http://sitepointforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=8465

They've been going downhill for ages, where've you been? That guy Vlad has been a big loser for a long time, and is well known for being a big loser.


Anyone hosting there is clearly brainwashed or crazy....lol

I know that their reputation has been going down for a long time, but this is like the final straw.

Boris

Hello,

I just wanted to make the distinction between Think Computer and ThinkHost. We are two very different companies, and are in no way related, although we both offer web hosting services.

Thanks!

Aaron Greenspan
President & CEO
Think Computer Corporation

http://www.thinkcomputer.com

Godfather also posted here:
http://216.10.4.112/forums/showthread.php?threadid=12193

What's interesting about this whole issue is the copyright thing. Thinkhost apparently seems to think that the copyright to posts made to a BP-powered forum belongs to The Webmaster Guide, Inc., and I certainly can't find a reference to any such thing in their terms. I did find this:

"Please read the terms and agreement at our website. We do ask that if you are going to use Board Power for commercial use, that you pay a $100 registration fee. Board Power is free for personal and non-profit use. Please note that Board Power does not require purchase to download and we ask that if you do use it for commercial use that you be responsible to pay the registration fee."

and

"All software, freeware and non-freeware, is owned by The Webmaster Guide, Inc. You may not: publish, retransmit, participate in the transfer or sale of, further copy, create derivative works from, distribute, or display code, any of the software in any way. You agree that all software developed by The Webmaster Guide, Inc., is the sole property of The Webmaster Guide, Inc., and may not be reproduced without prior written consent of the company. All copyright information, were ever placed by The Webmaster Guide, Inc., must remain intact and not removed or edited.

The Webmaster Guide, Inc., grants permission for software (freeware and non-freeware) to be modified for sole use by you and only you. Modified software is still bound to the agreement above and in no way allows you to claim ownership of the software, modified or non-modified."

This is the same with ANY forum software. They all require that copyright notices remain intact and visible - why not give the writers credit for their work, after all?

Of course, I can't say I particularly care for his response to Godfather, either, accusing him of libel and abuse (among other things) - if anyone saw the screenshot at http://www.megaclamps.com/cn/thinkhost.gif they would know that it was a simple request (also made by another person, apparently several months ago) made by someone concerned about the copyright issue. It's a sad commentary that someone who takes pride in trying to find fault with others (the hostrocket issue, for instance) can't play by the same rules when confronted with a very real issue (and such a simple one, at that!) such as this.

Sound harsh? Probably. But this is one of the reasons that hosting has a bad rap, and that bugs the hell out of me.

I've been following discussion about this and I couldn't help thinking : could it be that Thinkhost misunderstood the BP copyright? Honestly I doubt it, but this is from his post on SitePoint forum :

I was asked as a courtesy to place the copyright and refused since I refuse to have something on our site that allows potentially a third party to take ownership of our users' posts, comments, ideas and suggestions.

I think BP only has copyright of their code (modified or not) and not the content of the board itself. Gee, he protects his company (and his made-from-scratch control panel :D) as if it's a top government secret and everyone is eyeing to steal them from him.

Thinkhost or someone please explain

Go to http://www.thinkhost.com , note the guy with a briefcase.

Go to http://www.apartmentsearch.com/ , note the same guy at the bottom of the page.

Is this guy in some kind clip art collection?<cough>or did thinkhost steal the picture.<cough>?

Quincy,

It's most probably out of clipart collections. Thinkhost's 'man' is bigger than the Apartmentsearch one and it's quite difficult to resize JPEGs and retain a proper look once you've saved them (unless they were originally big). There's lots of clipart collections you can buy on CDs or just scan from clipart books... My company does so, as does many other sites.

Isn't it curious how someone who pretends to be a consummate professional doesn't respect intellectual property rights (other than his own) and doesn't understand that the copyright on a forum program is on the program's code? How can someone even think that the copyright would extend to the postings by people who use that program? For one thing, you can't copyright someone else's work (excepting work contracted for hire, if you did the hiring).

This is clearly another case of a host being a bully and throwing a temper tantrum when they read something they didn't like. I experienced something similar at AIT and am looking forward to a massive law suit against some hosting companies just to let them know they can't act irresponsibly without consequences.

Once again, we have seen an example that proves we have to judge companies on their deeds rather than their words.

Duster, you didn't receive your new password yet?


Just wondering why you posted as guest.


I noticed while typing this post, that the posts on this page that i'm on while typing don't include guest posts, atleast not Duster1 post

I just got my password situation resolved, thanks.

10 thumbs up for the thinkhost great service :P.

I think some people might use a different finger than the thumb to show their regard for Thinkhost. ;-D

Slim shady : " Put those middle fingers on each hand up " or something like that :P.

Well, the latest round of posts at SP have simply convinced me more than ever to not read there. Too much of a thinkhost love-fest for my tastes, I'm afraid. I'm pretty surprised that the mods don't stop his crap over there, but if they want it as a support forum/soapbox for thinkhost, more power to them.

How did Annette become ADMIN? I look at the ADMIN forum and she was the last one to make a post there? I mean how can someone else become ADMIN, Or is it b/c she is the host of this wonderful site. I am just curois.

I totally agree Annette...and I find it disturbing why sitepoint as a general community for internet users would tolerate it..just IMO..

Originally posted by TheComputerGuy
How did Annette become ADMIN? I look at the ADMIN forum and she was the last one to make a post there? I mean how can someone else become ADMIN, Or is it b/c she is the host of this wonderful site. I am just curois.

Nope - may have simply been a misdirected import of some of the UBB stuff. Surprised the heck out of me! But if I had admin privs, I certainly would have quashed "Davey", doncha think? :)

Good day folks!

An executive decision was made by me about GodFather and I stand behind that decision one hundred percent. Abuse took place, and we don't take it lightly, especially not on our own grounds.

Public image means very little to me -- I am not a politician, I am a systems engineer. And even as Justin (who usually tends to take the opposite bank of the river) points out, we do a damn good job at that.

I am not afraid to make unfavorable public image decisions that I believe to be in the best interest of our users, my staff and other individuals that depend on me. If that means we take fire on public forums -- be it.

Godfather is welcome to e-mail us to receive his files, and as promised I will transfer the domain into his name on first demand (although we normally register domains for clients in their name, this was a courtesy on our part where I paid the domain fees out of my own pocket). The account in question was a free courtesy account, and frankly absolutely no abuse of such accounts is tolerate, just as with any paid account.

As far as copyright issues -- I honor such very dearly, and
we have taken the forums down on the first request, as posted. However due to personal reasons refuse to use Bulletin Power if it requires me to list them for copyright as I do not trust the developer. We'll simply switch to VBulletin and put up their copyright as required, but I do not by any means trust the developers of BoardPower.


Sincerely yours,


Vladislav S. Davidzon, Senior Network Engineer
ThinkHost -- Honesty, Reliability, Trust.
http://www.thinkhost.com
davidzon@thinkhost.com

What exactly is the problem with placing the appropriate copyright on the forums? The software was written and developed by them, and NOWHERE does it say ANYTHING about the software developers controlling the copyright on posts made by members of a forum. You're supposedly all about "trust" and "honesty" and for some reason that doesn't trust extend to others and you can't just admit you screwed up by removing the copyright notice? There is also no particular evidence of abuse - except by you in removing a valid copyright notice. It's rather amusing to watch you try and politic your way out of this, despite your claims that you don't engage in that sort of thing. If you didn't care so much about what people thought, you'd get off your soapbox and stop trying to make every thread involve you somehow (like the ARIN thread at SP). It's a mark of insecurity to constantly have to buttress up your ego by proclaiming yourself the best or the hardest worker - as if no one else in the world works at all or is good at what they do. The mods at SP may not hammer you on your actions, but that little safety net doesn't extend past their domain.

Vladislav,

Why don't you let us all know what is so good about your company that makes you so superior to others? You do not have your own NOC... You are located at skynetweb.com. You don't have a control panel. You use all 3rd party software for your support/knowledge base. It seems like the only thing you have going for your company is your fast response time... What does that mean? That you don't have a life and sit in front of your computer all the time.

I have tried your service and canceled it after seeing how crappie your service was and not having a control panel. I loved being able to login to my account and seeing how your control panel was delayed time and time again.

You really need to learn to communicate and run a business. You remind me of one of the most ignorant man I know... Always having to tell people he is better then them since no one will believe him.

Scott

The only thing which I will add to this discussion (which is already getting quite pointless) is that even though you may not want to bother to 'indulge' in public relations, Vlad, it is quite important especially if you are going to attract more customers.

Sure, your company may have some of the best tech support response time frames in the industry, but what good is it if your public image is substandard? Consumers are far more choosy and public image does play a substantial part in it. It's a fact of business and one you would do well to at least understand.

P.S. I only say this because my company recently received a 'Highly Commended' award from the local business council for excellent customer service. We've since seen our sales for our e-comm software jump by 78%. Enough said.

Originally posted by thinkhost
Public image means very little to me

Vlad, I am starting to doubt your sanity. I have never heard the head of a compnay say something like this.

The account in question was a free courtesy account, and frankly absolutely no abuse of such accounts is tolerate, just as with any paid account.

I thought you overreacted but it is your deal.

As far as copyright issues -- I honor such very dearly, and
we have taken the forums down on the first request, as posted. However due to personal reasons refuse to use Bulletin Power if it requires me to list them for copyright as I do not trust the developer. We'll simply switch to VBulletin and put up their copyright as required, but I do not by any means trust the developers of BoardPower.

This just seems a bit ridiculous. You'll put up the required copyright on vbulletin, but not for the other one. Because you don't trust them? If anyone else can explain this, please feel free to. I don't get it.

Vlad,

You can't talk your way out of this one and make yourself the victim. You claim abuse and that a libelous post was made, which is a flat out lie. You had a temper tantrum when someone reminded you of your legal obligation and cancelled their account.

Your comments about the copyright:
I was asked as a courtesy to place the copyright and refused since I refuse to have something on our site that allows potentially a third party to take ownership of our users' posts, comments, ideas and suggestions.

How can someone who pretends to be such a consummate professional make such an absurd statement? It seems you think the forum creators could copyright the remarks by your site's visitors. If you had the sense to look up U.S. Copyright Law, you would see that it is impossible since it is not legal. Just general sense alone should tell you that. Only someone who is grossly incompetent or a blithering idiot would make such a remark and not even look for the truth.

I don't know you enough to question your technical skills, but you certainly have a lot to learn about how to treat people.

You can start now by respecting our intelligence and not telling us how great you are. It's like telling us a skunk smells like Chanel #5. We know better, and so do our noses. We know a skunk when we smell one.


ThinkHost -- Honesty, Reliability, Trust.
surely you jest Actions talk louder than words. Remember that!


[Edited by Duster on 08-30-2000 at 02:33 PM]

My .02 and a half (you're right, Duster):

Copyright law states that whoever writes anything is the owner of that writing, and 'becomes' the owner as it is written. QED.