Hello everyone,

I just got back from the bank and on my way home during my short 15 minute drive, I was almost hit twice. In both occurances, the occupants of the cars were teenage students (likely getting out of school).

Now I know not all teenage drivers are bad, etc and there are as many middle age drivers who are bad or worse... but do you guys think 16 is too young for someone to begin driving?

If you would have asked me this 6 years ago when I got my license, I would have said no, but seeing how some of these youngens drive these days, it makes you think...

So what does everyone think?

I have a 15 year old Cousin in USA that drives or something, that's ridiculous.

It's 17 here in England, and while I want to drive as soon as possible, I think that even 18 would be more reasonable, so I agree with you.

Yeah, I was thinking more along the lines of 18 also.

I just find that most of the laws here in Ontario are a little out of whack... consider this.

You get your license at 16. You're now considered responsible enough to drive yourself, your friends 24/7 with no restrictions.

You turn 18 and decide that you want to get married. You're now responsible enough to drive, marry and start a family.

BUT, you cannot legally drink or buy cigarettes until you're 19!

I just find things a little messed up :)

yes, now that i'm well above the legal driving age, I think the age should increase to 18 .. in NJ it's 17 right now ..

Heck I say make the driving age 14, decrease it. But surely the current process in general for teenagers in US has loopholes and should be more strict.

Here, to get a permit you just have to be 15, take 30 hours of DAMN BORING book work and then 6 hours of behind the wheels training. That gives you permit to drive with a parent next to you. While in 99% of the case that much training suffices, IMO the risk posed by that 1% is simply too huge.

I'm for stricter and more effective method that will issue drivers license to those qualified rather than via age(judging driving by age is simply too vague).

look at the problem from the 4 corners of society
-kids are currently crammed to learn billions of crap in school due to corperate america companies pressure for quotas etc.
-hopefully teens arent driving the big suvs and hummers cause those are the people that really scare me on the road but i still think they shoudnt have the smallest crap car and break down
-oil prices anyone?
-what age is good then? got me clueless cause most people drive the same, just newbies are a little sassy for a week until they figure out they gotta couch up mulla to fill the gas tank

No. The problem isn't young drivers, the problem is inexperienced drivers. causation v. correlation

Personally, I feel the Graduated Driver License Law (http://www.dor.state.mo.us/mvdl/drivers/gradlaw.htm) here in Missouri, USA is a good first step. But improvements could certainly be made.,,

This is an old problem that goes back to when most people in the US made their living on farms. They would need someone to run to the general store and pick up more feed, run a tractor down the road, etc. In fact in some states the age is lower if you work on a farm, you can get a farm license at 14-15. I think the real problem comes when well-to-do parents buy their kid a car right after they get their license, then six months later they wrap it around a telephone pole.

A car is a lot of responsibility, you aren't just taking your own life in your hands but the life of everyone around you.

I don't have a solution to this problem, but I do agree with the inexperience argument. So how would people gain driving experience without endangering other drivers?

I say we keep the age limit the same. While we are at it lower the drinking age to 18.

If you checked out that link I provided above, I think that is a great start! But what I do not believe it covers is kids in the car with kid drivers...

My personal observations tell me that the kid drivers lose all sense (assuming they have 'em to start with) when driving unsupervised with a carload of other kids. They get distracted, and bang! Into a telephone pole, or worse, head-on into another car...

So, I feel kid drivers (Intermidiate by Missouri's terminology) should never be permitted to drive with passengers other than adults. And preferrably only parents, and grand-parents; Not siblings... And never friends!

In just the last several months here locally, there have been multiple accidents where kid drivers and deaths were involved where there was a boat load of people in the cars... Very sad!

Originally posted by rrdega
If you checked out that link I provided above, I think that is a great start! But what I do not believe it covers is kids in the car with kid drivers...

My personal observations tell me that the kid drivers lose all sense (assuming they have 'em to start with) when driving unsupervised with a carload of other kids. They get distracted, and bang! Into a telephone pole, or worse, head-on into another car...

So, I feel kid drivers (Intermidiate by Missouri's terminology) should never be permitted to drive with passengers other than adults. And preferrably only parents, and grand-parents; Not siblings... And never friends!

In just the last several months here locally, there have been multiple accidents where kid drivers and deaths were involved where there was a boat load of people in the cars... Very sad!

I'm really tired of this protectionist attitude people. WE CANNOT CURE STUPIDITY. A lot of kids don't gie in crashes because they are bad drivers, but because they are stupid drivers. If they didn't go down the road at 90 mph then they wouldn't die!!!

stupid driver = bad driver in my books.

Originally posted by dk2
I'm really tired of this protectionist attitude people. WE CANNOT CURE STUPIDITY. A lot of kids don't gie in crashes because they are bad drivers, but because they are stupid drivers. If they didn't go down the road at 90 mph then they wouldn't die!!! So, what would you suggest, a "STUPIDITY" test and those that fail (or would it be pass?) never get a license? Or just not permit them to drive at all until a certain age, and then just give 'em a license to kill?

It is not stupidity that's killing them... It is inexperience, and ignorance... That latter, unlike stupidity, can be fixed.

keep it as it is,
wow u may get a young wreckless driver,
But maybe your 30/ 40? ALof off people your age are the same, Drink driving, Speeding, Etc ETc, I sell insurance, and alot more adults have had Points / claims than the younger ones,
the older ones are just too stubborn to admit its there fault

I definately stated in my first post that I understand middle age people are the exact same... I guess I was just wondering how others thought about the driving age. I didn't mean to point the finger at todays youth as the cuase of all accidents...

I know
im just saying That you cant say that the driving Age is too low, 17 is a good age in my country,
Hell the insurance is way to expensive so alot off kids at 17/18 dont even bother driving till there 20-odd
Makes them start at an earlier age to get more experienced .
remember our reaction times are quicker
WE maybe young, yes we do prat around, our attention span may be not as good, We may think we all cool and good speeding around in a crappy old ford fiesta or something
But You cant teach an old dog a new trick eh ;)

;) All good points. I guess I just have a different view on it :)

its because im almost 17 and wanna drive ASAP :)

Teen Driving Fatality Statistics... (http://www.drivehomesafe.com/teen_driving_fatality_information_start_page.htm)

14% of all deaths due to motor vehicle accidents are teen drivers.

Most teen driver deaths due to motor vehicle accidents occur on weekends 53% of the time.

Teen drivers killed in motor vehicle accidents had a youth passenger in automobile 45% of the time. More facts below.

Of teen drivers fatally injured in automobiles, more than 1/3 were speed related accidents.

Teen lifestyle of staying up late make teen drivers a high risk to have an automobile accident due to drowsiness.

More than any age group, teens are likely to be involved in a single vehicle crash.

On the basis of current population trends, there will be 23% more 16-20- year-old drivers on the road in 2010 than there are today -- 26.1 million.

This age group makes up 7% of licensed drivers, but suffers 14% of fatalities and 20% of all reported accidents.

The 16-year-old population alone will increase from 3.5 million to over 4 million by 2010.

Teens are worse drivers... however I almost get hit multiple times a week at no fault of my own by people doing idiotic stuff... and they usually are middle aged people not paying attention... not understanding the fact they are flying a 3000lb vehicle down the road...

I think the best thing is to make everything legal at 18. Drinking, driving, and of course, being an adult, etc...

Driving at 16, adult at 18, drinking at 21 etc. etc. is just not right; and very confusing indeed.

rrdega, I bet those statistics were taken from the USA!
Over here in the UK you very rarely hear of teenage driving deaths. The laws here are that you can get your full license at 17, and it's the same across the whole of the UK. There's no provisional at 16; there's a provisional at 17, but not 16.

Yes the laws are pretty screwed up really regarding marriage, drinking, driving and smoking, but the laws in the UK aren't too bad, and I'm certainly not bothered if they kept it like this. Obviously lots of people would like to make some changes, but we can't all get what we want, can we?

Gerogia's teenage driving laws are pretty strict, if I recall you have to have your permit for at almost two years now...and when you get your license you can't drive withone but immediate family for 6 months, you can't drive between 12am and 6am...If you miss 10 days of school in a row, or drop out you can't get your license until you're 18, if you're suspended for a number of things you lose your license.

They are getting quite strict here :)

Senior Citizens are the worst drivers. Just a few days ago I was in a car where the speed limit was about 45 and the old lady was going 15mph.. PITIFUL! Happened more than twice that week.

I think the limit should be changed. The legal driving age should always be the age I was the previous year :D

That would mean that I am old enough to drive, but anyone currently 33 or less wouldnt be able to :stickout:

I'm all for driving at 16.

Think of it this way:
There are vast amounts of minimum wage jobs out there that are/need to be filled, most adults won't be able to survive off a minimum wage job and thus we'll either have to raise minimum wage, or teenagers will need some motive of transportation (besides their parents).

Although, I'm totally for stricter driving tests and a retest every 3-5 years for everyone.

By the way, not sure if anyone knows this but Indian Reservations don't require drivers licenses or insurance. Know this from personal experience as I grew up on a reservation.

There's barely any public transportation where I live, aside to and from school. Find a better way to transport people..

Most parents won't drive kids more than 20 minutes, either.

Originally posted by dk2
I'm really tired of this protectionist attitude people. WE CANNOT CURE STUPIDITY. A lot of kids don't gie in crashes because they are bad drivers, but because they are stupid drivers. If they didn't go down the road at 90 mph then they wouldn't die!!!

It's all the same isn't it? Kids are "stupid" ergo they are bad drivers.

It is not that we humans say "well at 18 you are mature and at 16 you are not". It's nature that says that at 16 you are not yet mature. At age 16 you are still undergoing physcial and mental changes that affect your behaviour. 16 Year olds are still mentally and emotionally unstable. They behave like... well... KIDS.

Did you know kids can't die? Ask any 16 year old who just received his license and is pulling some dangerous stunts with you in the car. They'll give you a stupid grin. Bad things cannot happen to them! (or so they think).

The driving age here is 18. I'ld be happier with 21 (the way it was up until about 10 yrs ago). But there is great public transportation available.

I fully understand the situation in the US though with it's vast distances. Not being able to drive greatly limits you in your personal freedom. Not being able to drive until 21 is not an acceptable solution for this country.

This is not a protectionist attitude such as the tanning salon ban. You don't put 9 year olds behind the wheel of a car either do you? So if you don't want to do it with 16 year olds why call it protectionism?

Mekhu, to address why the drinking age in Canada is 19 and the driving age is 16 is due to the fact that studies have been made that drivers of that age are less likely to be involved in DUI and they will not risk their own and others while being impaired. I'm trying to look for some statistics to back up what I just said but I remember reading it in a book or something not too long ago.

Personally, I think the graduated license program is a great start. British Columbia has a rather extensive one: http://www.icbc.com/Licensing/lic_getlic_undglp.html

There are just as many adults that can't drive too. ;)

Originally posted by daveman
There are just as many adults that can't drive too. ;)

And senior citizens, let me tell you... Snowbirds all the like.

Here in Pennsylvania, a potential driver must first take a computerized test to get their permit (they can take this test the day they turn 16). If they pass, they get their permit.

To get their driver's license they must drive 50 hours with a parent/guardian in the car and pass a final driver's test. They cannot take the driver's test until 6 months after they turn 16 regardless.

Frankly I think this is a much better system other states have, and we have few crashes here.

I think it should be judged on maturity or equivalent, not age.
I know people getting their L's (explain below) and I know as soon as they get their N's they're gonna drive drunk and high.

Here in BC we have the graduated license program.
At 16, you take a computerized test, and you get your Class 6L license (L)
You must display a magnetic orange L on your vehicle at all times, and must have a person 21 or older with a full class 5 license. You cannot drive between midnight and 5am, and you must have a blood alchohol level of zero.

After 12 months of having a 6L (or 9 months and completing ICBC driving school) you take a driving test to get your class 6 license. (N)
You must display the magnetic green N on your car at all times, can't drive between midnight and 5am, and still no blood alchohol.
With the class 6 (N) you are allowed having one other passenger in the car with you.

After 2 years having the N and an exemplary driving record, you can get your full class 5 license. Any accidents or incidents increase the time you must keep your N.

Stats show it decreases deaths, but around here they still drive 100km/h down roads, skid around corners, and weave between traffic. They wreck it for the rest of us.

While walking down the street at lunch and seeing some indo-canadian (no racism intended, but they do it here) speed by on the main road racing each other at 100km/h, I sometimes hope they just would lose control and crash into something, because it would show a lesson that driving stupidly results in death.

Originally posted by interactive
And senior citizens, let me tell you... Snowbirds all the like.

That is true.

I think the driving age is just fine. It is the level of maturity that counts here. :(:angry:

Originally posted by rrdega
Personally, I feel the Graduated Driver License Law (http://www.dor.state.mo.us/mvdl/drivers/gradlaw.htm) here in Missouri, USA is a good first step. But improvements could certainly be made.,,

We got that in Quebec except we can drive anytime.

they can change the age to 18 after i get my license.

My reason for thinking they should keep minimum driving age low:
-People use cars to get to work, and say that the minimum age is now 18 you must pay taxes; that work earns the money that some people use to pay taxes. Now, if you cant go to work, how do you pay taxes and all that?
Where I live (Chino Hills, SBx, Inland Empire, SoCal), the public transportation is almost non existant and what we do have is really sucky and expensive.

Raising the age would cause too many problems

I think it should be based on competence, not age. This goes for both ends of the spectrum...young and old.

I concur.

Originally posted by Matt
I think it should be based on competence, not age. This goes for both ends of the spectrum...young and old.

I agree

Originally posted by ambirex
then six months later they wrap it around a telephone pole.


My parents bought my a car 3 days after I got my license and I am yet to do just that ;)

Not all of us are bad drivers.

I agree with NickRac,

It is the bad teen drivers that make all Teens look like bad drivers.

I dont think its just young kids.

I live in California where the traffic is a mess. I have Never had a an almost accident with a teen driver. 70% of the time that I almost get hit or almost run into somebody its an asian women. The rest of the time its adults not paying attention. In California asian women should not beable to get a license..... Ever.

dont think its just young kids.

I live in California where the traffic is a mess. I have Never had a an almost accident with a teen driver. 70% of the time that I almost get hit or almost run into somebody its an asian women. The rest of the time its adults not paying attention. In California asian women should not beable to get a license..... Ever.


:rofl:

Here in NY, The age is still 16...But as of Sept 1st, 2003, you get something calling a Junior Limited License. You are only allowed to drive to school, work and to daycare or something like that. You have this for 6 months before you get your real lic.

My cousin's birthday was Sept 5th. He turned 16 and got his license. This law was new and they sent everything that got their lic in sept, and october a real liense and around november, they were sent another lic saying they were a junior, then like 2 months later, the real one again. They ended up with 4 ID's lol. Permit and 3 lic.

Originally posted by Carp
Here in NY, The age is still 16...But as of Sept 1st, 2003, you get something calling a Junior Limited License. You are only allowed to drive to school, work and to daycare

I hope that if you are 16, you are going to the daycare to work and not drop off someone.....