We just wanted to share our latest experience with PayPal for anyone using or considering using them to sell products, even if you're actually shipping a product. We read all the fine print and still got burned.

We initially thought that "as long as" we shipped to a confirmed address within the United States and could provide a valid tracking number of same, we were always in the clear. To extend, we thought we would never have to worry past 30 days on these as well. We were wrong...

PayPal (not sure if this is new, but we never saw it) will reverse a payment "up to 6 months" from the transaction date if the person files a complaint saying they didn't get what they expected, or even says you shipped them an empty box, regardless of anything else. The 30 days to make a complaint does not apply.

We recently had to pay back a customer after a transaction that occurred 5 months ago because we couldn't provide the tracking number. This was an ebay transaction and we couldn't provide the tracking number. The person said "I never got it." We told PayPal the tracking number is in our ebay archive (of sold items) but it won't let us open it because it's been over 90 days. We explained he even left positive feedback. PayPal could careless. So we had to refund him the amount or have a frozen account on all our funds, in additions we lost sales for about a week "until" it became "unfrozen."

Just a warning...

Nothing very amazing and standard for credit card payments. With American Express this can even happen over 1 year later.

I'm afraid to use any merchant account or 3rd party processor now, if we can't even plead our case with anyone, then we will be forced to only accept checks/money orders. :(

Thats the evil about online CC transactions. That is the risk of doing business :(

Don't let one bad experience keep you from gaining the most you can from sales. Its sad but true, if you discontinue accepting credit cards your profits will decline considerably.

Instead give yourself a pat on the back for realizing paypal isn't the best solution for cc processing and move on to someone who's sole business is giving retailers a system which they can depend on.

I know from experience that PayPal won't investigate claims past the 30 day window for their dispute process. If the buyer files a chargeback through the credit card company, they have to follow up on it and reverse the funds if they cannot successfully dispute it. This is true with most processors unfortunately.

There's alot of bad seeds out there, but but if you have a little faith, the majority of good buyers and sellers previal.

Things aren't going to be better as a credit card merchant vs. PayPal. PayPal offers pretty good buyer protection; bottom-line, it's up to you to keep your own records. Though I certainly agree, 5 months later smacks of buyer's remorse.

In the case of web hosting, which is not tangible goods, can we ask the customer to print out a product received form , sign and send it to us? This should be done in view of good faith in biz.
This is what YowCow is doing in their Plus program.

Will this be able to stand a chargeback ?

Joshua

At least customers have peace of mind that they're getting what they paid for...

Originally posted by joshuayip
In the case of web hosting, which is not tangible goods, can we ask the customer to print out a product received form , sign and send it to us? This should be done in view of good faith in biz.
This is what YowCow is doing in their Plus program.

Will this be able to stand a chargeback ?

Joshua
Joshua,
Paypal, as per their TOS does not refund anything for services. This includes hosting, domains, products bought online but not physically delivered (ssl certs, etc). This is a very large breath of fresh air given the numerous banks that actually DON'T respect the services provided by individuals.

As far as the initial complaint.
Everything you've said is true. Unfortunately, because you didn't keep records, you're out the initial fundage. Had you shipped through paypal, I'm sure their system would still have the shipping and tracking #'s somewhere in there, but that will only cover the package, not the actual contents inside of it.

Any time you sell or ship physical goods it is absolutely 100% imperative that you keep records for up to 2 years. This would have easily resolved this issue. If you know the shipping address of the individual, you might (might) be able to call the company used (ups, usps, fedex) and explain the situation. Perhaps (longshot, but it's worth a try) they have the documentation necessary to satisfy paypal's desires.

I hate to say it, but this really isn't a paypal problem, more like a lack of documentation on your end. Had that documentation been provided, most likely they would have said thanks and have a great day.