Hi guys! Maybe my question is stupid but I'm a newbie.. so be fair
:) :) :) :) :)

I work for a Web Design company in Italy and we plan to host at least 100 little websites (5-10MB), 20 medium size (30-50 mb) 10 large sites (100mb) and 4-8 big sites (dedicated) in the 2002

What should I do? Reading the forum and surfing the web it seems that 99$ for a server @Rackshack is the best solution. Do you have any comment? Please give me your opinions.. :confused:

Thanks!

Marco

Rackshack is your best option..IMHO

Originally posted by Marco JKD
Hi guys! Maybe my question is stupid but I'm a newbie.. so be fair
:) :) :) :) :)

I work for a Web Design company in Italy and we plan to host at least 100 little websites (5-10MB), 20 medium size (30-50 mb) 10 large sites (100mb) and 4-8 big sites (dedicated) in the 2002

What should I do? Reading the forum and surfing the web it seems that 99$ for a server @Rackshack is the best solution. Do you have any comment? Please give me your opinions.. :confused:

Thanks!

Marco

A dedicated server is the best route to take if you are wanting to host that amount of sites - and RackShack's offering is very competitively priced, and does include Plesk which will make administering your sites *much* easier.

Regards
Matt

I would like to hear someone that tells me the negative aspects of this solution.. just to be aware of them before buying the server.

Another couple of questions (ths second one maybe is OT):

1) What kind of server should I buy?

2) I'll register many domains.. how I could handle the registration with a cheap provider?

Thanks,

Marco

Hi,
I dedicated server is a good option for you.

I just want to let you know to watch out for the sales tax.
Beacuse RS is located in texas you have to pay them 8.25% tax
and I think you have to pay texas sales tax on your income from
the server. I think texas is the only state that has a tax code as
harsh as this. However, I am far from an expert on tax issues.
You may want to contact RS.

Hi,
I dedicated server is a good option for you.

I just want to let you know to watch out for the sales tax.
Beacuse RS is located in texas you have to pay them 8.25% tax
and I think you have to pay texas sales tax on your income from
the server. I think texas is the only state that has a tax code as
harsh as this. However, I am far from an expert on tax issues.
You may want to contact RS.


Intresting. For the 8% on the 99$ it doesn't matter but on the income.. I have to pay them also from Italy? What if let my customere pay for the design a little bit more and I give free hosting? But the problem remains for the dedicated..

Suggestions?

M.

Hi,
I really don't know. RS should know. Because you are out of the US I really don't know.

Sorry about that.

Chris.

Marco, yes I think you have to pay the 8.25% tax even if you're in Italy.

Are most of the users of the hosted sites from Italy, or are they from elsewhere? You should try a traceroute from various places to get an idea of what the response time would be for a Rackshack server. Try traceroute.org (http://www.traceroute.org/) and also http://216.40.243.2 (a test server on Rackshack's network).

First of all I don't know how to tell if the results are good or poor. Just in case.. I'm connected @home with a 56k dial up connection. Anything else that could influence the test?


I got:

Traceroute
Result for www.rackshack.net:
1 router.cere.pa.cnr.it (147.163.3.1) 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms
2 rc-unipa.pa.garr.net (193.206.137.209) 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
3 na-pa-2.garr.net (193.206.134.141) 11 ms 11 ms 12 ms
4 mi-na.garr.net (193.206.134.9) 23 ms 22 ms 22 ms
5 ny4-milan.dante.net (212.1.200.25) 113 ms 117 ms 120 ms
6 500.POS2-1.GW8.NYC1.ALTER.NET (157.130.60.249) 125 ms 113 ms 115 ms
7 197.at-5-0-0.XL2.NYC1.ALTER.NET (152.63.20.2) 114 ms 114 ms 114 ms
8 308.at-2-3-0.XR2.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.27.233) 114 ms 113 ms 114 ms
9 0.so-4-0-0.XL2.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.9.90) 114 ms 114 ms 114 ms
10 POS7-0.BR2.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.22.229) 115 ms 114 ms 114 ms
11 a3-0-2-0.r01.nwrknj01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.9.165) 114 ms 116 ms 115 ms
12 p4-2-1-0.r01.nycmny06.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.4.210) 116 ms 115 ms 115 ms
13 p4-7-0-0.r00.nycmny06.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.4.192) 117 ms 115 ms 116 ms
14 p4-0-1.r01.phlapa01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.125) 118 ms 118 ms 118 ms
15 p4-1-0-0.r00.phlapa01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.153) 118 ms 118 ms 118 ms
16 p4-6-0-0.r00.stngva01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.105) 121 ms 121 ms 121 ms
17 p16-3-0-0.r01.crtntx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.5.34) 157 ms 156 ms 158 ms
18 p16-2-0-0.r01.dllstx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.5.36) 156 ms 156 ms 156 ms
19 p4-0-0-0.r00.hstntx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.194) 162 ms 162 ms 162 ms
20 ge-1-1-0.a03.hstntx01.us.ra.verio.net (129.250.30.216) 163 ms 162 ms 161 ms
21 p1-1-0-0.a03.hstntx01.us.ce.verio.net (128.241.9.246) 161 ms 162 ms 161 ms
22 twhou-7200-1.ev1.net (207.218.245.1) 163 ms 162 ms 162 ms
23 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 172 ms 178 ms 216 ms
24 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 198 ms 200 ms 212 ms
25 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 169 ms 171 ms 171 ms
26 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 214 ms 179 ms 238 ms
27 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 188 ms 192 ms 224 ms
28 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 214 ms 202 ms 221 ms
29 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 188 ms 199 ms 198 ms
30 tayhou-223-8.ev1.net (207.218.223.8) 229 ms 228 ms 228 ms

and..

Result for 216.40.243.2:
1 router.cere.pa.cnr.it (147.163.3.1) 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms
2 rc-unipa.pa.garr.net (193.206.137.209) 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
3 na-pa-1.garr.net (193.206.134.137) 12 ms 11 ms 11 ms
4 mi-na.garr.net (193.206.134.9) 23 ms 22 ms 22 ms
5 ny4-milan.dante.net (212.1.200.25) 113 ms 113 ms 114 ms
6 500.POS2-0.GW6.NYC9.ALTER.NET (157.130.254.245) 114 ms 113 ms 114 ms
7 0.so-4-2-0.XL1.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.24.66) 114 ms 115 ms 114 ms
8 POS6-0.BR2.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.22.225) 114 ms 113 ms 115 ms
9 a3-0-2-0.r01.nwrknj01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.9.165) 115 ms 115 ms 114 ms
10 p4-2-1-0.r01.nycmny06.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.4.210) 115 ms 120 ms 118 ms
11 p4-1-3-0.r00.nycmny06.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.129) 115 ms 115 ms 115 ms
12 p4-0-1.r01.phlapa01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.125) 118 ms 118 ms 117 ms
13 p4-1-0-0.r00.phlapa01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.153) 118 ms 117 ms 120 ms
14 p4-6-0-0.r00.stngva01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.105) 121 ms 122 ms 121 ms
15 p16-3-0-0.r01.crtntx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.5.34) 157 ms 156 ms 156 ms
16 p16-2-0-0.r01.dllstx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.5.36) 156 ms 157 ms 157 ms
17 p4-0-0-0.r00.hstntx01.us.bb.verio.net (129.250.3.194) 162 ms 162 ms 161 ms
18 ge-1-1-0.a03.hstntx01.us.ra.verio.net (129.250.30.216) 163 ms 162 ms 161 ms
19 p1-1-0-0.a03.hstntx01.us.ce.verio.net (128.241.9.246) 162 ms 161 ms 161 ms
20 twhou-7200-1.ev1.net (207.218.245.1) 162 ms 162 ms 162 ms
21 tayhou-223-33.ev1.net (207.218.223.33) 205 ms 226 ms 183 ms
22 216.40.243.2 (216.40.243.2) 182 ms 185 ms 225 ms


and..

traceroute to 151.30.81.240 (151.30.81.240) from 216.40.243.2, 30 hops max, 38 byte packets

1 216.40.243.1 (216.40.243.1) 0.631 ms 0.662 ms 0.463 ms
2 tayhou-223-1.ev1.net (207.218.223.1) 0.665 ms 0.614 ms 0.575 ms
3 everyoneint-1.s2333b.ushstn2-j20c.savvis.net (64.243.79.13) 2.105 ms 1.909 ms 1.931 ms
4 at-0-2-0813.usdlls2-j20c.savvis.net (64.242.22.165) 68.043 ms at-1-2-0816.usdlls2-j20c.savvis.net (64.242.22.181) 21.583 ms 28.034 ms
5 frontier.usdlls.savvis.net (208.48.18.1) 18.152 ms 63.822 ms *
6 pos3-0-622M.cr2.DAL1.gblx.net (206.132.254.209) 64.649 ms 62.956 ms 13.605 ms
7 so1-0-0-622M.cr2.fra2.gblx.net (62.16.32.54) 136.823 ms 166.765 ms 139.161 ms
8 so0-0-0-622M.ar2.FRA2.gblx.net (62.16.32.78) 187.252 ms 139.185 ms 140.521 ms
9 ArcorAGCo.so-0-2-2.ar2.FRA2.gblx.net (62.16.33.90) 246.032 ms 174.450 ms 175.596 ms
10 kln-145-253-4-60.arcor-ip.net (145.253.4.60) 365.587 ms 194.994 ms 208.335 ms
11 ffm-145-253-0-129.arcor-ip.net (145.253.0.129) 165.643 ms * 195.334 ms
12 kar-145-253-0-241.arcor-ip.net (145.253.0.241) 195.588 ms 204.531 ms *
13 kar-145-253-0-242.arcor-ip.net (145.253.0.242) 196.428 ms 181.084 ms 151.658 ms
14 145.253.8.226 (145.253.8.226) 151.881 ms 161.442 ms 210.148 ms
15 192.94.212.201 (192.94.212.201) 199.376 ms 205.453 ms 253.313 ms
16 192.106.1.152 (192.106.1.152) 212.378 ms 150.936 ms 176.456 ms
17 151.5.16.50 (151.5.16.50) 167.914 ms 221.739 ms 219.470 ms
18 151.5.16.11 (151.5.16.11) 209.250 ms 195.922 ms 197.501 ms
19 * * *
20 * * *
21 * * *
22 * * *
23 * * *


Any comment??

Hi again,
The times are not too bad. Traceroutes can be affected by a lot
of factors. You may want to run a few more and make sure the
times stay the same or get lower. You might also want to run
some traceroute to other dedicated server providers like Dialtone Internet (www.dialtone.com), verio(www.verio.com), etc and compare
them to RS.

Just some more ideas

Chris.

I'll try some more Mondeay at work and I'll compare with rackshack.

Someone else that wants to comment?

Marco

Income Tax?!?

I would highly doubt you need to pay income tax on Texas.

I would think you have to pay income tax in the state you are doing business in and the state you live in. I don't do any business in Texas, the servers I have there are just a business expense for me.

No. I mean sales tax on the income you make off the server. Just RS charges you, but you charging you customers. But like I said I am not sure on the issue and I am not an expert. I just repeating what a guy in texas told me. RS should know for sure.

The 8.25% tax is only on the setup fee and part of the $99 fee paid to RS. It's quite clearly stated in their Terms of Service during the sign-up process:All accounts and services provided by RackShack are subject to the current tax rate as imposed by the City of Houston, State of Texas which is currently 8.25%. 80% of the monthly service charge is subject to the 8.25% tax rate, while the remaining 20% of the monthly service charge is not taxed. 100% of the setup fee is subject to the 8.25% tax rate. The above applies to all accounts and services provided by RackShack.You DON'T have to pay anything to Rackshack for the sales you generate on the server.

I think you should check with texas and RS just to be sure.

Chris

Originally posted by Marco JKD
I'll try some more Mondeay at work and I'll compare with rackshack.

Someone else that wants to comment?

Marco

Marco,

Be careful about making a judgement on RS's routing and pings at the moment.

They are in the process of moving from a colo to their new data center and have had to play with routing quite a bit to keep both locations up simultainiously..

It is a bit "confused" now as far as routing goes and the CEO of the company has explained it.

Give them a week, Robert Marsh strikes me as a man who would not be satisfied with anything less than top performance for his customers.

He's got an open forum where we (his customers) would rip him to shreds if he let it be anything but the best he can offer.

Very responsive company, great pricing, very happy customers (for the most part)

I've been there almost two months and have nothing but good to say about the entire operation. Including the performance throughout the move to the new home...

Shortness

I'm happy for the news of the income taxes.

It seems that Rackshack is the best solution for now. Are there other hosting company that offer servers at 99$ (let's say 80-120)??

Is there a web panel to install on the server that allows me to autoregister domains with a cheap registrar? (around 10-12$)

Marco

I would email RS about the sales tax on your sales, but other than that good luck.

<<Removed: Already posted once, which is enough>>

Be aware of the Plesk license that RackShack is currently offering and the fact that the Plesk install is a dirty tarball that includes Apache, Qmail, and a lot of other software. If you intend on using the RedHat Network to keep your machine up to date, then you're going to be out of luck. As well, Plesk counts all subdomains as domains so you can suck Plesk dry at RS real quick. The Plesk install puts Apache and a lot of other software in places on your drive that are very odd and may contribute to excessive problems should you care about upgrading for security purposes. The install is also unsecure and steps will have to be taken immediately on your part to close ports and set up a firewall, not to mention upgrading SSH, Apache, etc.

I've been trying to get RH 7.2 on my server there for a week and I may or I may not, but it's not looking too good right now. Be aware, as it seems very odd that RS won't just install a clean 7.2, which I find to be both exasperating and extremely disturbing. I gutted my Plesk and RedHat 7.1 install and got so frustrated with the goings that I managed to kill the server, mostly out of contempt for the ghastly plesk install.

Supposedly Ensim will become an option soon, but if that is on 7.1 or an RPM is used to install is still unknown. Be cautious. The Plesk that RS has offered now is both very limiting and a really crude and ugly thing to behold, if you know anything about Linux. The fact that 7.2 without a control panel is not an option speaks volumes about the inflexibility and shortsightedness of RS management and quite frankly my satisfaction with them is waning quickly.

Couple the above facts with the fact that RS will not, under any circumstances, refund a setup fee, then you have enough information to cause you to perhaps NOT sign up on Monday. I'm already unsatisfied and I'd like to do what I can to make sure other people don't end up where I am.

I just got word that Ensim at RS will be RPM based, so your RPM database in RedHat won't be valueless as it would be with the Plesk tarball install.

I still don't know if the Ensim install will also install the kitchen sink, as the Plesk install does. Whoever at Plesk that came up with this idea ought to have the air let out of his shirt. Real stupid.

For those that don't know, the RPM database is an extremely important thing when it comes to sysadmin. Tossing tarballs around loose and fast is a great way to screw things up and anytime you can go RPM over tar you're better off, as it's easy to find out what application ANY file belongs to with RPM, but with tar you're screwed over. Upgrades are as easy as falling down and you don't have to think about dependencies.

Originally posted by Z28SS
Be aware, as it seems very odd that RS won't just install a clean 7.2, which I find to be both exasperating and extremely disturbing.It's as simple as the fact that Plesk doesn't officially support RH 7.2...

It's as simple as the fact that Plesk doesn't officially support RH 7.2...

So? That means RackShack can't install 7.2? Maybe you missed the part where I said I didn't want Plesk. I don't want any web administration control panel at all.

Will 7.2 do that? I think so...

I don't think it requires genius to install 7.2 off of 2 cds. RS could set it up to install NFS. That would really suck up the hours, huh?

Originally posted by Z28SS
Maybe you missed the part where I said I didn't want Plesk. Umm, yeah I did. Sorry. :)

Originally posted by Z28SS
Couple the above facts with the fact that RS will not, under any circumstances, refund a setup fee, then you have enough information to cause you to perhaps NOT sign up on Monday. I'm already unsatisfied and I'd like to do what I can to make sure other people don't end up where I am.

I follow this one and RS's forum... I'm not sure why you are ticked at them?

Didn't you know what you were getting when you ordered the Plesk based server there?

In RS's defense, to offer custom setups such as you're asking for would greatly increase their setup costs, and eventually, their setup fees..

From what I've seen of RS they seem a most progressive company, trying to offer the best packages they can while still keeping a profit margin.

I really don't see from what I've read of your messages there, why you'd come here and steer business away from them.

Certainly, you are entitled to your opinion and I'm not in any way chastising you for speaking it.. I'm just sort of confused as to the reasoning... why you buy a cloth covered sofa, take it home and try to cover it in leather and then get mad at the store you bought it from for not making it leather in the first place?

Shortness..

I don't know how this rumor got started, but Texas doesn't even have a state income tax, much less some tax they would try to charge you for doing business on a server in Texas.

You may still have to pay the 8.25% sales tax, but I'm not even sure if you'll have to pay that if you're located outside Texas.

Hope this clears things up.

Yea im still confused on how rackshack gets away with charging sales tax, you cant charge sales tax for a company thats outside of the state your doing business in... but what ever... And even if you were in a state with a wierd law where you have to pay sales tax, most people are reselling the rackshack service, which as a reseller, waives sales taxes as well.... sounds like rack shacks trying to pick up a extra buck... but then again im not an accountant.

The whole rackshack sales tax issue has been discussed before, was a whole thread on it...

I don't care about 8% on the 99$.. but I care about the software on my server. Right now I'm using Cpanel and I never used Plesk. Maybe I should write on the other forum but I would like to know what do you think about the cofiguratione of the software on RS's servers.

Thanks,

Marco

Didn't you know what you were getting when you ordered the Plesk based server there?

No, I was not aware that the Plesk install was grotesque. I'm actually really VERY bothered by it and I was taking it upon myself to chop it out, but the tarball leaves bits and pieces strewn all over the place and is quite aggravating to keep stumbling across files that don't belong.

RS is clear on my stance, as I'm in private conversation with them on a regular basis. I also initially made it real clear on the RS forum that the Plesk install was crap. It may RUN ok, but you can get a car to run with the engine in the front passenger seat as well, I suppose.

I also suppose that my irritability level has risen to the degree over this since I jumped from a Cobalt to the Linux box to avoid just exactly what I ended up getting, so I'm out a grand and I still have an obfuscated OS install. Losing $250 on the first install and going over to Linux was my plan of avoiding the bastardized Linux on a Cobalt and now I have a bastardized RedHat on a Linux box. You've not read of my situation on the RS forums? Maybe I ought to make more noise over there.

In RackShack's defense, I will say that after I posted my first post in this thread I received email from Patrick, who is going to help me out. At this juncture I'm very pleased to have someone at RS that understands my point of view on the subject and is going to do something about it.

I should also add that I *like* RackShack. They have a great deal and great service. My situation is different in that I don't just buy servers to put accounts on to make bucks. I want a clean server for my own uses, which has nothing to do with making money. If the Plesk install had been one that could have been extracted cleanly, then no sweat. As it stands now, it's a mess and getting it cleaned out is like pulling teeth from a running mule.

Hopefully this will get resolved today. I'd like to get on with what I got the server for.

it seems that plesk is used by a lot of company. Am I wrong? I understand that Z28SS's purpose was to have a clean server but my purpose is to put websites on it so Ples should do well.. right?

But what about the security and the resto of the software installed on the server?

Thanks for your help and sorry for my english.. :)

Marco

Marco, you should look through Plesk's site at http://www.plesk.com/ and their forums at http://forum.plesk.com/ for more information. Although Plesk is good for some users that want to offer shared hosting, other people prefer different solutions (like CPanel, Ensim, nothing at all, etc.). It all depends on your needs and your likes.

I understand that Z28SS's purpose was to have a clean server but my purpose is to put websites on it so Ples should do well.. right?

But what about the security and the resto of the software installed on the server?

The point was that Plesk is a messy install which includes lots of little pieces here and there so it is much more difficult to keep the server up to date as far as security patches, etc or to remove/replace insecure pieces without breaking something.

How would you go about putting cpanel whm on Rack shack, I don't want to mess with pleask and would prefer to use cpanel. Will Rack Shack put cpanel on the server or do you need to do it your self. If not is ensim going to do anything about this subdomain problem I think that making each subdomain an account is BS, or am I wrong.

About taxes,
Correct you will not have to pay RS for income made from the server. However you will have to pay the state of Texas if you want to be legal.
Sam

Originally posted by Z28SS


No, I was not aware that the Plesk install was grotesque. I'm actually really VERY bothered by it and I was taking it upon myself to chop it out, but the tarball leaves bits and pieces strewn all over the place and is quite aggravating to keep stumbling across files that don't belong.



Z28,

I did follow your messages at RS and was aware of what you were trying to do and, I think, why..

My point in the message was that you were trying to do something "outside the box" and then when that did not work, came over here and "bashed" RS for that.

I just didn't/don't see where they did anything wrong other than offering a product that you didn't like...

Understood that you want a plain install. But again I get back to the cloth/leather analogy.. A plain linux installed box is not what you bought...

Aarrguh... having trouble making my point, late night, unclear head...

I guess I just don't see any reason for you to try to discourage anyone from buying from them under the circumstances.. which you did and that I see as wrong..

Shortness

Originally posted by islandesign


The point was that Plesk is a messy install which includes lots of little pieces here and there so it is much more difficult to keep the server up to date as far as security patches, etc or to remove/replace insecure pieces without breaking something.

Do you mean that RS servers are insecure??

Marco

Originally posted by Marco JKD


Do you mean that RS servers are insecure??

Marco

they are only as insecure as you make them. Plesk just makes that harder because they have changed the locations of the files...