Just to let you all know I live in St. Louis, MO. Server4You is hosted in Inflow in St. Louis, MO which has a very nice DC. I was there when Brad from XioLink (formerly RackMy) gave me a tour.

Check out these traceroutes:

Traceroutes are done from a charter cable connection in St. Louis.

Traceroute to server4you:

Target Name: www.server4you.net
IP: 69.64.44.43
Date/Time: 4/23/2004 7:38:04 PM

1 8 ms [10.16.128.1]
2 8 ms fl1-033.charter-stl.com [24.217.4.33]
3 7 ms [24.217.63.193]
4 7 ms [12.124.129.97]
5 8 ms gbr5-p40.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.25.26]
6 32 ms gar2-p360.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.24.233]
7 8 ms [12.125.74.10]
8 8 ms [12.25.232.43]
9 38 ms [66.179.94.166]
10 37 ms [69.64.44.43]

Traceroute to CyberCon (St. Louis, MO)

Target Name: www.cybercon.com
IP: 216.15.129.5
Date/Time: 4/23/2004 7:39:16 PM

1 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms [10.16.128.1]
2 7 ms 7 ms 8 ms fl1-033.charter-stl.com [24.217.4.33]
3 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms [24.217.63.193]
4 8 ms 8 ms 8 ms [12.124.129.97]
5 7 ms 8 ms 8 ms gbr5-p40.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.25.26]
6 7 ms 9 ms 9 ms tbr2-p013501.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.122.11.121]
7 11 ms 7 ms 8 ms gbr2-p20.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.122.11.118]
8 8 ms 8 ms 8 ms gar1-p370.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.24.213]
9 7 ms 8 ms 9 ms cybercon.com [12.118.144.70]
10 7 ms 9 ms 9 ms www.cybercon.com [216.15.129.5]

Traceroute to Accessus (St. Louis, MO):

Target Name: www.accessus.net
IP: 209.145.128.7
Date/Time: 4/23/2004 7:40:22 PM

1 8 ms [10.16.128.1]
2 8 ms fl1-033.charter-stl.com [24.217.4.33]
3 8 ms [24.217.63.193]
4 7 ms [12.124.129.97]
5 8 ms gbr5-p40.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.25.26]
6 9 ms tbr2-p013501.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.122.11.121]
7 15 ms tbr2-cl7.cgcil.ip.att.net [12.122.10.45]
8 14 ms ggr2-p390.cgcil.ip.att.net [12.123.6.37]
9 16 ms so-1-1-0.BR6.CHI2.ALTER.NET [204.255.174.9]
10 16 ms 0.so-5-3-0.XL2.CHI2.ALTER.NET [152.63.64.58]
11 16 ms 0.so-0-0-0.TL2.CHI2.ALTER.NET [152.63.68.89]
12 22 ms 0.so-7-0-0.TL2.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.146.62]
13 22 ms 0.so-3-0-0.XL2.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.88.246]
14 22 ms 184.ATM6-0.GW4.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.67.157]
15 23 ms savvis-gw.customer.alter.net [65.195.247.10]
16 25 ms accessus-1.usstls3.savvis.net [64.240.159.118]
17 24 ms orion.accessus.net [209.145.128.7]

Traceroute to Savvis (St. Louis, MO)

Target Name: www.savvis.net
IP: 216.91.182.63
Date/Time: 4/23/2004 7:41:18 PM

1 7 ms [10.16.128.1]
2 7 ms fl1-033.charter-stl.com [24.217.4.33]
3 6 ms [24.217.63.193]
4 9 ms [12.124.129.97]
5 7 ms gbr6-p40.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.123.25.30]
6 8 ms tbr2-p013601.sl9mo.ip.att.net [12.122.11.125]
7 16 ms tbr2-cl7.cgcil.ip.att.net [12.122.10.45]
8 16 ms ggr2-p390.cgcil.ip.att.net [12.123.6.37]
9 15 ms so-1-1-0.BR6.CHI2.ALTER.NET [204.255.174.9]
10 15 ms 0.so-5-3-0.XL2.CHI2.ALTER.NET [152.63.64.58]
11 17 ms 0.so-0-0-0.TL2.CHI2.ALTER.NET [152.63.68.89]
12 21 ms 0.so-7-0-0.TL2.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.146.62]
13 21 ms 0.so-3-0-0.XL2.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.88.246]
14 21 ms 184.ATM6-0.GW4.STL3.ALTER.NET [152.63.67.157]
15 24 ms savvis-gw.customer.alter.net [65.195.247.10]
16 23 ms [64.241.47.5]
35 24 ms savvis.net [216.91.182.63]


Now some of this could be Charter's fault because it has crappy routing and likes to only use ATT bw around here so lets do traceroute from www.socket.net (Columbia, MO)

Traceroute to Cybercon:

1 rtr1.como.socket.net (216.106.2.1) 0.665 ms 0.714 ms 0.663 ms
2 rtr1.stmo.socket.net (216.106.23.66) 3.744 ms 3.501 ms 3.563 ms
3 gw1.stmo.socket.net (216.106.23.118) 4.471 ms 4.228 ms 3.590 ms
4 PVC.INT.ROUTER.GW.HUB.ALTER.NET (157.130.171.165) 3.926 ms 4.383 ms 3.967 ms
5 186.at-6-0-0.XL1.STL3.ALTER.NET (152.63.92.30) 4.355 ms 4.570 ms 4.929 ms
6 185.ATM6-0.GW2.STL3.ALTER.NET (152.63.90.113) 4.974 ms 4.232 ms 5.059 ms
7 cybercon-gw.customer.alter.net (157.130.163.138) 4.775 ms 5.017 ms 4.436 ms
8 gig12.sw1.cybercon.com (64.37.126.2) 4.845 ms 4.835 ms 4.736 ms
9 gig408.sw1.cybercon.com (216.15.195.54) 4.965 ms 4.440 ms 4.612 ms
10 www.cybercon.com (216.15.129.5) 4.758 ms 4.583 ms 4.436 ms


Traceroute to Accessus

1 rtr1.como.socket.net (216.106.2.1) 0.625 ms 0.562 ms 0.623 ms
2 rtr1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.70) 3.454 ms 3.293 ms 3.541 ms
3 gw1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.42) 5.674 ms 3.851 ms 3.447 ms
4 sl-gw31-chi-6-0-TS12.sprintlink.net (144.223.6.97) 15.201 ms 15.066 ms 14.978 ms
5 sl-savvis-16-0.sprintlink.net (144.228.154.178) 20.528 ms 20.537 ms 20.478 ms
6 at-0-2-901.usstls6-01.j20c.savvis.net (206.129.9.90) 13.140 ms 13.882 ms 12.875 ms
7 accessus-1.usstls3.savvis.net (64.240.159.118) 14.300 ms 14.121 ms 15.154 ms
8 orion.accessus.net (209.145.128.7) 14.489 ms 15.038 ms 14.723 ms

Traceroute to Savvis

1 rtr1.como.socket.net (216.106.2.1) 0.640 ms 0.484 ms 1.086 ms
2 rtr1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.70) 3.538 ms 3.487 ms 3.413 ms
3 gw1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.42) 3.656 ms 4.672 ms 3.497 ms
4 sl-gw31-chi-6-0-TS12.sprintlink.net (144.223.6.97) 15.130 ms 15.041 ms 16.171 ms
5 sl-savvis-16-0.sprintlink.net (144.228.154.178) 20.984 ms 20.726 ms 20.780 ms
6 64.241.47.5 (64.241.47.5) 13.159 ms 13.834 ms 13.804 ms

---------------

Brings a whole new meaning to you get what you pay for.

Where's your trace from Socket.net to Server4You? And have you bothered contacting them? Looks like a simple issue to fix if an issue exists, there's some odd latency between one of their providers & their routers. So that means they're bad? Wow, WHT has turned into a place where all people do is complain. Looks fine to me:

Show Level 3 (Cleveland, OH) Traceroute to 69.64.44.43

1 ge-7-0-0.mpls1.Cleveland1.Level3.net (209.244.22.97) 0 msec 0 msec 0 msec
2 so-3-0-0.mp1.StLouis1.Level3.net (64.159.0.49) 16 msec 16 msec 12 msec
3 ge-9-0.hsa1.StLouis1.Level3.net (64.159.0.62) 16 msec 16 msec 12 msec
4 server4you-gw.stl1.us.inetbone.net (63.208.32.162) 24 msec 24 msec 24 msec
5 69.64.44.43 [AS30083 {SERVER4YOU}] 24 msec 24 msec 24 msec


7 sp0-5-CHCGILCA.broadwing.com (206.223.119.72) 5.130 ms 5.100 ms 5.354 ms
8 ge-2-1-0.a1.chcg.broadwing.net (216.140.15.17) 5.324 ms 6.114 ms 5.685 ms
9 67.97.47.230 (67.97.47.230) 30.581 ms 29.839 ms 30.348 ms
10 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 29.544 ms 29.758 ms 29.745 ms

Remember, that Broadwing route is going from Chicago, IL to St. Louis, MO.

10 12.125.74.10 (12.125.74.10) 49 ms 50 ms 50 ms
11 12.25.232.11 (12.25.232.11) 50 ms 50 ms 50 ms
12 66.179.94.166 (66.179.94.166) 58 ms 65 ms 58 ms
13 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 58 ms 58 ms 58 ms

Looks fine to me.


- Matt

1 rtr1.como.socket.net (216.106.2.1) 0.586 ms 0.565 ms 0.513 ms
2 rtr1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.70) 3.437 ms 4.049 ms 3.989 ms
3 gw1.kcmo.socket.net (216.106.23.42) 3.686 ms 3.440 ms 3.945 ms
4 sl-gw31-chi-6-0-TS12.sprintlink.net (144.223.6.97) 15.853 ms 15.416 ms 15.192 ms
5 sl-bb21-chi-4-0.sprintlink.net (144.232.26.29) 15.570 ms 15.378 ms 15.444 ms
6 sl-bb20-chi-14-0.sprintlink.net (144.232.26.1) 16.987 ms 15.963 ms 16.162 ms
7 sl-st20-chi-12-0.sprintlink.net (144.232.8.219) 16.815 ms 16.259 ms 16.056 ms
8 sl-browing-20-0.sprintlink.net (144.223.241.22) 219.627 ms 154.378 ms 218.833 ms
9 ge-2-1-0.a1.chcg.broadwing.net (216.140.15.17) 16.466 ms 16.058 ms 16.849 ms
10 67.97.47.230 (67.97.47.230) 40.571 ms 40.600 ms 40.706 ms
11 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 40.430 ms 39.972 ms 40.418 ms

1 hwnode2.scservers.com (64.202.100.57) 0.137 ms 0.078 ms 0.042 ms
2 ge1-0-0-750.j1.ord.scnet.net (64.202.110.66) 0.398 ms 0.338 ms 0.307 ms
3 sp0-5-CHCGILCA.broadwing.com (206.223.119.72) 23.775 ms 23.793 ms 23.855 ms
4 ge-1-2-0.a1.chcg.broadwing.net (216.140.14.161) 23.814 ms 23.750 ms 23.722 ms
5 67.97.47.230 (67.97.47.230) 48.269 ms 48.255 ms 48.133 ms
6 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 48.039 ms 48.143 ms 48.173 ms

DK2 - I guarantee you that Broadwing is running MPLS to hide hops there. It's 300+ miles from Chicago, IL (hop ge-1-2-0.a1.chcg.broadwing.net or ge-2-1-0.a1.chcg.broadwing.net ) to 67.97.47.230 (Server4You's router). For 300+ miles, 25 ms is pretty good. Why do you think this is bad? It would help if you post full sentences, not just traceroutes (that you aren't reading correctly).

- Matt

Really access us goes from STL to CHI and back in 24 ms? So yes I would say 37ms is bad.

Broadwing dosen't peer with sprint, att or worldcom in the area? Ya I call that bad

Also if you notice this is the last 2 hops

Here is another example:

Server4You
1 pm28-fe00.his.net (216.194.225.65) 0.378 ms 0.262 ms 0.250 ms
2 att-kensington-ds3-1.his.net (216.194.224.6) 1.334 ms 1.293 ms 1.339 ms
3 12.124.234.33 (12.124.234.33) 1.449 ms 1.433 ms 12.124.234.85 (12.124.234.85) 1.494 ms
4 gbr6-p80.wswdc.ip.att.net (12.123.9.62) 1.595 ms 1.493 ms 1.498 ms
5 tbr1-p013801.wswdc.ip.att.net (12.122.11.173) 2.142 ms 2.361 ms 2.481 ms
6 tbr1-cl4.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.122.10.30) 18.403 ms 18.413 ms 18.661 ms
7 gbr5-p100.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.122.11.106) 17.898 ms 17.824 ms 17.824 ms
8 gar2-p360.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.123.24.233) 20.705 ms 25.295 ms 28.511 ms
9 12.125.74.10 (12.125.74.10) 18.384 ms 18.019 ms 18.593 ms
10 12.25.232.43 (12.25.232.43) 27.728 ms 26.174 ms 18.085 ms
11 66.179.94.166 (66.179.94.166) 47.218 ms 47.488 ms 47.347 ms
12 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 49.538 ms 48.559 ms 48.147 ms

CyberCon

1 pm28-fe00.his.net (216.194.225.65) 0.314 ms 0.249 ms 0.243 ms
2 att-kensington-ds3-1.his.net (216.194.224.6) 1.393 ms 1.280 ms 1.291 ms
3 12.124.234.33 (12.124.234.33) 1.451 ms 12.124.234.85 (12.124.234.85) 1.452 ms 12.124.234.33 (12.124.234.33) 1.419 ms
4 gbr5-p80.wswdc.ip.att.net (12.123.9.58) 1.452 ms 1.444 ms 1.524 ms
5 tbr1-p013301.wswdc.ip.att.net (12.122.11.169) 4.167 ms 2.300 ms 2.405 ms
6 tbr1-cl4.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.122.10.30) 18.666 ms 18.765 ms 18.521 ms
7 gbr1-p10.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.122.11.98) 17.863 ms 17.822 ms 17.917 ms
8 gar1-p360.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.123.24.209) 17.877 ms 19.573 ms 17.742 ms
9 cybercon.com (12.118.144.70) 18.432 ms 18.214 ms 18.267 ms
10 www.cybercon.com (216.15.129.5) 18.215 ms 18.035 ms 17.988 ms

It's nice Charter lets you do trace routes.... They block them in my area!

So mainarea how am I reading that wrong?

no response...?

Originally posted by dk2
So mainarea how am I reading that wrong?
You're complaining about the latency at the end, between the 3rd to last and 2nd to last hop, right (I couldn't tell, since you just posted traces)? That's going from Chicago to St. Louis, which is going to show latency. They're not in the same state even, they're 300 miles away. That latency is expected.

- Matt

What about my last 2 traces.....both go through St. Louis....so how am I reading these wrong?

Originally posted by dk2
What about my last 2 traces.....both go through St. Louis....so how am I reading these wrong?
8 gar2-p360.sl9mo.ip.att.net (12.123.24.233) 20.705 ms 25.295 ms 28.511 ms
9 12.125.74.10 (12.125.74.10) 18.384 ms 18.019 ms 18.593 ms
10 12.25.232.43 (12.25.232.43) 27.728 ms 26.174 ms 18.085 ms
11 66.179.94.166 (66.179.94.166) 47.218 ms 47.488 ms 47.347 ms
12 69.64.44.43 (69.64.44.43) 49.538 ms 48.559 ms 48.147 ms

Not sure why that latency is there, you're not reading anything wrong on that one. Have you contacted Server4You to see what they say about it? I can't imagine what could be causing that (I don't see packetloss or spikes in pings).

- Matt

You said I was reading traceroutes wrong so I just wanted to clarify that.

I personally think they are using crappy routing hardware and overloading it?

Originally posted by dk2
You said I was reading traceroutes wrong so I just wanted to clarify that.

I personally think they are using crappy routing hardware and overloading it?
I personally think that you should contact them about it, instead of making assumptions...:rolleyes:

- Matt

Crappy hardware, 40 ms ping ICMP ?

If you are running games, UDP pings should be lower, so quit beating them up about it, they are fine.

You think that kind of latency is fine?

Originally posted by dk2
You think that kind of latency is fine?
It does seem odd & not fine, but the only people who can answer the question about why that is happening is the company. We can only speculate, but that won't help at all. I assume that you have contacted them already - what have they said? Remember, WHT is not Server4You's support method.

- Matt

It's interesting to see these traceroutes. I have charter business cable at home, and I can't do traceroutes from there.

As another Charter-STL customer (actually 20 miles east in IL) lemme give it a whack.


Nope, I cannot trace anything. Might have something to do with that damn IP not resolving to a name issue Charter seems to be having lately.

24.171.121.xxx <--- none of those ips in that class resolve to anything...which I bet the issue is.

Oh well...I could test if from our Savvis connection @ work tomorrow (Columbia, IL)

You can't use the traceroute command which is weird, but you can do visualroute and pingplotter.

This is what server4you sent me:

Dear Ross,

As far as i can tell the latency largely depends on from where do you issue
traceroutes and which network is used. They also depend on time of day and many
other uncontrolled reasons. And as you said it often depends on routing. As
sales i do not know much about how our routing is done. The information i have
is that we are changing some of the routes and one of our dns\\\'es so maybe the
problem is with that. I can assure you that all the necessary steps will be
taken to lower the latencies and fix the bad routing (if there is such).

Feel free to contact us if you have any questions.