, no matter what you do, it sticks to you and sucks up all your time, and you never get anything else done.

But if anyone can afford to pay $30,000 for this board, or more, what makes *anyone* think they will keep it the same? I mean $30,000 is a lot to dump into something if you don't expect a return from it, and from it's current setup, i don't think you'd get $30,000 from this board (with current banners, etc.) in a year or two. Heck, this board is totally based on users, a new owner could fumble up, offend someone, and have the board loose popularity very fast, and bam, that would be it, it'd be pretty much over, not much you can do if that happens.

I'm under the impression that wht is being sold not because it is unprofitable, but because the owner just needs a large sum of money to pay off some debts not associated with wht.

Originally posted by porcupine
.. a lot to dump into something if you don't expect a return from it...

I think it is mostly Respect.

If I were to buy WHT *wishful thinking* ;) I will make sure that it is a Non profit site meaning no banners etc..

ps: url link in sigs are allowed though.


elijaH:)

Do you honestly think someone would spend $30,000 on this and get nothing or near to nothing out of it? No offense intended here, but only someone with too much money, or an idiot would do that.

I would buy WHT myself and keep it strong, free and so that way people can visit, to meet friends, ask fro help, adversite and etc.

Just a good Brother/Sister community site to visit :D

I would buy it...simply because I believe in the ideals of WHT.
That is to create a community where consumers can make informed decisions. At least that what it is to me

Certain things that I am strongly against:

1) WHT becoming a paid-consortium, as was being discussed earlier. I foresee that those who paid for advertising will get more exposure. Reputation can be bought. Completely new hostees will be especially vulnerable to such advertising. This defeats the purpose of WHT to new consumers...advertising will no longer be by word of mouth

2) Having paid-members-only-area. I see no point in this. If I were a newbie at some forum, I'll be wondering "what goes on yonder, perhaps I being kept from some oh-so-important-discussion that is so crucial to me making my decision"
It just ruins the whole reputation of WHT being "free-for-all"



My 2 cents as a consumer

Please don't take this the wrong way, I'm just curious and tryng to understand the financial/business side of selling a strictly message based web site.

It is the USERS/POSTERS/COMMUNITY that make WHT what it is.

The investment is all donated, except for the $160 vBulletin license and time/man hours that were put forth changing/adding stuff to it.

Perhaps he owns the servers, I'm not sure. He did say all the bandwidth was donated, as well as the equipment/colo.

What I am getting at is this, what is to stop someone from putting up another site, and getting the folks that post here to come post elsewhere?

What makes this place worth $30K? The domain? The traffic? The users? The visitors?

This *is* the place to be, simply because people come here to look for specials that all the hosting providers post on here.

*If* they (providers) stopped posting on here, and somewhere else, then, what is the value of WHT?

Not like this place has a brand name such as a Yahoo or a Google, meaning there is no service or value prop here other than the posters. *IF* the posters/providers post elsewhere, then I am sure the crowd (users looking for deals) would follow elsewhere.

So, to sum it up:

Anyone with $200 plus a server or bandwidth could get this up and running in a matter of an hour or less. The challenge then would be to advertise and draw the regular crowd in to a new site. That would take some marketing.

So, if someone was going to spend $30K or more for simply that, it is a HUGE risk. Your not buying a technology, something that was invented, a piece of special hardware, etc. Your buying a community base and hoping that base doesn't move on.

This sound correct, what am I missing?

BTW, I'm not in the hosting business.

Tom

TomK: very well explained, my sentiments entirely.

Its worth that much money because it has the potential to make lots of money from advertising revenue.

No matter how hard you try your not going to get people to flawk to another message board instead of this one, there are people who have already tried setting up their own.

Originally posted by Hostilizer
I would buy WHT myself and keep it strong, free and so that way people can visit, to meet friends, ask fro help, adversite and etc.

Just a good Brother/Sister community site to visit :D

While the intention is certainly a noble one, it's the same intention that more than likely led to the debts that the current owner has accrued. The time, effort and money required to maintain such a site (even if the majority of the stuff is donated) is considerable, and if he's "working" on maintaining this site, it's potential income from other projects that he's taking away from himself. One way or the other, whoever buys it would have to support it with one or both of advertisers and members. That's just the reality of the situation.

Having read through all the posts on this subject, I just want to give my 2p

WHT is an open community of hosts, designers, developers and general visitors. They all interact, everybody has equal rights, there is no prejudice, and once again, it is very open.

While I appreciate the financial issues, if WHT in any way requires payment in order to access any part of the existing forums, then it is going to suffer for it. The new user looking for help who has only just found WHT is going to move on to another site for information. The small posters who just pop up now and again to ask a question, or to post a request/offer will no longer bother coming here. Some of the long standing members may well lose interest as the forums start to change, and stop becoming how they used to be (ie how they are now).

It has happened many times before - a company/organisation is sold, or introduces some form of payment, and it just dies - take napster, they will have nowhere near the original member base once their payment system comes in. People just move on to the next available resource, and that in turn grows.

I value WHT very much, and the last thing I want is for it to all change. Matt said any transfer would be transparent, and I think this should be the case entirely ie in 6 months time, the occasional visitor who never read about the whole sale, would not know anything had changed.

Originally posted by allending
I'm under the impression that wht is being sold not because it is unprofitable, but because the owner just needs a large sum of money to pay off some debts not associated with wht.

doooh..... that was the reason he stated in the first place...

While I agree with you benoire and I too hope it remains an open community, I guarantee you though that if someone has to laydown $30K or more to purchase the eyeballs of the users who visit this site, that decision is purely going to be a financial one.

I quote a post from this morning "Its worth that much money because it has the potential to make lots of money from advertising revenue. "

Already, people are interested in "buying" the site because of the traffic it generates, and the POTENTIAL for lots of revenue from whatever advertising medium they implement.

One can expect pop-ups, banners all over the place, etc, if someone says otherwise, they are not telling the truth!

However, if one spends their cash to own WHT, then it is their right to do with it as they please.

Tom

Maybe matt should partner webhostingtalk.com with another service provider, like a colocation facility or something along those lines in some form of agreement to help him get his personal debt dealt with, so matt can still remain the owner and perhaps less would change as to if it was sold for $30,000+.

Just an idea, likely a bad one, but hey, after lotsa ppl droppin their two cents, you'll end up with a buck or two :)

Respectfully some thoughts:

While it's certainly very healthy that lots of folks want to talk about the sale of WHT, perhaps we need to return to the original Topic in a more focused manner and Matt's request :)

...."If possible I would like to sell to a group of companies and individuals, a WebHostingTalk Consortium if you will, although you would be responsible for such arrangements yourselves, such as appointing a chairman and deciding how much each member invests etc... I would just like to deal with one person.

Some very specific issues with respect to a "WebHostingTalk Consortium"

1. Contracts?
2. Capital investemnt?
3. LLC, Corp, organization?
4. Attorney and accountant fees?
5. Board?
6. Buy out?
7. ROI?
8. Do you think this would work?

Thanks.

I know exactly what you mean about the finances - which is why I this has to be well thought out and considered before any transaction is made.

It may well be that the debt Matt accrued was before the sponsoring. Therefore, any new owner may well find there are less debts. I think it would perhaps be better to treat this along the lines of an Open Source community, where it relies on the generousity and integrity of its members. Donations could be made by active users to help cover any debts.

There was more I wanted to say but its gone right out of my head. That's what comes of having dinner midway through writing a post :rolleyes:

....
it sounds like you think the debts are wht related... if you read matt's message though, you would have picked up that they aren't.

My guess is that the ads showed up to cover those debts. But as he wrote, they don't pay off fast enough.
Therefore a large amount of cash is a good alternative for him.

there's been so many posts here by people who apparently didn't even read Matt's message.. Geez :P

Originally posted by NicoV
....
it sounds like you think the debts are wht related... if you read matt's message though, you would have picked up that they aren't.

My guess is that the ads showed up to cover those debts. But as he wrote, they don't pay off fast enough.
Therefore a large amount of cash is a good alternative for him.

there's been so many posts here by people who apparently didn't even read Matt's message.. Geez :P

I didn't say it was causing debt now ;) I said the debt may have been from before the advertising - after all, Matt does say:

After running WebHostingTalk for a long time in non-profit state I mounted some quite hefty debts for a young guy

suggesting that it may have been the cause for some of his debt.

Anyway, that aside, the main issue is that he needs the money to pay off his debt. Maybe he could clarify the current financial situation ie whether its profit making, loss making, or just covering costs.

This would give a better indication of its financial status, and what steps need to be taken as regards income/expenditure of any buyer.

Incognito,

I would be interested in your proposal of a joint membership purchase and running of WHT. (even if no profit was actually gained) Obviously I would like the fees to be as low as possible, but it seems reasonable to pay $100/year for web hosts and other organizations (with board advertising rights), and free for general users. Please feel free to contact me at hitspot@hitspot.net to discuss this further,

Thanks,
David Kiley
HitSpot Web Services
hitspot@hitspot.net

So we're basically looking at a board that is going to sell to someone for a large amount of money, and be turned into an advertising board. I highly doubt anyone will put up that much for it though, the reason most people post here is because of the way it is. If they change it a lot to try and make their money back, people will leave.

*If he was looking to maximize profit and squeeze every penny out of this board that he could, it wouldn't be nearly as successful as it is.*

Agreed,

And a lot of people wouldn't post offers, here. I'm sure most of the requests would probably stay, but if you had to pay to advertise/post special offers, why do it here?

Theres tons of lame little webpages for that where you buy credits, etc. etc. etc. as a weak attempt to list/review hosting providers, but instead they make a cash grab and sell them advertising. A few of which (i was solicited on here by, no names mentioned) allowed you to buy a sort of "status increase" where you would be listed with "premier" status in exchange for extra $$$.

If someone tries to turn this into a gateway for making $$$, and starts charging people, it'll probably result in them dumping the $30,000+ into this and only getting $5,000 back if they're lucky.

Exactly. WHT's current success is based on it's relatively simplistic nature - you can sign up, and within seconds be posting and joining in the community, which people like.

Going thru' an elaborate membership system would confuse him, and would make new visitors less inclined to sign up - eventually you would be left with the hardcore members who visit multiple times per day, so no one would be interested in advertising to the same people....

Matt

It's incredibly disappointing to see Matt make the decision to sell WHT, though I surely understand the motivation of doing so (I was young once too ;))

While we're not active posters on WHT, I have personally been following the board for quite some time. This service may be a place for us, as webhosts, to gather, share ideas, get tips on the latest technology, etc. but above all, the sole purpose is to provide users with a place to share their experiences, and research others' experiences. What initially drew me to this board was the fact that Matt appears to have no vested interest in any particular host, therefore, users are free to express their opinions without fear of having their posts mysteriously disappear, so long as they adhere to the rules.

Let's be honest in saying that there's very little chance that a potential buyer of WHT will be a hobbyist such as Matt. There will undoubtedly be a deep seated financial interest to whomever purchases WHT, and my guess is that buyer will be a webhost or someone with a strong interest in the industry. Given that, I think there should be great concern over what this service will become. All too often you read of users trying to contact webhosts and their pleas for help go ignored....until they post on WHT. It doesn't require much imagination to see where issues could arise with this service being under the control of a webhost. Even if, under new ownership, the service remained unbiased from a moderation standpoint, what about advertising? Is it reasonable to believe that open advertising policies would remain as they are? I can't forsee anyone with an interest in this industry purchasing WHT to essentially help promote their competitors.

Regardless of what happens, I'd like to take the opportunity to wish Matt the best of luck, and above all, thank you for this excellent resource. :)

Hope to be able to proceed further down the various options soon. I think their is an overwhelming desire on the part of most here to keep things as near the same as possible. I share that feeling. As to ownership, that is still quite open and the consortium approach is still under very heavy consideration. A few of my feelings.

1) The board would be ruined if there was ever a cost to participate or post.

2) The current level of advertising is an appropriate amount. Visible, but not too intrusive.

3) If profit is the motivation of a buyer, he is likely to be disappointed as it, at best, is likely to be only moderate. The buyer or buyers must have a greater motivation.

4) There are many very professional persons in this industry and this is an absolute great place for them to communicate.

Another thought just occured to me which I don't think has been discussed. If it has , please excsue me.

Set up a "contributions" link to keep WHT just the way you like it.

1. 100% Voluntary in nature
2. No special perks/priviliges for your contributions
3. Use PayPal, ClickBank, or Revecom and give whatever you can offord with a small minamum and no max :)

Iv'e seen Communities raise thousands of dollars using this method. Others don't do nearly as well.

This idea assumes that relieving Matt of his financial burdens via Contributions would supress any "burn out" he may have. I'm not inferring he has or doesn't have "burn out" Just trying to help folks understand all the implications of running a huge Community.

HTH

Originally posted by Steve_S
Another thought just occured to me which I don't think has been discussed. If it has , please excsue me.

Set up a "contributions" link to keep WHT just the way you like it.

1. 100% Voluntary in nature
2. No special perks/priviliges for your contributions
3. Use PayPal, ClickBank, or Revecom and give whatever you can offord with a small minamum and no max :)

Iv'e seen Communities raise thousands of dollars using this method. Others don't do nearly as well.

This idea assumes that relieving Matt of his financial burdens via Contributions would supress any "burn out" he may have. I'm not inferring he has or doesn't have "burn out" Just trying to help folks understand all the implications of running a huge Community.

HTH

The contribution idea is the one I was talking about a few posts back, where donations are made by the active community who want to see WHT continue to thrive as it currently is. If Matt just wants to sell up, then if a buyer could be found, the donations could go to repaying his investment.

I will purchase it offer : £20 000 ( pounds ) the owners have worked hard to bring it to were it is and if they want to sell they should get a fair price.

I would be interested in getting in touch with Matt

so drop me an email

wow, that's a lot of money..

but... why on earth are you posting that message here asking him to reply? his email is available everywhere on this board, so just email him.. :)

Why don't matt just do a paypal donation drive :)

Originally posted by Synergy
Why don't matt just do a paypal donation drive :)

Because he wants shot of the hassle of running it all as well - but he could do a donation drive to cover his debts and then give it free to whoever wants to take it off his hands.

I haven't read this whole thread, as I"d be here for a while, but I like it free. ;) I really like that idea a lot. A paypal donation link would be fine. ;) I'll read the whole thread tonight. ;) So sad to see that Matt wants to sell it though. :(

-Kyle

Originally posted by tuvok
I will purchase it offer : £20 000 ( pounds ) the owners have worked hard to bring it to were it is and if they want to sell they should get a fair price.

I would be interested in getting in touch with Matt

so drop me an email

Ooooh... £20 000. Why not just buy a dedicated server, a license for vbulletin and hire designers? I think that would be a lot cheaper. ;)

Originally posted by fragga


Ooooh... £20 000. Why not just buy a dedicated server, a license for vbulletin and hire designers? I think that would be a lot cheaper. ;)

Because getting all of that would not necessarily mean that 1 million+ hits a month.

I didn't say you can get hits INSTANTLY.

Originally posted by fragga
I didn't say you can get hits INSTANTLY.

LOL!

Anyone that's willing to spend $30,000 is taking a big risk (and not good with business hehe).

On top of banner sales are doing extremely poor, forum traffic are one of the least effective. There is a reason why Matt haven't made enough money over the years (or maybe he just spends a lot of it!), this site is most valuable to users, not advertisers.

I wish I had $30,000 so I can keep this forum free :D

Best wishes,
Chris
Personal: truethoughts.net

IMHO this site will never be a big moneymaker and that is fine. The purchaser/(s) must be purchasing for motives other than profits.

Originally posted by Incognito
IMHO this site will never be a big moneymaker and that is fine. The purchaser/(s) must be purchasing for motives other than profits.

Not quite altruistic, but you at least have to expect to amortize your investment over a longer period of time (18 months), then most people like.

Hmm, it's March 16th. this seems to have been going on for a long time. Any news on the sale?

its hard to even know the asking price when the seller doesnt return your email requests for what he is looking to get out of it :eek: :eek: :eek:

Guess I am also a bit confused. He posted the thread. However, never replied to inquiries with any additional information. Also, never furnished any update on the sale. Don't know if he found a suitor, changed his mind, or what took place. But, at least the board continues for the present as it was.

Let's hope it continues. It would be a disaster to see it go, and would take someone a very long time to get something similar up and running.

There have been other who have tried to start an equivalent before, and have had little success. A couple others have recently started and they will have a hard time as well in growing or succeeding like this bulletin board has.

If this was commercialised, it wont stay the same as anything for profit comes with change if it was to be profitable.

If it was to be for the "community" as has been touted, then non-profit group with a advertising subscription is the only way to go. Membership gives you votiong rights for the committee running the show and keeping it running. Advertising in the offers forum could be done via an extra small fee per posted ad, apart from ad revenue from banners etc. Proper management is the key to anything being done right, whether for profit or community administered.

Many people post adverts in the adverts forums because they can do so for free, if a charge was introduced, a lot wouldn't bother. Also, like Nishtec says, there are other forums trying to get going, one seems to be doing a little better than the rest, though at the moment WHT still rules the roost (for its sins :rolleyes: ). But if people knew of a cheaper (read: free) alternative elsewhere, chances are they'd start flocking there instead, once charges etc were introduced here.

AGREED! ;)

-Kyle

Originally posted by benoire
one seems to be doing a little better than the rest

do you mind letting me in on who these are?

I never mentioned on fees for people coming here, only making use of a place that they recieved much information and help, yet didnt or wouldnt put their hand in their pocket for a few breadcrumbs for posting an advertised hosting offer for their business. Somehow doubt they would disappear as such, considering most like it here anyway for one reason or another. Community means being a part but also putting back into opposed to just taking, and in that formula would be the emphasis on giving apart from just taking.

If i had to spend a dollar or two to advertise, bet i would get much more value for my money than I would out of other methods of promotion considering the exposure levels here.

Absolutely yes on an annual membership fee just like any other trade association. Membership standards -- a code of ethics, if you will -- should be in place and members should be able to display a certification on their sites. We would have to 'self police,' I think, so that membership really means something. That way the memebrship logo on our site would become significant and widely respected -- like the BBB Online symbol.

Perhaps a two-tiered membership program -- if that didn't promote some sort of caste system. Perhaps membership could include/require some moderator time or Q&A time on the BBoard. Maybe association members could get advertising credits or advertising discounts for serving on the Bulletin Board. Are elections feasible?

The boards should still be freely accessible to all comers. Sort of a public and visible sign of an active association.

It does seem that if there is a core administration that some revenue has to go to them as compensation for their time. Isn't this just about the way the BBB and other National Associations operate?

I'm new around here but I would definately opt-in for a membership fee to a reputable trade association.

-- John Sinclair

A good idea would be to form some sort of Ombudsman, where by all companies allowed to post adverts within the forum are bound to certain terms and conditions to what they are allow and arent allowed to do (to a certain extent).

This would be a great way for dispusts to be settled, as the Ombudsman would have the power to offer advice to both customer and company.

Also it'd improve the awareness of people knowing about WHT as hosting companies would advertise they support the Ombudsman. I currently work in a field that has an Ombudsman in place and some high profile cases have come to light (in the UK). Although the companies might not have agreed with the decision they have gone with it, because in the need the Ombudsman is acting in the best interest of everyone.

I believe there is some sort of panel involving the major players from within the sector of business that hold regular meetings to discuss the matters involving what has gone on recently and anything that could be improved.


Just a thought

yeah a decent idea, but you gotta be careful to keep out the people who cant differentiate between a host that can deliver, say something like unmetered, and those that are using it as a gimmick. i cant believe people actually kicked up a stink when rackshack offerend unmetered, simple maths, is a compaq with 400gb is say 149 and a 100mbps connection is 3000 max the sayign 10mbps for 399 isnt out of the question.
an ombudsman needs to be totally independant AND not be viscous as porcine excrement. it would need to be totally impartial AND be able to make accurate and justifiable decisions.
its like govt, you have an mp for say health, you gotta pay the money to attract someone who actually knows about it but at the same time isnt going to be biased, at which point your left in a catch 22. its going to be virtually impossible to find suitible candidates. taking as an example again rackshack, offering something incredibly cheap, but any halfwit with kindergarten maths can figure that its doable (i take no responsibility for that actually being a real word but stuff it). most of the people kicking up a stink were hosts and suffering a real attack of professional jellousy.
as for a code of ethics etc thats a good idea. BUT again you have to be able to seperate out the custards (first half customer second half ill leave to your imagination) who quite simply lie with the intent to sully the reputation of a host.
very hard to police these matters.

If matt would hook up with paypal, revecom or 2checkout, I for one would send him a "donation".

This might be another source of income..and.. still allow him to keep this forum,.,,if that is what he desires.

I know it has to to take a lot of time to maintain this site. Even though it is hosted for free right now, surely the webmaster should be rewarded for the time he spends.

Deja

is there any new news on this matter?

Wow, holy digging old threads, yes, WHT was bought by Rackshack.

I don't think WHT will be sold.:confused:

Originally posted by mas3000
I don't think WHT will be sold.:confused:

It already has been sold...:eek3:

I wonder how much he got for it?

No doubt, rackshack has money. I wonder if their contract had a non-disclosure agreement? Hmm. lol

Originally posted by horoscopes2000
I wonder how much he got for it?

I'm betting A LOT...:nuts:

Oh, I remember this!

I hope like hell he got more than 150K for it... it seems like it would be worth more than that to me.

Anybody keep Matt's announcement ? Could you post here again?. The link to original document (http://www.webhostingtalk.com/announcement.php?s=&forumid=4) doesn't exist.