Hello,


I need dedicated Server with protection Anti-DDoS HARDWARE (non software), like the call FloodGuard de ThePlanet and that lets use IRC.


Sagonet lets to me use IRC but it does not have protection anti-DDoS hardware and they always attack to me, ********** the same.... serverMatrix has protection anti-DDoS hardware (floodguard), but it prohibits IRC


To say a Web to me please.




Regards,
Doble.

and yet you wonder why companies dont want IRC on the network. Its because it attracks DDoS.

well if you wait untill the 9th i think it is ServerMatrix will start to allow irc although there going to have heavy rules inplace :/

perhaps but ServerMAtrix late a month or two... and I need to offer service IRC (legal, nothing illegal) and that has protection AntiDDos hardware, is urgent : (

I'd say atrivo but I don't think they're accepting new irc customers, would have to ask emil (sales@atrivo.com I guess...) to see.

Expect to pay a few hundred dollars for a lowspec box and little bandwidth if you want "AntiDDOS" preventing ddos i not cheap

Everyone who starts an IRC server would inevitably starts it legally, it is the users which misuse it for illegal purposes.

As you state, that you are perpetually being attacked and the thing is that IRC unless closed and very private would inevitably be a magnet for attack.

And with that said and done, you might want to look at
http://www.blacklotus.net/servers.html . They specialized in IRC.

Usually IRC servers arent just "attacked" for a random reason. There's always more to it than just IRC being the dirty underworld of the internet :)

Its usually because someone annoys a kiddie during a game of CS, and he decides to use his 1000+ member botnet against Johnny's clan channel.

There are also alot of good people on IRC networks.

Originally posted by eddy2099
Everyone who starts an IRC server would inevitably starts it legally, it is the users which misuse it for illegal purposes.

As you state, that you are perpetually being attacked and the thing is that IRC unless closed and very private would inevitably be a magnet for attack.

And with that said and done, you might want to look at
http://www.blacklotus.net/servers.html . They specialized in IRC.

Oh goody, the company that will screw you over. Now I know deathnova will say hes going to sue me for libel just like he says to everyone else that says anything bad about blacklotus, but that BS just won't stop me.

Now first off, blacklotus's network is terrible. They have an outage at least once every single day. The last one was 18 hours ago, and their was one about 24 hrs prior to that as well. Blacklotus also will NOT allow you to see the ingress traffic to your box, why? I'd love to know. Explain to me how they claim your server is dosed when the irc network its connected to hasn't been dosed in 2 months, the servername does not resolve, it was holding 50 users, had not been in any dns pool since 1 week prior, does not run any websites nor mail server nor nameserver? That you can ask blacklotus, and of course they will give you the good 'ol response telling you they can not give you access to your servers bw from the switch (and the mrtg running on the box, of course, just showed a sudden drop of bw after they removed the null-route for the alleged dos that they will never allow you to know any details about. However, now that net-sentry bought out blacklotus, net-sentry allows you to view your ingress traffic.

Now besides their network which is terrible, their support is just as bad. Ok now they replace box ~2 months after we tried everything to get the ircd not to core on the box, even switched OS a few times and still it cored everytime. So weeks later deathnova decides to replace the box so we'll stop flaming him on WHT about him not willing to do anything about the hardware issues of the box. DeathNova told us that he was doing more than any other provider would be doing in the same situation. Of course thats just crap. Managed.com box kept rebooting every couple minutes (default install before I even touched kernel) so I ran a mem test, it showed the 2nd mem chip was bad, I told managed.com and they replaced and upgraded the box within 1hour. Now DeathNova offered to give the box an extra 512mb ram for free because he was confident that it did not have enough memory to run hybrid-ircd w/ 1000 users. So that was a nice jesture I'll admit. So I think it was 5 days later he put up the working box, with this there was an agreement that they would handle the kernel because the admin must be incompetent since the box keeps rebooting every hour. Common sense eh? So they go ahead and do that...never really tested the load past 1500 or so, but that was fine even though the network outages kept occuring everyday. Now to deathnova, we have 4 working servers with the same config running 5.2.1-RELEASE-p9 that have never had any problems whatsoever. So go ahead and call me/tim incompetent - freedom of speech, right? *cough* forced NDA.

The new box has been running for at least a couple of months, I dont want to go back and check exactly how long so I won't. Now it was rebooting every 30 minutes or so for a couple of days - not sure why but it was. Atm the box has been up for a couple of days without crashing. If deathnova would have allowed the owner to cancel his contract and get a refund for the remaining months, as hes tried time and time again, then we wouldn't be in this mess. I've seen another angry customer that has posted about wanting to get out of his/her contract with blacklotus just as bad. Not going to mention his/her name as deathnova is well aware.

Now this whole experience with blacklotus is not mine, it is a friends experience (whom I've known for ~3 years). So go ahead and call it libel deathnova, but facts are facts.

Now to end my rambling. I know many irc networks that disallow any server on fdc or blacklotus's network because there is downtime every single day. This is why I think its best for you to look elsewhere if you need a server for irc. Atrivo is my personal favorite but they don't seem to be doing irc anymore.

I have no experience with BlackLotus but they seems to come highly recommended each time someone wanted an IRC hosting.

while sagonet doesn't have any like, pro-active flood guards, their admins still do a excellent job, assuming they can actually control the attack of course :)

If the attack is smaller than your max pipe in, then they'll help filter it as best they can, but if it's over (like my massive 500Mbit), they'll just NULL the IP for the time being.

Their tech's helped out a lot with Mbit counts, a few graphs, ip sniffs (which helped me nail most of the boxes since the dork just had ~15 boxes or so).

Though, as usual, you gotta be fair with anyone you pick. Make sure you don't chew them out and somehow try to blame the dos on them or something ;)

I found that if i was calm and gave any/all information i could to my admins, they work/talk so much easier ;)

So, without further or due, here's my thumbs up for sago! :)

:agree: :agree:

~Francisco

yup try chating to sagonet/BlackLotus over instant messenger or something and just see if they support what you need.

atrivo.com isnt much of a website or is it a different url?

mnu,

It's pretty funny to read your rants regarding the server Jason Strickland has with us (oh, no signed NDA in place?) and the performance of our network. I do not know all of the details prior to our acquistion, but I do know the details since.

The server in question was screwed up by the admins and required the OS to be re-installed. We promptly initiated the process.

In terms of Jason wanting out of the contract. He prepaid for 12 months of service. There are no stipulations within the contract for refunding funds prepaid for early termination. The only early termination clause relates to a fee equivalent to a portion of the remaining contract term. Net Sentry's standard terms of service provide that all payments are final and non-refundable. As such, because there was nothing to the contrary in the contract, our initial response was "No Refund". After further discussion, we made a good-will offer and requested a NDA. Jason never responded. If he wants to take his business elsewhere, he can.

As to network performance. Since acquiring BlackLotus, we have added an additional GigE transit link and new core router. The recent outages you mention (and yes, I view them as significant and major) were caused by DDoS and the fact that our new infrastructure was not sufficiently "tweaked" to the environment. This has been resolved and we have had no further outages despite seeing attacks well over 80Mbps.

Your buddy runs an IRC server that frequently receives attacks on a network that frequently receives attacks. There will be outages due to attack. We've taken the necessary measures to isolate those outages to only the targets of attack. If you don't want your server going down, don't make it the target of attacks.

eddy2099 and Trix, thanks for the recommendations.

If you have any further questions, issues, or comments, please feel free to direct them to me personally.

Atrivo is not allowing irc any more.

Mnu sounds familiar. Who is it I'm reminded of.... Oh ya. that crazy bible-thumper that talks to himself on the street corner.

You just know when there's one vocal complaintant for every ten recommendations that chances are it's the complainer whos at fault.

How can a provider that advertises dos protection complain about a client that gets ddos frequently?!?! don't they advertise they provide a service for someone who is high risk of ddos?

When it comes to dos protection for irc the best budget providers I have seen as of lately is definatly atrivo. As for bllc/net-sentry this is pdis rant and I will let him prove the point back but I will admit the service there for what we paid has been absolute garbage and to now blame it claiming our server there has taking so much dos is just pathetic. But anyways if your just hosting an irc server and not trying to do shells you can just find a place that does 100mbit ports and les the attack go. Many of these do alot better then people realize as long as its not a syn attack the server is usually fine. Places like this would be velcom any of their 3 datacenters, ********** isnt bad about this, and interservers is another good one. I will also put a 2nd suggestion on sago they dont do any filtering but they are cheap and stable. Rackcheck is a good european solution also. Would also like to add when it comes to dos atrivo has to take a huge upon huge ammount of it due to the amount of irc servers in which they have and it VERY rarely affects their network. Emil does one hell of a good job and hes a good guy to talk.

b3n,

I'm not complaining about our customers. It's one of our customers that is complaining. They are engaging in activities that make them the target of DDoS attacks (unlike most of our DDoS mitigation customers). We do what we can to mitigate those attacks, however, they still experience outages. What this customer needs to realize is - it is not our fault their server crashes when they get attacked.

We absolutely provide an excellent service to those that are high-risk for DDoS attack. However, most realize and accept the responsibility for their own actions.

Once again, if you have any issues or questions regarding our services, please feel free to contact me directly.

In response to mripguru:

After further discussion, we made a good-will offer and requested a NDA. Jason never responded. If he wants to take his business elsewhere, he can.

I am the owner of the box in question. And I will say that $185 refund plus signing an NDA was not much of a offer when their was 5 months left on a contract that cost me $1459.20 for the year.

As for prepaying, I did receive a discount of 16.67% for an annual prepayment, however my contract with BLCC never states that with prepayments, that I would not be do a refund, nor does it state that BLCC does not give refunds on prepayments. Even though Net-Sentry owns BLCC now, I am still under the same agreement, not the Net-Sentry ones.

The following is from my contract regarding the graceful termination.

8. Graceful Termination. Client may terminate this Agreement and any Service Order by giving BLCC at least ten (10) days written notice in conjunction with a certified check equal to fifty thirty percent (30%) of the remaining Service Order plus a fifty dollar ($50.00) administration fee. Terminations which do not accompany this payment, or any portion thereof, in addition to all amounts due shall be subject to a penalty equal to eighty five percent (85%) of the remaining Service Order, or five hundred dollars ($500.00), which ever is greater, plus any collections, interest, and reasonable attorneys fees.

As for not responding to your ridiculous offer, reference your email ticket system on 7/24/04 at 12:30 AM EST. I think you will see clearly that I stated the following: "Now, there is no way I'm gonna lose $600+ on a system when the system itself can't run over 90 days without problems. Kind of seems familiar don't ya think." I do want you to find that email because in it, I also state that I will not be renewing the contract once it expires on 1/25/05. I think that gives you the 60 day notice that is required.

Let me add to the fact regarding the stability of the system. Every 3 months, I am forced to get the server reimaged. What makes it worse is that BLCC will only put FreeBSD 5.2.x on their boxes because I am told the hardware is not backward compatible with 4.x

My box at BLCC currently runs FreeBSD 5.2.1-RELEASE-p9.

I have another box located at 800hosting that runs FreeBSD 5.2.1-RELEASE-p8 with no problems.

My admin maintains all of my systems and I will say that he is more than capable of configuring a FreeBSD server.

As for DDos against my server, I just find it hard to imagine that only my server out of 41 on our network that gets attacked. I have no doubt that other servers on the Net-Sentry/BLCC gets attacked but when I'm always told that its my box, it just makes me laugh. I have the switch MRTG that I am provided from Net-Sentry/BLCC and I can say that I have yet to see activity of Ddos.

As of the last image that I performed with BLCC, it took the staff on LimeLight 1 hour to image the box. Not to mention that I am charged $75/per half hour so by doing a little bit of math, $150 for a reimaging that should take less than 10 minutes. The first time I had the box imaged, it was performed in <30 minutes b/c I was charged only $75. What made the admins take longer this time, your assumption is as good as mine.

I think I will end on that note.

Regards,
-Jason

Originally posted by Jas0n
In response to mripguru:
As for prepaying, I did receive a discount of 16.67% for an annual prepayment, however my contract with BLCC never states that with prepayments, that I would not be do a refund, nor does it state that BLCC does not give refunds on prepayments. Even though Net-Sentry owns BLCC now, I am still under the same agreement, not the Net-Sentry ones.

The following is from my contract regarding the graceful termination.

8. Graceful Termination. Client may terminate this Agreement and any Service Order by giving BLCC at least ten (10) days written notice in conjunction with a certified check equal to fifty thirty percent (30%) of the remaining Service Order plus a fifty dollar ($50.00) administration fee. Terminations which do not accompany this payment, or any portion thereof, in addition to all amounts due shall be subject to a penalty equal to eighty five percent (85%) of the remaining Service Order, or five hundred dollars ($500.00), which ever is greater, plus any collections, interest, and reasonable attorneys fees.



Jason, you just stated it yourself. Your contract with BLCC makes no stipulation either way regarding prepayments. There is no contractual obligation to provide a refund for a prepayment. However, we made an offer anyway. You didn't accept it.

I am not aware of any current hardware issues with your box. I am not aware of any issues since the os re-install. I also don't see any tickets regarding issues for your box prior to the os install (except the OS install itself) for a few months. My understanding (once again, this is prior to our acquisition of BLCC) is that your server was running as a BLCC managed box with no issues. You requested BLCC to stop managing it and after that, you had the reported issue.

I'm not saying the BLCC network hasn't had problems, but none of the BLCC network issues would have caused your server to reboot. Neither BLCC nor Net Sentry accept any responsibility for the instability of your server at this time.

It's really funny. Considering all of the customers that BLCC has and there's only 1 that continually comes complaining to WHT regarding our service. Oh, well.

Hi,


1- I do not understand anything... say that blacklotus... others say that... we are not going to see, blacklotus uses protection HARDWARE antiDDoS?



2- for example ServerMatrix is not worth to me. since they say that if I want to use IRC will not put FloodGuard in my server... and if I do not say to him that it is for IRCd, simply I do not say anything, and I ask for a FloodGuard, that happened '?


3- others say that atrivo, atrivo.com does not show any type of information, ¿?


4- and as far as fdcservers? uses hardware antiDDoS?




I need an urgent answer, please


thank you very much :)
Doble

Originally posted by Doble
Hi,


1- I do not understand anything... say that blacklotus... others say that... we are not going to see, blacklotus uses protection HARDWARE antiDDoS?



2- for example ServerMatrix is not worth to me. since they say that if I want to use IRC will not put FloodGuard in my server... and if I do not say to him that it is for IRCd, simply I do not say anything, and I ask for a FloodGuard, that happened '?


3- others say that atrivo, atrivo.com does not show any type of information, ¿?


4- and as far as fdcservers? uses hardware antiDDoS?




I need an urgent answer, please


thank you very much :)
Doble


Have you done a google search? ircallowed.com

Originally posted by Doble
Hi,


1- I do not understand anything... say that blacklotus... others say that... we are not going to see, blacklotus uses protection HARDWARE antiDDoS?


thank you very much :)
Doble

Yes, we now have hardware based anti DDoS services and are in the process of acquiring more and expanding our infrastructure.

Originally posted by mripguru
As to network performance. Since acquiring BlackLotus, we have added an additional GigE transit link and new core router. The recent outages you mention (and yes, I view them as significant and major) were caused by DDoS and the fact that our new infrastructure was not sufficiently "tweaked" to the environment. This has been resolved and we have had no further outages despite seeing attacks well over 80Mbps.



You meant 800Mbps, not 80Mbps, right? As, I'll see more than 80Mbps to an idividual server on an average day without any problems, nor would I expect any...

Originally posted by mripguru
[B]mnu,

It's pretty funny to read your rants regarding the server Jason Strickland has with us (oh, no signed NDA in place?) and the performance of our network. I do not know all of the details prior to our acquistion, but I do know the details since.

You told jason that he had to sign an NDA if he wanted to end the contract. Go check your oh so excellent records since you don't even know what happened on the BLCC side.

The server in question was screwed up by the admins and required the OS to be re-installed. We promptly initiated the process.

Oh really? It was still running the kernel BLCC installed - the only thing we installed as root was net-snmp so we could see when BLCC claimed dos that there was no traffic on the box and since BLCC would not allow jason to see incoming bw on the switch - BLCC never once showed any proof of dos.

In terms of Jason wanting out of the contract. He prepaid for 12 months of service. There are no stipulations within the contract for refunding funds prepaid for early termination. The only early termination clause relates to a fee equivalent to a portion of the remaining contract term. Net Sentry's standard terms of service provide that all payments are final and non-refundable. As such, because there was nothing to the contrary in the contract, our initial response was "No Refund".

He prepaid for 12 months of service because that was the minimum term that Jeff (DeathNova) allowed.

After further discussion, we made a good-will offer and requested a NDA. Jason never responded. If he wants to take his business elsewhere, he can.

Oh he has, I know he enjoys his velcom server with 8 months of 100% uptime thats much much cheaper. And if you're wondering about his admin - his admin also manages 3 other 5.2.1 servers on the same network that have never had one problem: sago, easydedicated, and rackcheck. Call him incompetent all you want, but this is his job.

As to network performance. Since acquiring BlackLotus, we have added an additional GigE transit link and new core router. The recent outages you mention (and yes, I view them as significant and major) were caused by DDoS and the fact that our new infrastructure was not sufficiently "tweaked" to the environment. This has been resolved and we have had no further outages despite seeing attacks well over 80Mbps.

Good for you, someone actually trying to fix the daily downtime.

Your buddy runs an IRC server that frequently receives attacks on a network that frequently receives attacks. There will be outages due to attack. We've taken the necessary measures to isolate those outages to only the targets of attack. If you don't want your server going down, don't make it the target of attacks.

I find this funny again, out of ~35 other client servers, the one that is holding the least (50 users), not pooled in weeks and servername doesn't even resolve keeps getting dosed - and when it gets this alleged dos that you say, you guys show no proof of it, just saying it was down because of dos. Whatever you say - we both know you will never show any proof of it, because there isn't any to show.

eddy2099 and Trix, thanks for the recommendations.

Ahh good, people who have seen your irc allowed advertisements, knowing nothing about your network/support, have reccomended you. Cheers.

2- for example ServerMatrix is not worth to me. since they say that if I want to use IRC will not put FloodGuard in my server... and if I do not say to him that it is for IRCd, simply I do not say anything, and I ask for a FloodGuard, that happened '?

Yes, SM doesn't currently allow IRC on their network. You cannot have IRC installed on their network now without breaking their AUP.

Originally posted by mripguru
It's really funny. Considering all of the customers that BLCC has and there's only 1 that continually comes complaining to WHT regarding our service. Oh, well.
Oh really, I'm the only one that comes here to complain. Now you know thats just not true. Lets take a look here:
http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=290484&highlight=blacklotus+netsentry
And heres what sysc said in the 3rd reply:
Originally posted by sysc
BLCCD, is not what it was a few months back anyways. Constant outages. When you confront Jeff about them he trys to sell you stuff to possibly improve service instead of attempting to fix the problems at hand. Literally everyday, there are outages some short some a bit longer, but everyday none the less. On one of our servers with them, we had a special contract in which he gauranteed 99.9% uptime, of course when asked about it he claims because the outages are DDoS Related(Wait dont they specialize in ddos mitigation/prevention?) that the SLA does not apply. When in fact, we braught that server to him for that very reason it was frequently plagued with DDoS. Anyways, in short.. stay away from BLCCD/Net Sentry. If I coud get out of the 1 year contract im locked in Iw ould be gone in a second.

And just for those rare times I comment on the downtime:
http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=294711&highlight=blacklotus+netsentry
http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=300009&highlight=blacklotus+netsentry

Originally posted by mnu
You told jason that he had to sign an NDA if he wanted to end the contract. Go check your oh so excellent records since you don't even know what happened on the BLCC side.

Oh really? It was still running the kernel BLCC installed - the only thing we installed as root was net-snmp so we could see when BLCC claimed dos that there was no traffic on the box and since BLCC would not allow jason to see incoming bw on the switch - BLCC never once showed any proof of dos.

He prepaid for 12 months of service because that was the minimum term that Jeff (DeathNova) allowed.


Good for you, someone actually trying to fix the daily downtime.


No, I did not tell Jason he had to sign an NDA to end the contract. I requested he sign an NDA in order to accept our refund offer. He can end the contract at any time. All he has to do is stop using the server.

If it was still running the BLCC-installed kernel that had generated no errors for several weeks and you only installed net-snmp after receiving the root password, why did it start generating kernel errors reflective of a known hack/attack? If you made no other changes, why did you request an OS install?

No, he prepaid for 12 months to get the discount offered. He was not required to prepay for 12 months. And yes, our standard contract is 12 months, but doesn't require prepayment.

Oh, that's right. You'r not the only one complaining. It's you, sysc, and b3n. Hmm. But why do you all always seem to reference this same buddy that has a server with us?

Now, I've tried to deal with this entire thread in a professional manner. I've stated the facts as I know them. Jason is free to stop using his server at any time. I've acknowledged that BLCC has experienced network issues, but those have been resolved. I've not seen any proof of hardware issues on Jason's server.

If you are currently experiencing a network or hardware issue, please open a trouble ticket so we can respond to it in a professional and efficient manner. Otherwise, go back to your channel so Doble can have his thread back and hopefully receive some good recommendations on IRC providers with hardware-based DDoS mitigation.

btw, I'm going to enjoy my weekend with my family. :)

Originally posted by mripguru
[B]No, I did not tell Jason he had to sign an NDA to end the contract. I requested he sign an NDA in order to accept our refund offer. He can end the contract at any time. All he has to do is stop using the server.

Yes this is true, he wants a refund for the months he will not be using the box of course

If it was still running the BLCC-installed kernel that had generated no errors for several weeks and you only installed net-snmp after receiving the root password, why did it start generating kernel errors reflective of a known hack/attack? If you made no other changes, why did you request an OS install?

We requested a OS reinstall because after several tries to reboot the box with the APC jason paid extra for would bring the box up for a second, then it would crash again everytime. You generously offered to look at the box for $150/hour and we know it took you guys an hour to figure out a 5 minute freebsd install and that it would be faster/cheaper to do the OS reinstall.

No, he prepaid for 12 months to get the discount offered. He was not required to prepay for 12 months. And yes, our standard contract is 12 months, but doesn't require prepayment.

5. Optional One Month Term Setup Fee. Client is given the option of paying a setup fee equal to three hundred dollars ($300.00) or a setup fee equal to ten percent (30%) of the MRR, which ever is greater. This setup fee is in addition to any fees detailed in the Service Order. In exchange, BLCC agrees to reduce the Contract Term to a period of one (1) month
My bad, forgot he didn't want to pay $500 for 1 months service.

Oh, that's right. You'r not the only one complaining. It's you, sysc, and b3n. Hmm. But why do you all always seem to reference this same buddy that has a server with us?

I have no clue who sysc is other than someone who dislikes BLCC - I don't know him in any way and he is NOT referring to Jason.


Now, I've tried to deal with this entire thread in a professional manner. I've stated the facts as I know them. Jason is free to stop using his server at any time. I've acknowledged that BLCC has experienced network issues, but those have been resolved. I've not seen any proof of hardware issues on Jason's server.

Maybe you're missing the fact that the first box blcc setup for jason was found to have a hardware problem. Go ahead and ask Jeff about that. Was he given any compensation for the first couple of months that the box was even more unusable since you had bad hardware? No, of course not.

If you are currently experiencing a network or hardware issue, please open a trouble ticket so we can respond to it in a professional and efficient manner. Otherwise, go back to your channel so Doble can have his thread back and hopefully receive some good recommendations on IRC providers with hardware-based DDoS mitigation.

And for the outages that last more than 15 minutes or so, jason or tim usually did. The only thing ever said was that it was another dos attack on your routers.

btw, I'm going to enjoy my weekend with my family. :)
Thats good that you have a nice family. This has nothing to do with the matter at hand though, BLCCs/Net-sentry's daily downtime is the issue at hand.

Yes this is true, he wants a refund for the months he will not be using the box of course


Once again, we have no contractual obligation to provide a refund.

Optional One Month Term Setup Fee. Client is given the option of paying a setup fee equal to three hundred dollars ($300.00) or a setup fee equal to ten percent (30%) of the MRR, which ever is greater. This setup fee is in addition to any fees detailed in the Service Order. In exchange, BLCC agrees to reduce the Contract Term to a period of one (1) month
My bad, forgot he didn't want to pay $500 for 1 months service.


Yes, if he had wanted month to month service, the 1st month would have been $500. He chose our standard 12 month term. He also chose to prepay for 12 months. Once again, we do not require prepayment for the length of contract. The only reason he chose to prepay was to receive a discount.

Maybe you're missing the fact that the first box blcc setup for jason was found to have a hardware problem. Go ahead and ask Jeff about that. Was he given any compensation for the first couple of months that the box was even more unusable since you had bad hardware? No, of course not.


Yes, I'm aware the original server was replaced, but what impact does that have on your new server? Once again, the trouble ticket that preceeded the OS install referenced an error that has been documented to be the result of a hack/attack. There is no indication that the existing server has any hardware issues.

And for the outages that last more than 15 minutes or so, jason or tim usually did. The only thing ever said was that it was another dos attack on your routers.


The operative term is DID. When was the last time they opened a ticket due to network issues? There has not been a ticket since the OS was re-installed.

So, long story short, your crying over spilled milk. You have a new server with a new OS install. You have an option out of your contract. You have improved network connectivity. Once again, if there is an existing problem, please open a trouble ticket so we can address it directly.

Shaun,

Not to make this a flaming thread, I just wanted to clear one point you made in your previous post:

When was the last time they opened a ticket due to network issues? There has not been a ticket since the OS was re-installed.

There have been 3 tickets opened since the OS was reinstalled was performed on July 24 that reflect on the problems of the network.

The ticket IDs include:
RIO-35941 8/2: Network Latency Still Exists
YWV-23546 8/1: Network Probs again?
UIC-72063 Network Up/Down

And to just ask, if I am your only problem client, then where are your many HAPPY clients that can comment on their experience with BLCC/Net-Sentry.

Regards,
Jason

Originally posted by Jas0n
Shaun,

Not to make this a flaming thread, I just wanted to clear one point you made in your previous post:



There have been 3 tickets opened since the OS was reinstalled was performed on July 24 that reflect on the problems of the network.

The ticket IDs include:
RIO-35941 8/2: Network Latency Still Exists
YWV-23546 8/1: Network Probs again?
UIC-72063 Network Up/Down

And to just ask, if I am your only problem client, then where are your many HAPPY clients that can comment on their experience with BLCC/Net-Sentry.

Regards,
Jason

Jason,

None of those tickets deal specifically with your server. I've already acknowledged that we had a couple of major network issues earlier this week. They were related to a DDoS attack (not against your server) and changes have been made to ensure similar outages will not occur. So, I re-iterate, I have not seen a single ticket from you regarding your server since the os re-install.

Our other happy customers are probably busy doing whatever it is they do. Once again, I don't see any of them here complaining either.

And Jason, I would like to apologize to you once again as I've also done via the tickets and e-mail. I understand you are in a tough situation, but this is business. Since acquiring BLCC, we have taken the necessary steps to improve service and it is happening. I'm sorry you are unhappy with the service you received in the past, but that was the past. I'm am focused on the future and wish you the best with your's.

Let's hope that what you say is true.

Time will be tell.

-Jason

A couple matters of clarification:

jrw:

Yes, Shaun did mean to say 800 megabit.

Everyone else:

Jas0n/mnu/music/b3n/d2k are all members of the IRC network who leases the server in question on this thread. They are not 5 - 6 seperate customers, rather a group of persons continuing to address one service contract. sysc is a diffrent person. This makes a grand total of two people on this forum that have an issue with NSCNAP/BLCC, far less than 1% of our customer base.

I am surprised I was left out of that list guess because I am not in the mood to flame war with you guys but that list is absolutly incorrect. I am the owner of the network the server is used for. mnu is the CO-CEO and Jas0n is one of our executive board. As for music I can't stand him and his go fdc **** I insult him quite often. d2k ya I know him is he at all related in this issue or have anything to do with rizon nope. b3n who the hell is he other then some guy that posted in here. Jeff get your facts straight and then come back and post as always.

Originally posted by DeathNova
A couple matters of clarification:

jrw:

Yes, Shaun did mean to say 800 megabit.

Everyone else:

Jas0n/mnu/music/b3n/d2k are all members of the IRC network who leases the server in question on this thread. They are not 5 - 6 seperate customers, rather a group of persons continuing to address one service contract. sysc is a diffrent person. This makes a grand total of two people on this forum that have an issue with NSCNAP/BLCC, far less than 1% of our customer base.
Wrong, Jas0n is the owner and b3n? whos he? Music? Music is the fdc fan, my network does not accept fdc/blacklotus/staminus servers (those are the only 3 we have found to be incredibly unstable) - thus he is not there. d2k? You mean dk2? not sure if he hangs out on my network atm...

And yes sysc is just another person who comes here to complain about his/her terrible service / network problems with BLCC.

Yes, I mean't dk2 and I almost forgot about Nessun. Regardless of whether any of these people are officially part of Rizon is beyond me, but their complaints are all related to Jason's server. If you search back to their previous threads you'll notice they almost always refer to Jason or his server as "my friend" or "I witnessed this," etc.

Its all in relation to Rizon! :rolleyes:

Well, the original topic was 'Dedicated Floodguard with IRC', so I am going to get back on what the original topic was.

Currently, I am unsure how a couple of these companies filter out DDoS attacks, if they have filtering at all. However, after doing some research, these companies do allow IRC.

BlackLotus (Has DDoS filtering)
Atrivo (Not accepting anymore IRC customers)
Staminus (Has DDoS filtering)
Sagonet (No filtering)
FDCservers (unsure)
Interland (unsure)
S4you (unsure)

However, I am a customer with Staminus, and they do have DDoS filtering. I quote from a previous email from Staminus:
As for a denial of service attack, we have an automatic nullrouter in place which will nullroute the IP getting attacked upstream at UUNet.

Originally posted by DeathNova
Yes, I mean't dk2 and I almost forgot about Nessun. Regardless of whether any of these people are officially part of Rizon is beyond me, but their complaints are all related to Jason's server. If you search back to their previous threads you'll notice they almost always refer to Jason or his server as "my friend" or "I witnessed this," etc.

Its all in relation to Rizon! :rolleyes:
That still leaves me thinking of 2 people having a server at BLCC that complain about the downtime non-stop and I can still think of no one that has a server there that likes them (The people that reccomended them in this thread don't seem to have a server there, just reccomending them because you advertise "ddos mitigation"). Yes deathnova I talk to other nets and they don't allow anything from BLCC either, one net I was talking to just last week delinked one because it was so unstable, as always. The facts are still the facts, BLCC for IRC is horrible.

cerberius:

I should reccomend one correction. Our filtering (Black Lotus) is available only to customers who purchase our Enterprise level service (which is quoted on a case-by-case basis). Filtering is not available to IRC Value customers (which makes up about 60% of our hosting customers). We will null route attacks for any customer regardless of service level, just cannot guarentee complete filtering without the Enterprise level service. In essence:

IRC Value: Low cost, no filtering (null routing only), distribution switch shared by up to 22 other customers. IRC Value customers are subject to "DDoS ripple" (outages caused by other customers attacks).

Advanced: Standard pricing, no filtering (null routing only), dedicated router port (guarenteed 100 megabit burstable and relatively unaffected by the traffic and attack patterns of other customers).

Enterprise: High cost, filtering provided.

mnu:

Kindly reccomend to anyone who has an issue with our level of service to evaluate which plan they're currently purchasing and to reference my last post regarding the diffrences between each level of service.

Please stop trolling, you're scaring the kids :P

Originally posted by DeathNova
mnu:

Kindly reccomend to anyone who has an issue with our level of service to evaluate which plan they're currently purchasing and to reference my last post regarding the diffrences between each level of service.

Please stop trolling, you're scaring the kids :P
Hehe there you go again with the "this is low cost so it should be expected to have constant outages" (not a quote). I think you forget that this is WHT, $150/m for a server on a network that does down at least once a day is NOT LOW COST. So yes the people paying $150/m+ that have daily downtime are upset because they can go with another provider with 100% uptime, more bw, better bw IMO and that is actually CHEAP (less than $100/m) - but they are locked into your 1 year contracts and can't do anything about it. Sysc and Jason are both dying to get out of their 1 year contracts as you well know.

Understood, and i'm dying for you to find something better to do with your time. The dead horse has been beaten once again and there are dozens of theads on this matter. If anyone is interested, they can use "Search."

Originally posted by DeathNova
Understood, and i'm dying for you to find something better to do with your time. The dead horse has been beaten once again and there are dozens of theads on this matter. If anyone is interested, they can use "Search."
Agreed, if you would've given a refund for the remaining months of service then we would've just left you alone. Since this seems impossible to you, I will just keep bringing it up everytime I see anyone saying anything about BLCC to warn them of entering into any contract with BLCC.

Originally posted by mnu
Hehe there you go again with the "this is low cost so it should be expected to have constant outages" (not a quote). I think you forget that this is WHT, $150/m for a server on a network that does down at least once a day is NOT LOW COST. So yes the people paying $150/m+ that have daily downtime are upset because they can go with another provider with 100% uptime, more bw, better bw IMO and that is actually CHEAP (less than $100/m) - but they are locked into your 1 year contracts and can't do anything about it. Sysc and Jason are both dying to get out of their 1 year contracts as you well know.

Once again, Jason is free to discontinue use of his server. But he wont receive the refund he is looking for.

btw, it's funny that you first claim not to know sysc, but now your telling us he can't wait to get out of his contract. So, which is it? Do you know him or not?

BTW, you keep claiming daily outages on our network. Could you please provide documentation to that claim? If there are outages, I'd like to know about them so we can fix them.

And once again, since you don't like our service, leave. There's nothing keeping you here. Jason was not forced to sign a 1 yr term. He was not forced to prepay for 12 months.

That's exactally what the NDA would have accomplished, it was rejected.

The NDA would have accomplished what Jeff?

A partial refund.

Originally posted by mnu
Agreed, if you would've given a refund for the remaining months of service then we would've just left you alone. Since this seems impossible to you, I will just keep bringing it up everytime I see anyone saying anything about BLCC to warn them of entering into any contract with BLCC.

So, in other words, you are now attempting extortion to achieve a payment for which you have no legal claim? What you don't seem to understand is that a refund (which in this case was not legally required) was offered and Jason refused. Any one who is paying monthly on our standard 12 month term can terminate early by paying a "fee" equal to a portion of their remaining monthly recurring charges. This is a standard clause in just about every contract I've seen from a major network provider.

It's amazing to me how you can turn a fee into grounds for a refund.

So, once again, to make a long story short, your barking up the wrong tree. Learn how to read a contract and make sure you read any contract before you sign it.

Originally posted by Jas0n
The NDA would have accomplished what Jeff?

The intent of the NDA was to preclude public knowledge of the refund offer to avoid setting a precedence. I did not want the world to know that we were willing to break our TOS.

And before anybody jumps on it. Net Sentry's TOS do apply because the situation was not strictly covered in the existing contract.

Originally posted by mripguru
Once again, Jason is free to discontinue use of his server. But he wont receive the refund he is looking for.

That would accomplish oh so much. He tried to sell it before and no one was interested so nothing he can do about that I guess.

btw, it's funny that you first claim not to know sysc, but now your telling us he can't wait to get out of his contract. So, which is it? Do you know him or not?

Heh. I said "Sysc and Jason are both dying to get out of their 1 year contracts as you well know." I only know this because he posted it before in this thread: http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=290484&highlight=blacklotus+netsentry
Originally posted by sysc
If I coud get out of the 1 year contract im locked in Iw ould be gone in a second.
So since I read about another persons terrible experience with blacklotus I guess that means I know him? Good to know.

BTW, you keep claiming daily outages on our network. Could you please provide documentation to that claim? If there are outages, I'd like to know about them so we can fix them.

Jason posts about it in support tickets all the time, its the same old thing saying: our router got dosed, the dos has stopped. I don't see what it accomplishes as thats all thats said everytime and it only seems to happen more often.

And once again, since you don't like our service, leave. There's nothing keeping you here. Jason was not forced to sign a 1 yr term. He was not forced to prepay for 12 months.
Hes kept there because of no refund. He wanted to pay on a monthly basis but didn't consider and extra $500 or so worth it.

Originally posted by mripguru
So, in other words, you are now attempting extortion to achieve a payment for which you have no legal claim? What you don't seem to understand is that a refund (which in this case was not legally required) was offered and Jason refused. Any one who is paying monthly on our standard 12 month term can terminate early by paying a "fee" equal to a portion of their remaining monthly recurring charges. This is a standard clause in just about every contract I've seen from a major network provider.
Jason was offered ~$180 I think for the remaining 5 months of service (hes paid well over 1800 to BLCC so far for 8 months of HORRIBLE service), and if there wasn't an NDA attached to that he might have accepted it.
Originally posted by mripguru
It's amazing to me how you can turn a fee into grounds for a refund.

So, once again, to make a long story short, your barking up the wrong tree. Learn how to read a contract and make sure you read any contract before you sign it. [/B]
Well he thought that paying almost 2x as much as his other servers on a "ddos mitigated" network, that it would be very good. Of course he couldn't have been more wrong as his cheap providers keep a nice 100% uptime opposed to BLCCs daily downtime...We now know that was very wrong to assume.

I'm getting really tired of typing the same thing over and over again since you just don't seem to get it: improve your network so it doesn't have its daily downtime and jason would be somewhat happy with it.

Originally posted by mnu

Hes kept there because of no refund. He wanted to pay on a monthly basis but didn't consider and extra $500 or so worth it. [/B]

Once again, please learn how to read contracts. 1st, it was not $500 extra. It was a $300 setup fee. 2nd, The clause you posted would have allowed Jason to have a month to month contract and be able to cancel at any time. He did not have to have a month to month contract to pay on a monthly basis. 3rd, he prepaid so he could get a discount.

Just to be clear - He did not have to pay the $300 setup fee just to be able to pay on a monthly basis. He chose to prepay for a year to receive a discount.

Hindsight is 20/20. Learn to read contracts and you should be able to avoid being in a similar situation in the future.

Appearantly there is some confusion as to the meaning of "mitigation,"

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=mitigation

:gone:

Originally posted by mripguru
Once again, please learn how to read contracts. 1st, it was not $500 extra. It was a $300 setup fee. 2nd, The clause you posted would have allowed Jason to have a month to month contract and be able to cancel at any time. He did not have to have a month to month contract to pay on a monthly basis. 3rd, he prepaid so he could get a discount.

Just to be clear - He did not have to pay the $300 setup fee just to be able to pay on a monthly basis. He chose to prepay for a year to receive a discount.
Very true, it would've just been $500 for the 1st month of service.
He prepaid so he didn't have the pay the $300 setup fee.
Originally posted by mripguru
Hindsight is 20/20. Learn to read contracts and you should be able to avoid being in a similar situation in the future. [/B]
Nah, only thing ya gotta do is stay far far away from net-sentry/blacklotus. Jason prepays on one of his other servers and he did consider getting rid of it and they offered a refund of the remaining months and honestly he thought most companies would offer a refund if the service was really bad and unusable for its purposes. No clue if that was in the contract or not, never read that companies...

Jeff seemed pretty cool when Jason talked to him before buying the box and thought he'd be willing to work with him if any troubles arose, but he also thought that you'd have a good network. Boy o boy was he wrong.

NSCNAP ("net-sentry") has nothing to do with this. Your complaint roots from BLCC under its old management and your network complaints are related to a distribution switch at a single POP (Phoenix).

You have no right to make comments regarding the quality of service at other POP's and on behalf of other NSCNAP customers that are in no way related to our IRC operations.

Originally posted by DeathNova
NSCNAP ("net-sentry") has nothing to do with this. Your complaint roots from BLCC under its old management and your network complaints are related to a distribution switch at a single POP (Phoenix).
Net-sentry owns BLCC, and the problems are still happening so it damn well has everything to do with net-sentry. The old management = you as far as I know.
Originally posted by DeathNova
You have no right to make comments regarding the quality of service at other POP's and on behalf of other NSCNAP customers that are in no way related to our IRC operations.
When did I make a comment about other POPs??? Did I ever mention them?? No. I said to "stay far far away from net-sentry/blacklotus" because of the network issues and support unwilling to look at the box when it randomly crashes on the kernel BLCC installed/compiled without charging the awesome $150/hr. Yes this was AFTER you gave tim the root password - he installed net-snmp since your techs couldn't figure out how to.

So you're saying its just the PHX POP that has daily downtime? Good to know but that doesn't help Jason any now does it.

No, its just the IRC Value distribution switches that have downtime.

Thread closed, its gone a little off topic.