I posted earlier about the 15 year old's host dir telling users that they should look for "unlimited transfer", which didnt' seem like that big a deal, but check this sh** out:

http://www.bcentral.com/services/bws/pricing.asp


Microsoft is even touting this BS now.

*sigh*
It will never end. Although, I do wonder how far they let you go with bandwidth.

Man, that sucks. When will MS start to build cars?

Anyone try to read that TOS???

LOL

:D

Originally posted by AnIdiot
Anyone try to read that TOS???

LOL

:D

anyone try to load the TOS page?

Ugh...

:sickface:

Now a seemingly reputable company has taken on marketing tactics comparable to the infamous "*****"...

:eek2:

Whenever I find a company with unlimited transfer, I always try to find in their TOS where they list the limitations of the unlimited transfer. I couldn't find it in the bCentral TOS (http://www.bcentral.com/help/policy/terms.asp) (although I just skimmed it).

By the way, the TOS page loaded fine for me, but then again I have a broadband Internet connection. :)

I wish someone else would read their TOS.
I know it's very long and time consumming.
But, I could find nothing about "If you exede your bandwidth limits. . . . . " OR. . . .". . . .excessive server load. .. . . ."

Live chat with Bcentral associate:
---------------------------------------------
Galen: Hello and welcome to bCentral's live support. My name is Galen.

worriedaboutTOS: i've looked at : help/policy/terms.asp for quite awhile now and NO WHERE in the document do you outline a hosting agreement

Galen: Please wait for a moment while I provide you the relevant information.

worriedaboutTOS: see the problem is you offer "UNLIMITED BANDWIDTH" and since that is OBVIOUSLY NOT POSSIBLE, I'm curious to know what the actual limit is.
worriedaboutTOS: or "unlimited data transfer"

Galen: Please hold on for a moment while I provide you some information.

worriedaboutTOS: ok

Galen: I would like to inform you that the Business Web Service provides you 40 mb of space. Regarding Bandwith, I am sorry but I cannot provide you any information on the same. What I can do is, forward your issue to our technicians who will help you on this issue.

worriedaboutTOS: ok?

Galen: Can you please provide me your email address so that the technicians can contact you?

worriedaboutTOS: hmm, seems a bit much for a simple question
worriedaboutTOS: i already get enough junk email
worriedaboutTOS: is there another way??

Galen: I need an email address for my technicians to contact you.

worriedaboutTOS: hmm, I think what I'm going to do is find a place that can answer my question, as that may seem wiser anyway. Thank you for your time
-----------------------------------------------------

Looks like the people at microsoft can't find it on the TOS either!

WHEW!!

And I thought it ws just me :eek:

Originally posted by AnIdiot
Anyone try to read that TOS???


98.2 KBytes as plain text file. That is just the title to the end, right before the date.

Microsoft Car v1.0
Unlimited gas miliage
Unlimited windshield wiper usage
Unlimited RPM's on your tire
Up to 150 degree turning on the steering wheel
Up to 20 gallons of Microsoft(tm) Gas, with integrated Unleaded-ness
Unlimited windshield wiper fluid consuption
Unlimited skid plate usage
Up to 20 cu. ft. storage in rear storage unit
Unlimited storage on overhead rack storage unit

Now that's comedy!!:D

But; shouldn't this thread be in the "Lounge?":rolleyes:

This may be a bit off-topic, but this is too much:

NOTE: Wonderful Web Pages no longer uses JavaScript as it is no longer supported by the Microsoft Windows operating system.


heh....you may want to edit that just a bit.

I'm jumping the gun on that I guess...

It is the Windows XP thing, I'm dumping JavaScript as XP wants me to use dotNET and VBscript (which I thought might have been rolled into dotNET, but I really don't know that one)

They are droping java support, not javascript....

Because they can no longer distro it with windows according to the courts ruling for Sun in a lawsuit between them and MS...

hehehe, I spent a half hour talking to a support guy yesterday who didn't know what a backbone was and kept on telling my the space was limited to 40 mb when I asked about unlimited bandwidth. Infact, he even asked me where I was getting this!

Anyway, i eventually dragged out of him this: http://sitemanager.bcentral.com/Docs/Site_Help/smhelp_smfaq.asp#5

Basically, it says there is a 3 gig/month limit! There is no little * saying limited to 3 gigs or nothing, it's just there, hidden!

F*** MS

woohoo, Dogma, congratulations, ive seen "hidden" before but that stupid !!

---
4. Is there a traffic limitation on my site?
You are limited to 3 gigabytes of transfer per month on your bCentral site. This works out to approximately 60,000 page views per month (based on the average Web page size of 50 kb).
---

You shouln't expect much from Microsoft.
And plus that website is a minor portion of microsoft.I doubt they even monitor it.

hmmm

To: "Microsoft bCentral Support" <bwsupport_us@bcentral.com>
Sent: Tue Aug 7 16:20:11 PDT 2001
Subject: Question
I see you allow Unlimited data transfer on your web host accounts. I have a
site thats doing 50gigs a month. Will I be ok?




Hello Viper,
Thank you for writing to Microsoft bCentral about the data transfer on your site.
Site Manager provides unlimited data transfer on your site. There would be no problem if your site is having that amount of data transfer on your site as what you have mentioned since you should be getting unlimited data transfer.
We hope this email was able to address your concern.
Should you have any other concerns, please feel free to email us back.
Sincerely,
Reysy
Microsoft bCentral Customer Support

Originally posted by venomx
hmmm

To: "Microsoft bCentral Support" <bwsupport_us@bcentral.com>
Sent: Tue Aug 7 16:20:11 PDT 2001
Subject: Question
I see you allow Unlimited data transfer on your web host accounts. I have a
site thats doing 50gigs a month. Will I be ok?

Hello Viper,
Thank you for writing to Microsoft bCentral about the data transfer on your site.
Site Manager provides unlimited data transfer on your site. There would be no problem if your site is having that amount of data transfer on your site as what you have mentioned since you should be getting unlimited data transfer.
We hope this email was able to address your concern.
Should you have any other concerns, please feel free to email us back.
Sincerely,
Reysy
Microsoft bCentral Customer Support

:eek: Sure would be nice if someone around here would take them up on that :D

i like unlimited. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by aragon
i like unlimited. :rolleyes:

:eek: :D :eek:

Originally posted by The Prohacker
They are droping java support, not javascript....

Because they can no longer distro it with windows according to the courts ruling for Sun in a lawsuit between them and MS...

JavaScript is a Java thing, from what I have heard Java is getting the boot for dotNET and JavaScript is getting the boot inplace of VBScript. At least that is what my understanding of the situation is.

Originally posted by xtstrike
woohoo, Dogma, congratulations, ive seen "hidden" before but that stupid !!

---
4. Is there a traffic limitation on my site?
You are limited to 3 gigabytes of transfer per month on your bCentral site. This works out to approximately 60,000 page views per month (based on the average Web page size of 50 kb).
---

Microsoft could easily justify this:

"Well, I think you must understand, unlimited bandwidth means that you can have as much as you want given that you pay TME more money once you exceed 3 GB's"

(TME = The Microsoft Empire)

-or-

"Are you stupid? Unlimited bandwidth means we don't throttle."

Not only is java out, but the new proposed licensing of M$ servers would prohibit the use of open-source software on the system.

This means PHP, MySQL ... PERL!

I can see where whover thought that licensing arangement up has their head planted.

Originally posted by NyteOwl
Not only is java out, but the new proposed licensing of M$ servers would prohibit the use of open-source software on the system.

This means PHP, MySQL ... PERL!

I can see where whover thought that licensing arangement up has their head planted.

No way they get this throught!!! :angry: :angry: I hate MS :angry: :angry:

So I called bCentral/Micrsoft. The rep and her supervisor had no idea about the 3 gig limit and were taught to think that 3 gigs is basically unlimited and that almost no sites go over that... :D :D

Oh, and earlier this morning I chated w/ someone and asked where their NOC was...

Read from the bottom up

Colin: okay
Harley: I sincierely apologize for your inconvinence but I cannot disclose the locations of our servers.
Colin: no other host I know keeps it a secret...
Colin: your not?
Harley: I am sorry Colin, but I am not authorised to disclose this information.
Colin: what part of the country/state/city
Colin: but where are the servers running the W2k and sql located?
Harley: Is there any other information I can assist you with today?
Colin: okay
Harley: Colin, the core of bCentral is run using a Windows 2000 Advanced Server along with an SQL server.
Colin: For you business hosting, where are the servers that you host them on located?
Harley: Could you please elaborate on your query?
Colin: What backbone(s) are you on and where is your NOC located?
Harley: Hi Colin. Welcome to bCentral Live Support. My name is Harley.
A bCentral Support Professional will be with you in about a minute.
hehehe, a secret NOC...........you gotta love MS :D

Originally posted by NyteOwl
Not only is java out, but the new proposed licensing of M$ servers would prohibit the use of open-source software on the system.

This means PHP, MySQL ... PERL!

I can see where whover thought that licensing arangement up has their head planted.

I was considering offering shared nt accounts. If they are going to forbid that in the near future forget it. If a client wants it that bad they can get a dedicated server.

Atleast you know it won't shut them down. :-)

maybe ms wants to offer there own ms.net hosting services ... great

:kaioken:

I hate Microsoft just as much as everyone else, but this just simply isn't true.

Originally posted by NyteOwl
Not only is java out, but the new proposed licensing of M$ servers would prohibit the use of open-source software on the system.

This means PHP, MySQL ... PERL!

I can see where whover thought that licensing arangement up has their head planted.

Java was taken out of WinXP because of a lawsuit. But, in fact, it is good for everyone that it was taken out. Why? If MS shipped, for example, version X of the JVM, and soon after XP was released, version Y was released, then all Java developers would have to target version X or risk losing customers.

Also, Microsoft has no problem with open-source software. They love the BSD license. The GPL is the only 'open-source' license that scares MS, and they are *not* prohibiting the use of GPLed software on their OSes. That would probably be illegal, as in their ongoing court case, they said that OSS was their biggest competitor, and barring OSS from running on their OSes would be an illegal use of their monopoly power.

Point me to where it says that open-source software is prohibited to run on their new OSes, and maybe I'll believe you. They *do* have an incorrect belief that by using GPLed software, all of your or your company's IP is immediately GPLed as well, and they did tell developers that they couldn't use 'potentially viral' 'toolkits' in conjunction with one of their SDKs, but they didn't and won't prohibit OSS from running on their OSes. If they did, then they would have to take out their TCP/IP stack which is (almost, or completely) identical to the BSD TCP/IP stack.

And Java does not have anything to do with Javascript except for the name. One is a Web client-side scripting language and one is a cross-platform OO programming language.

hmmm again!


Hello viper,
Thank you for writing back.
I apologize for the confusion this may have caused you. It's true that you will have an unlimited data transfer for the site you will have on bCentral and not 3 gigabytes of transfer per month like what is stated on the FAQ or Frequently Asked Questions. The FAQ you are referring is not updated and I apologize regarding this matter. I have informed our product coordinators to update the link to that FAQ to avoid confusion.
On the other hand, you may wish to visit http://bcentral.com/services/bws/faq.asp for some top questions regarding the Business Web service.
I hope that this e-mail has provided you with the assistance you need. If you have any other concerns or clarifications, please feel free to write back and I will be glad to assist you.
Have a nice day.
Sincerely,
Cecilia
Microsoft bCentral Customer Support

First of all I don't hate Microsoft; I really don't care enough about them to hate them. I do however resent being called a liar, if only by implication. Furthermore, I care very little whether you believe me or not; the reply was to provide additional information that I had read. Those truly interested will check such things for themselves rather than resort to ad hominem sarcasm; however. for those too lazy to do their own research on something someone says:

http://slashdot.org/articles/01/06/21/1810258.shtml

There were two other additional stories relating as well - one on Yahoo and the other (along with the EULA) on Microsoft's site. The Yahoo link is listed as "moved or expired" and the Microsoft page returns a 404 error so it has obviously been pulled from public display.


"Search Engines: not just for lost engineers"

==========

MS has deep pockets. they are probably quite able to absorb any added cost that a few heavy users will accrue for the sake of building a large client base.

Be interesting to see how long it *stays* unlimited after the base has grown sigificantly.:cool:

NyteOwl...

Their Mobile Internet Toolkit SDK isn't their OS. Here is the Slashdot post:

Microsoft's new crusade against licenses that enforce source-code sharing has reached the EULA of their Mobile Internet Toolkit. It even disallows the use of any "Publicly Available Software" tool in the production of software using this SDK. This seems to be a very wide ranging restriction applying to compilers (gcc), editors (vim, staroffice), filesystems (backup on linux server), web-browsers (mozilla logging into some online tool provider), Java (sun's virtual machine). The licenses covered include: the GPL and LGPL, the Artistic License (e.g., PERL), the Mozilla Public License, the Netscape Public License, the Sun Community Source License (SCSL), and the Sun Industry Standards License (SISL). Is this legal? Thanks to Jonathan for the link.


I didn't mean to implicate you were a liar - I'm sorry if you thought I did.

Their Mobile Internet Toolkit SDK isn't their OS. Here is the Slashdot post:

I know, the reference was in the EULA itself, which is no longer on the Microsoft site.

Even if it was just the toolkit, the implication is that no code from any GPL source can be used in conjuction with it - perl code, php code, code from netscape/mozzilla and there fore if you used the Toolkit on your server, anything you developed could not be used in conjunction with any opensource related code which is a serious enough concern in itself.

I didn't mean to implicate you were a liar - I'm sorry if you thought I did.

Apology accepted, I'm sorry too as I may have been too touchy.. it's been a long day and the temperature is 104F @ 80% humidity and no air conditioning.