Hi everyone,

Here's a question I have.. As you may know I am one of the younger web host owners. We are doing pretty darn well for only starting (officially - i.e. Pay big money for marketing etc. - we have been hosting people for at least 6 months or so). But anyways...here's my question, is it a turn on or turn off if you know the owner-and maybe most of the employees-are of young age? The business is legal, we have someone over 18.. We are legally setup and pay taxes etc. just like everyone else. My questions being, basically what do you think? If you knew your web host was say 16-20 what would you do or say? And my other question.. If you knew BEFORE signing up they were that age what would you say/do?

I hope that made sense...I'm just wondering. We provide excellent services, awesome support and great prices. Let me know if you can help with this at all. Thank you..

P.S. The web site is being updated, thanks for all the imput!
:)

Regards,
Matt S.

For one thing you may search the forums as this has been asking many times before. Sadly to say the general consensus is negative towards youth. ( Specefically those under 18 ) One reason is that minors cannot enter into contracts and if a minor rips you off, you don't have that much legal recourse. Besides that it is true that a decent amount of people discriminate against age. Gennerally business users will be more concerned with you're age. If you act professional and mature when conversing with clients/potential clients, you will have a much better chance. Some may choose not to go with you just because of you're age, but if you show knowledge and professionalism you're business could still be succesful while you are under 18. A great example is SplashHost, he is 17 yet his business has taken off pretty well and is getting his 3rd server soon. He has only been in business for about 6 months, but is successful because he is professional and knowledgeable.

This might help, I forgot to tell you. I am the co-owner, the other owner is over 18. Does that change your mind at all?

That would definately ease peoples minds, as they would have someone that is of legal accountable age. I don't think age would be that big of a problem if one of you are 18(or over).You will still have some blatant discrimination because of you're age but generally I don't think it will be that much if you conduct yourselves with professionalism.

Alright, thanks. I can tell we do act very professional with clients and understand this isn't a game..

Age is not a problem as long as you know your responsibilities, have enough commitment towards your business/customers and can be held accountable. If it is a part-time business then that is also not a problem. However, if it is a full-time business and you are not there full-time then it is a problem. The problem with a lot of teenagers (I am talking 12 and up) is that they are setting up hosting businesses to earn allowance money. I am not making this up - just search the forums. Where does this leave your customers?

With most other types of businesses this is not a major issue but hosting requires you to be available to provide support all the time. As long as your customers know this (if you are just running it part-time) and they feel ok, then it is not a problem. You can be a designer and host a few accounts and do it part-time on the side. Just do not create an impression that you are a full-time serious hosting company and go to school or do something else.

Hi, I've found some threads that might be useful to you.

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28807&highlight=kids

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10577&highlight=kids

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3241&highlight=kids

Hope the above helps,
Tetraboy.

Alright, let me reply to the last post, I am home schooled so I am available when needed for support. I do the phones in the morning currently and reply to support at least every 45minutes.. We are building a support team currently but this takes time and money I know this is a full time operation, I work more then full time. This is not a game for me, I intend and hope for this to become a good living.. Here's an example:
I answer the phone when needed in the morning during school.. A few times I don't because of school, I'm sure you understand.. We do have a backup support team available when I don't answer. So almost every weekday, I get up check emails right away, fix problems (if any), setup new accounts (makes my day better) then if everything can run for a little without me I go take a shower and grab a little food. I then check emails again, and if any I reply and fix all the problems or upgrades. After that it's sometimes only 9am, 8:30am, 10am. I then start school (answering phone calls if any) I'm finished with school on most days by 12 maybe every 8 days it's 3. I do check support emails every 45minutes or even faster depending on school. After 1 I setup more accounts, fix problems (if any again) and see what work I have lined up. Sometimes at 1 I take a 2-4 hour break (someone covers for me while I'm off) and go have fun. I then return say by 4 and check everything etc. (if I'm needed while on break I can be to a computer within 30minutes.) I then work for a few hours, take a break for dinner, then return.. It's about 6 now, and I pretty much work straight through until 10pm, if I need to be up longer I can, most of the time I'm finished for the night though. We have a support team that does do phone support 24/7 if no one here is available.
Then my day starts over again
Not to brag but that's my life. Oh yeah, fun stuff for all you other people out there, I do play in a rock band and dirt bike along with all the other stuff teenagers do (well not all the stuff-you get the picture).
Do I sound committed? (not trying to sound cocky just so you know)

Thank you..

Regards,
Matt S.

Committed?! You call that committed? You say that you do support when you get up... that means you sleep. If you sleep you are unfit to be in the webhosting business!

Jeese... some people...
(only kidding!)

Honestly, I do discriminate on anything lower than 18 due to legalities, school, and of course the pressure that goes along with those lovely teen years. It builds and I don't want someone running the business I pay to snap because wendy said no to the spring ball. Now that's not at all how it is for everyone, but it just isn't always the best time to be running a business for most younguns (in my opinion).

Again, that in no way affects everyone, but the pressure, legal matters, etc... for that age group isn't what I want to be mixing business with. Also, I look at it in the sense that many of the younger people don't have jobs and therefore don't have much capital. A few wrong mistakes could wipe someone with little $$$ out and take the business with it.

You're lucky you have someone in you're business that is 18, I will soon be starting my own web hosting company and figure it will probably be very hard because of my age.

Originally posted by JustinK
Committed?! You call that committed? You say that you do support when you get up... that means you sleep. If you sleep you are unfit to be in the webhosting business!

Jeese... some people...
(only kidding!)

Honestly, I do discriminate on anything lower than 18 due to legalities, school, and of course the pressure that goes along with those lovely teen years. It builds and I don't want someone running the business I pay to snap because wendy said no to the spring ball. Now that's not at all how it is for everyone, but it just isn't always the best time to be running a business for most younguns (in my opinion).

Again, that in no way affects everyone, but the pressure, legal matters, etc... for that age group isn't what I want to be mixing business with. Also, I look at it in the sense that many of the younger people don't have jobs and therefore don't have much capital. A few wrong mistakes could wipe someone with little $$$ out and take the business with it.

If I may ask, how old are you? Everything is legal due to the fact that the other owner is over 18! And Sir. there isn't no "Wendy" (ok it's out!, I've been single forever). I understand what you mean...however, business and personal are two different things. I do not take anything personal into this at all.. Make sense?

About the money:
Not to be cocky (again) we don't make mistakes.. We research, think, talk it over, and then we go ahead.. I am pretty smart :D David is also very smart, everyone else that works for us and makes some choices is smart. You could say we aren't the normal teenagers (that do drugs and the nasty etc.) GET WHAT I MEAN? We are not like that.. Back to the subject...We do have capital and if something were to go wrong we can pretty much keep this going for another 12 months at least...our contracts are monthly and yearly so everyone is covered. Let me know..

Regards,
Matt S.

Originally posted by Tetraboy
You're lucky you have someone in you're business that is 18, I will soon be starting my own web hosting company and figure it will probably be very hard because of my age.

Yes, I am :) I know you won't want to do this but get your mom or dad to sign for stuff and help you out.

I have no problem with that, currently I'm looking at our states info on forming an llc.

Hi!
I don't know why one should worry about legal aspects all the time. All kids are not criminals. Actually, I have seen none.
I have seen that some kids have really fresh minds and really have great ideas. Maybe that's why they do so well. They do not always excel by undercutting.
Usually we get angry with kids because they undercut.... But not everyone is like that..


There is one aspect however, I always feel that kids must play a lot and enjoy childhood... You get only one per life and one must really live it full... There is a lot of time to mature and sell webspace later.... :)

Have a great day :)

regards
amar

In direct answer to your age...

Yes, there are some who would discriminate against you. I, however, have seen your posts here, your relative maturity, and your knowledge, so would have no problem working with you. Amazing, how the internet eliminates some prejudices, because we have to judge on substance, not appearance. I have been surprised by the maturity of some young people and even more surprised by the immaturity and lack of professionalism by many old timers like myself.

As to customers...

I believe your age would absolutely work against you as would the nature of your work environment. However, there is no reason for either to be known...you can just build based on your performance and service.

Just for information sake.
I'm 26. By the hosting industry standard I'm almost a fossil....
I'm just amazed by the new generation and strongly feel that we must motivate them....

Have a great day :)

regards
amar

I still say 26 isn't that old, even though it's double my age.

Tetraboy, you are two times less than 26 years old? That is wonderful! :) Are you planning on starting your web hosting business any time soon?

I think that all the elderly people are correct! The web hosting business is not fit for younger people. Younger people should enjoy life and go through school. Younger people do not have enough time to provide adequate customer support. But I do think younger people are able to start other businesses. I think intelligent and responsible younger people are able to start online communities or a lawn mowing business. These businesses aren't AWESOME, but they are good for younger people. Oh well!

Yes,
in a month or two I am planning on starting a web hosting company. Most likely forming an LLC. I plan on reselling hosting, and outsourcing support.

I'm only 20. But you did ask "here's my question, is it a turn on or turn off if you know the owner-and maybe most of the employees-are of young age? "

For ME it is. I'm just stating how I view things. And as for kids ripping people off, people of all age rip people off... I seem to see a pattern with younguns and webhosting sites that start with the letter G though. Maybe just a coincidence. At least 2: Galaxy-web and umm... well my memory has basically gone to the dark side of hades, but it was one of the recent ones that I believe was with alabanza.

bleh... off the topic already. I was just stating how I saw things. It may be discrimination, but I value my money (who doesn't?) and if that's what my mind is popping into my head I'm going to avoid it.

You are right too! Even though I am...YOUNG, I would not want to pay for services from a young person. Lawn mowing and lemonade would be good. But I wouldn't feel comfortable.

All of my business dealings, with people under the age of 21 (except one young man) has been horrible. They CAN do the job...they are VERY smart, enthusiastic, etc. However, they tend to lack long-term focus. Things that are incredibly important today - might not be so important 6 months from now.

Does anyone here remember the 18 year old that had a hosting business...and was going on and on about how mature he was and how dedicated he was, etc., etc. Then, about 6 months into it, we started reading posts from his customers wondering where he was...because his business just seemed to vanish (along with everyone's accounts).

He posted here...explaining that he was no longer interested in hosting. He had a new girlfriend and just wasn't into it anymore. He new it was wrong - but, my opinion, is he didn't care about the businesses he negatively impacted.

I've hired a few programming GENIUSES, under 21. Their work was fantastic. Their work ethic SUCKED. Even after I explained that I had ALOT to lose if they missed their deadlines - the excuses ranged from "I wasn't feeling good that day." to "Some friends came over that I didn't expect.".

In general - even kids with the best intentions and "professionalism" lack focus and a real-world understanding of how important business is. I guess when your parents are paying all your bills...its not easy to comprehend real-world responsibilities. Kids have nothing to lose by closing up shop, missing deadlines or treating their customers like crap. I think in the back of their minds they always know "Hey, I'm just a kid. What can they do to me anyway?"

--Tina

Good point! Young people are just not mature enough. That is why you can't trust young people. There are some very good young people that you can find. It is very rare. People should just stick with professional people.

Originally posted by MattS
Do I sound committed? (not trying to sound cocky just so you know)

Thank you..

Regards,
Matt S.


You don't have a girlfriend yet. ;)

--Tina

Yes.

Originally posted by AffordableHost
All of my business dealings, with people under the age of 21 (except one young man) has been horrible. They CAN do the job...they are VERY smart, enthusiastic, etc. However, they tend to lack long-term focus. Things that are incredibly important today - might not be so important 6 months from now.
...


This is one of the major advantages of getting a university degree: It proves that you are not only capable, but that you can also spend four years working at something without getting bored/distracted and giving up partway through. If I was looking for a programmer, I'd pick someone with two years of programming experience and a BA in history over someone with six years of programming experience and no degree; the same goes double for graduate degrees, since it's even easier to slack off when you're working autonomously.

But getting back to the original topic, sometimes the easiest solution is simply not to mention your age. Everyone around here (Oxford) treats me like any other graduate student -- until they find out that I'm only 20. At that point (once they finish genuflecting) they treat me more like an undergraduate student... which is nice in social situations, but in academic discussions I still find that my ideas are treated with less respect by people who know my age. I'm sure it's entirely unconcious, but it's still irritating.

I thought that I might chime in here, haha. :)

I started IntraHost when I was 16, I'm not 18 and its been quite a journey. I've had some pretty supporting people on my side, from companies I dealt with to family and friends. Most companies I talked to actually loved the fact that I was still young. Someone always seemed to tell me a story of when they were young and had a business and what not.

But one thing I can say, is that its a growing expierience. I honestly could tell you're younger from the way you type. Not saying thats a bad thing! Just an observation. And thats not true in all cases. I usually can't decide a persons gender over the net, haha.

Anyways... My business is legal too, well I'm 18 now, so its legal, but my father is the person that actually owns the company. He signed everything as far as contracts. So that helped out. But you learn to deal with people really quick when you're younger. You'll make mistakes, but in order to stay in the business long enough, you have to learn from them. That and money managment, thats always fun. haha.

So I don't mind dealing with the youngin's, not that I really deal with youngin's, but I would if I had to, haha.

Good luck with your business!

Originally posted by cperciva
This is one of the major advantages of getting a university degree: It proves that you are not only capable, but that you can also spend four years working at something without getting bored/distracted and giving up partway through.
That is about the only reason employers require you to have degrees. Many jobs are nearly 100% on-the-job training, and often you won't end up working in the same field you studied, but a degree proves the quote above.

The same holds true for military training. Most positions won't require you to get up at 4am and hike 10 miles up a mountain, but the fact you did it for 3 years and completed it says something about you.

Originally posted by Chicken
The same holds true for military training. Most positions won't require you to get up at 4am and hike 10 miles up a mountain, but the fact you did it for 3 years and completed it says something about you.

*shudder* I don't think I'd want to hire someone with military training... automasochism isn't exactly a major job skill as far as I'm concerned.

I registered on 12-24-2000 - that was a day before my 17th birthday (wow, that's an odd fact! :) ). By the time I was 16 years old, I could already program in Visual Basic (started with VB3.0 sendkeys to VB3 API then to VB5 etc etc). After my hype and self-learning VB was over with, I took interest in the web and the internet. I ventured upon one of those graphics intense web sites providing tutorials for Jasc PSP and after I realized the limitations of Jasc's program (at that time, it was very limited) I had to venture into Photoshop and relearn some of the things that I had learned through Paintshop Pro. This is where I started graphics and designing flyers for relatives and such.

Then I found geocities offering free web hosting and learned HTML and got heavily involved in design; using the techniques i learned for photoshop... I could make fair looking web pages without too much trouble.

By the time I was in high school, I took a c++ class and started to develop my interest in high-level programming languages. After a year of C++, i could basically code anything from a single cout << "Hello world"; to a object-oriented visual program that could be run from the command prompt. Now I transition toward the web again, and I learned that PHP is almost exactly like C++ (semantics, some syntax, strucuture). I think this is when I started to freelance as a designer so that I could pay for hosting and make some money instead of working at a local harris teeter (grocery store) making $6/hour bagging peoples ice creme and brocoli.

So far, I've had over 20 different clients and 50 different programming/design jobs sporadically when I had the time and requests. Now I am 19 years old learned Scheme (a functional programming language taught at my school - the language was only created for educational purposes only and it follows the semantics of lisp which is widely used for AI programming) and am currently learning Java since it's a requirement for my major ;)

I guess I'm getting interested in running servers and learning more about unix/linux operating systems. I guess I should buy a book? (Anyone recommend any linux books that might teach a linux newbie the depths and how-tos in learning how to run a server?)

I personally wouldn't mind dealing with teens in my business, especially since I've been one and experienced some things that I would rather not have happened. I congratulate those teens who are serious and dedicated at their work or business that they've started and I applaud them... I rather see more of them then seeing kids using drugs or extensive amount of alcohol for no apparent reason... I think these kinds of teens need to find something that interest them. Drug use and alcohol use seems to be the alternative... "programming is boring, reading a book is boring, too late to play sports... hey! lets go drinking!"

As a ... well, I guess since i'm 9TEEN, im still a teen :D Well, in all the clients that I had for design and development, I appreciated those who treated me like an adult then those who were interested in treating me like I personally should have been particularly appreciative of them because they decided to hire a teen.

I think I blabbed enough for one post - and I just had a conversation with a friend so I forgot what other things I was about to post... but hey, if you can suggest any resources/books in administering a linux server easily, suggest away! (PM or email me since I don't want to take this thread off course!)

Thanks

I think that if you just don't mention your age when your doing business, things will work out fine. I was 10 when I made my first website programmed in html (no WYSIWYG junk for me!).

Just as long as you have a parent helping you, take it seriously, and act like an adult you'll be fine.

Brian

Another question would be, " How many actually ask how old the owner is? "

Hey!
Time to put my comments in!
I am YOUNGER (not saying my acutal age because people would loose respect for me)
Some people on these boards know my age...
But anyway..
I currently work for a Host...(doing tech support)
I have been roaming these boards for over a year now.. and have had a great time! I think im good with Web Hosting and related technologies...
I think when looking at a young person first of all you do have to exam there age.. but I do not think you can pass judement on them for that....(I would insert a bile quote here.. The one about judement, I think its in Matthew... Not sure)
But.. anyway...
Thats my 2 cents is that you can't just pass judment on there age.. but also have to look at there skills.:D

My 0.02

Chris

hmmm... i am a 17 year old... i have dealt with both, adults and teens... both of them have there spoilt eggs... before i give any projects or take any projects fro, anyone, i speak to them like crazy... get a feel of the person... and if i see they are serious... i go ahead with it...


to me, its all abt that person, AGE doesnt play any role in it... its who they are that matters more...

It's one thing to admit that you're young and say that you know enough to RUN a webhosting company, it's another when you guarantee certain features, but don't have the backing to actually do so.

We've helped several hosting companies move from the "Hobby Hosting" stage to being a real business. About 25 percent of these people were about your age and were very determined. That is something that is lost in a lot of bigger companies. One group of high schooler's started out with 1 Server in a basement with 1 T1 and offered hosting to local businesses. After 4 years of mostly part time involvement they have two racks at Above.net , one of which they use for monitor space.

Young people have the drive that's CEO's and CTO's lose over time. The one thing that was characteristic of all there companies was that they never told how old they were. To their clients they were there when they needed them.

:)

What does this mean for you? Keep doing what you're doing.

Originally posted by Chicken

That is about the only reason employers require you to have degrees. Many jobs are nearly 100% on-the-job training, and often you won't end up working in the same field you studied, but a degree proves the quote above.

The same holds true for military training. Most positions won't require you to get up at 4am and hike 10 miles up a mountain, but the fact you did it for 3 years and completed it says something about you.


At great risk of offending the moderator:D

Don't talk about UNi Degrees and think they mean that you have commitment to stick at something for a period of time.

My Brother in-law has been at Uni for the last 13 years, still living with his parents. In my books that isn't commitment, that's living it up at the public & parents expense!

I'm 29 and I've worked for the same company since I left School at the age of 15. without a Uni Degree.

As for Age, unless they see you, how will these people know your Age??

________________________
Brian

<<Please set up an actual signature via the PROFILES link above>>

Originally posted by Tetraboy
Another question would be, " How many actually ask how old the owner is? "


I would.
Rather, I would like to know more about the owner of the company, such as where he/she is coming from ( a seasoned host, a programmer, or someone who wants to hop on the bandwagon), if that's a full time business or just a hobby.
Too bad it's not easy to find out such things.

I am 20, so I guess I am young enough to say that things are really volatile when you 're 16-21.....you get into relationships, you go off to college, you go off for summer programs etc
What happens to your hosting business then?
In all this, is it guranteed that interest in the business won't be lost?
What happens to the customers then..whose business is dependent on you for their survival, whose owners have families to feed (you don't)

Hey everyone that's a teenager, please can you make it big in web hosting and then make everyone sick by saying your like 17 and have millions of dollars (pounds if you live where I do).

How many times have we seen young folk make it big on the Internet, the fact of the matter is this, I as a company could not give to hoots what age you are, what I can about is can you do the job.. bottom line, nothing else matters.

Recently I had 2 young people in the UK approach my company for DNS services and other stuff, did I ask them what age you are, no I said here is the cost? They paid, job done, everyone happy.. now there motive for providing hosting services is so they don't have to go to college... Parents said get a job or go to college (college is free in the UK by the way), so get a job they have.. the company is all nice and legal and they are working from early morning to very every late at night, so I say good on them.

--
Best Wishes,

Clarke
UK Internet Sites Ltd
http://www.ukinternetsites.com

British NIC: http://www.britishnic.com
Website Availability: http://www.websiteavailability.com
Cut and Paste Scripts: http://www.cutandpastescripts.com

Age is not really a problem. There are other much older hosts but it's no point if they have a big ego and attitude problem. The important thing is the maturity, attitude and service level of your staff.

Well I am 17 years old, and I have spoke to most of the hosts that were in this forum for the longest time. All my clients I know and they know if they have a problem they can call, email, AIM what have you. I like to know all my clients, I want them to know a person that they can trust is hosting them.

I am often critized about being on the computer too much. My friends see that I was on the computer for 18 hours they wonder why. I leave a forum for help, I leave an emergency phone number when I am going for the night, and AIM on all night.

I might not make the millions but I sure will provide the hosting I promise.

Its really not the Age that matters, it's the knowledge, maturity, and dedication. Now, I do not want to be rude, but there are many great hosts out there that are ran by minors. It's kind of ironic how teens can provide better service than adults sometimes (regarding Chris Gentile and his fraudulant ways). Those are my simple thoughts.

i've debated this topic alot and i have concluded that maturity does not come from age... it comes from experiance and/or knowelge.. i find that age discrimination is wrong it could be likened to sexual discrimination.. i.e a woman now being allowed to work in a factory because the employer belives they do not have the knowelge/strengh ( yes my spelling is bad... but its 12am and i didn't sleep last night )

I agree with the above five comments.

The only reason it seems at times that young people in web hosting or development scenarios don't have as good a work ethic as older people is that they've never had an occasion to develop it. Most of us (I guess I'm the exception?) are pretty smart and therefore have never had to work too hard in school or anything, so I guess we tend to figure the web stuff will be just as easy. I've had a bit of a rude awakening since I started doing contract PHP stuff for people and realized that a deadline wasn't always gonna be the day you finished the project.

But I don't think it's too much to expect that young people will learn how to work hard and plan ahead and deal with situations in a mature fashion.