Take a look at this:

http://money.cnn.com/2003/06/12/pf/saving/duppies/index.htm?cnn=yes

I am developing a [hmm, no.. I have developed a] disliking for filthy rich individuals, but more so towards filthy rich businesses that pay the backbone of their operations [the workers] - pittance.

I have an opinion, and I have decided to come here to share it with you all :)

I think that there should be some new laws made.

- Any company that has been deemed or declared to have a monopoly should be made to cap the profit.

- No individual on this planet needs more than 100k per year. I don't care who it is or what he/she does. 100k per year would give even the biggest spend thrifts a most satisfactory lifestyle. Therefore, once a person is earning 100k per year it should be capped and the rest should go to resolving national and international problems. Such as the 1/4 of the world that is starving to death each day.

- Hourly pay rates [award wages] should be abandoned. Each and every company shoould be made to split its profit (at least to a degree) and devide it between each and every staff member, accordingly, depending on years of service, experience, productivity and rank.

- Successful companies sould be viewed as having space for new workers. ie: Part of the profit [after being capped] should be put towards employing new people. Therefore, instead of justifying the need for higher profit through not letting go of money, a company can obtain further success through manpower. At least this way, many will benefit. Not a handful of filthy rich scums at the top.

Now. I know that any rich person [well, most] would want to stab me in the neck with a pen right now. I know that it could be said that if such laws were passed, productivity would decrease and there would be less funding for further research into technology etc..

But I say: "HEY! Listen here bubbleguts!" "Where has technology got us so far"?

I mean think about it. What would you prefer? To ease the bellies of the billions of people that are starving, or to have a new cure for some disease that was probably man made anyway? We need to take a step back. Enough with science and prosparity. Lets lay the cards out. Let's spread the butter a bit. ..an anyway, it's a farce. People with money abuse it. Look at Mr Plastic nose Jackson, Hollywood and all the money they waste. Sport (which is not really sport at all anynmore. It's a puppet string drama). I could go on for hours. Look at the money that is wasted in this world by those that have it. It makes me sick to my stomach. It really does.

This world could have its problems solved within a generation. I have no doubt - but while there's greed in the world, the rich will get richer and ..well, you know the saying.

One of my aims in life is to become powerful enough to whisper into some ears. I want to teach the world how to share. If I ever had the chance, or the power - I'd grab the rich of this world by the scruff of their necks and hurl them into the street. See how they like it. How can so many people in this world selfishly sit at their 200 a head settings, drinking $200 a bottle wine, and go home 2 their 1.4 million dollar homes in their exceedingly expensive cars, and look down on the less fortunate in this world.

No one can say that they [most] don't. Most rich people do. The majority of them will not associate with a "bum". Oh no, they're too good for that. To high. I say - we're all human.

MrLeN

What about all the companies that make items that cost more than 100k?

What of them? It doesn't matter if they make a product worth two hundred billion dollars. The profit can be capped, and no person in the company should earn more than 100k. Not even the owner.

Awwwww, but gee. Such a potentially powerful person, only getting 100k?? There's no incentive in that!

Crap! There are many other people that can and would provide the same product for 100k. The problem with this world is that those other people that "could" and would - can't because the most powerful people in this world hold the reigns on the governments and the people of the world.

MrLeN

Not enough work?

- Let's make a "work for the dole program"

*haha - Yeah, great idea*

Too many vagrants?

- Let's build shelters, run by volunteers. If the vagrants get too narky, we'll lock them up.

*haha - Yeah, great idea*

Gee, all of the people that are the product of poverty and a low income are filling up our jail cells. What do to?

- Let's privatise prisons and profit from that too!

*haha - Yeah, great idea*

These are just a few of some so called government initiatives around the world. What I find hard to believe is that the governments try to make everyone think they are doing their best. I mean - COME ON! Is it just me, or isn't it glaringly obvious that there are some people in this world that want to hold the rest of us down?

A man with less than average intelligence would know that the above so called solutions are rediculously lame. I am in disbelief over the way this world runs. When I was a kid, I was confused. Now that I am a man - I'm still confused, but I also know that the world is the way it is because of greed, power and selfishness.

This world is being run by the powerful. Not even the governments are running this world. They are puppets too. They know better, but for some reason they feel obliged to keep everyone in the dark about the potential this world really has. We could all be living a dream. Every one of us.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
What of them? It doesn't matter if they make a product worth two hundred billion dollars. The profit can be capped, and no person in the company should earn more than 100k. Not even the owner.

Awwwww, but gee. Such a potentially powerful person, only getting 100k?? There's no incentive in that!

Crap! There are many other people that can and would provide the same product for 100k. The problem with this world is that those other people that "could" and would - can't because the most powerful people in this world hold the reigns on the governments and the people of the world.
MrLeN

Man you really are full of hate aren't you :eek:. Maybe what we should do, is have EVERYONE in EVERY company make 100k a year... I agree to an extent, some people make more then they are worth, and lot of people make less then they are worth. But, for example, my father worked hard for 30 years in the grocery industry and for his own company, and he deserved every penny he made (which, toward the end of his career was more then 100k a year).

I am not full of hate.

I am full of disgust.

Your solution wouldn't work. Many companies in this world barely make 100k per year. Those that do pay small wages because that's all they can afford. Which is fair enough.

However - Once a company gets on it's feet, it should then start dividing the profit between all employees, until each employee "may' reach an income of 100k.

The company would have an option to pay each employee less, only if it expands to employ more people, but in such a case it would probably be wise to make sure each present employee is earning at least $50k before such an expansion, which will prevent a company mass employing at a minumim wage.

MrLeN

In case you have not noticed communism and socialism failed around the world. With out incentive of $$$ there is very little growth and new ideas.

Want to stagnat the world and kill an economy? Take the right away to make as much money as you can or tax the ones that do make money at a highly stupid rate. The reason people work long hours invent create and deliver is because they want to gain something. Your brightest and best minds would reach your 100k limit in no time and then stop.

It is a failed idea at best.

That's my point. Maybe it would be best to have our greatest minds stop after reaching 100k. If they want to move on and let someone else have their job - fine. However, as it stands - money isn't buying these people happyness. It is blackening their hearts. A world full of leaders with black hearts makes for a difficult existence for the rest of us.

I am fully aware of what communism is. Actually - It's a great idea. The problem with current communist systems is that those at the head ofthe table ..[drum roll please] abuse their power. What I have suggested is not similar to introducing a communist system. What I have suggested will fit in perfectly well with a democracy.

Saying that the enforcement of rules is for communists is not correct. Which is basically what I gathered you think, from reading your post.

Aren't we already under communist rule, to some extent? Who sets the tax rates? It's not the population, that's for sure. Who makes the rules? It's not the population that's for sure. Us westerners elect a party to govern our nations - but from that point, we have very little say at all.

What I am saying is that these governments are stressing and taxing the wrong segments of society. It's blatantly obvious - and no one could genuinely argue otherwise [just open your history books], that the current system is wrong. Dead wrong. It's way off track.

We need to start capping capitalism, and lend a hand towards growth from the roots of our economy. There's no point watering the leaves.

MrLeN

Also, I might add the Soviet Union was the first nation to put a satelite into orbit. They were communist.

They were also first to send a man to space.

Read this (http://www.newseum.org/cybernewseum/exhibits/dateline_moon/space.htm)

Also, I'd be watching China. They're getting pretty powerful. They're also communist. The problem with their system is [again] greed.

MrLeN

Yeah, the Soviet Union.....I remember that country. It died.

Oh, did you forget to mention that they STOLE most of their military, aerospace, and computer technology from the US?

I can't believe that someone would even suggest this "let everyone make 100k a year" crap. I have a book to recommend to you friend - its called "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand. Read it. Then tell me you still think that communism/socialism and all that BS works.

Let me tell you what would happen, since you probably will never take the opportunity to broaden your mind a bit and read it. Say we put your little plan into action. Everybody makes 100k a year. Doctors, Lawyers, Janitors, the fry dude at McDonalds, all of us.

Now, lets say that you have the average 18 year old kid in his guidance couselor's office. Here is how I imagine the conversation would go:

Guidance Couselor: "So, Johnny, have you put much thought into what you would like to do after high scool? You are a bright kid, and I am sure you could get into a good school, and be a doctor, lawyer, or engineer."

Johhny: "Hey man, I have a job for 100k a year flippin burgers, I have a new car, im gonna buy a house, order cable TV, and thats pretty much my plan."

GC: "But Johnny, you have so much potential! School would be great for you!"

J: "Why in the world would I ever do that!?! Dedicate 4-10 years of my life to hard work, sacrifice, and dedication just to achieve what I allready have? You must be f'n kidding me!"

The thing about the above conversation is that the kid would be exactly right. Why would anyone want to work hard, sacrifice time and effort, to get exactly zero reward? (edit: ok, there are a few of us who would do it to improve ourselves, but we are talking about the masses here)

Even in the capitalistic economy that exists in America today, the line for Janitor is miles long. You NEVER have trouble filling the minimum wage job. But there are thousands of IT jobs that go unfilled. Even when the reward is there, people will not step up and take the challenge to gain the reward. So why in the world would anyone do it when there is NO REWARD? Think about that for a second, and then try to come up with an intelligent comback to my post.

Rob

Yeah, the Soviet Union.....I remember that country. It died.

Yep. Because the few at the head of the table abused their power.

Oh, did you forget to mention that they STOLE most of their military, aerospace, and computer technology from the US?

I didn't know of that.

I can't believe that someone would even suggest this "let everyone make 100k a year" crap. I have a book to recommend to you friend - its called "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand. Read it. Then tell me you still think that communism/socialism and all that BS works.

I didn't say that communism works. I say it is a great idea. I also stated that "The problem with current communist systems is that those at the head of the table ..[drum roll please] abuse their power." I also stated that I am not suggesting a communist rule. I believe that a democratic country is by far - more advanced.

Let me tell you what would happen, since you probably will never take the opportunity to broaden your mind a bit and read it. Say we put your little plan into action. Everybody makes 100k a year. Doctors, Lawyers, Janitors, the fry dude at McDonalds, all of us.

I wont reply to this part. It would veer in an off topic direction.

Now, lets say that you have the average 18 year old kid in his guidance couselor's office. Here is how I imagine the conversation would go:

Guidance Couselor: "So, Johnny, have you put much thought into what you would like to do after high scool? You are a bright kid, and I am sure you could get into a good school, and be a doctor, lawyer, or engineer."

Johhny: "Hey man, I have a job for 100k a year flippin burgers, I have a new car, im gonna buy a house, order cable TV, and thats pretty much my plan."

GC: "But Johnny, you have so much potential! School would be great for you!"

J: "Why in the world would I ever do that!?! Dedicate 4-10 years of my life to hard work, sacrifice, and dedication just to achieve what I allready have? You must be f'n kidding me!"

I think that what you really want to do is create an argument. I didn't imply anywhere that a kid flippin' burgers would be earning 100k. People would still be earning much the same as they are earning now. The kid that you are speaking of would most likely flip burgers at a smaller pay-rate. I could also get started on what I think of these large fast food chain wages, but I'll try to stay on track here. No one in their right mind would pay someone 100k to flip burgers. Nor is what you are saying even intelligent. I'm going to stop here.

Also, so what if a kid would be earning 50k? Geat! What a bright future that kid would have. He's soon get sick of flipping burgers [once he matured] even if he did have that attitude.

The thing about the above conversation is that the kid would be exactly right. Why would anyone want to work hard, sacrifice time and effort, to get exactly zero reward? (edit: ok, there are a few of us who would do it to improve ourselves, but we are talking about the masses here)

Yes. In such a society, people would [in general] do things to improve themselves. What you're implying (and probably don't realize) is that most people do not have any dreams, or ambitions, or pride. You are taking into account "only" financial gain/reward. However, in a society that places less value on who earns the most - our lives [at the end of the day] would be much more fulfilling.

Even in the capitalistic economy that exists in America today, the line for Janitor is miles long. You NEVER have trouble filling the minimum wage job. But there are thousands of IT jobs that go unfilled. Even when the reward is there, people will not step up and take the challenge to gain the reward. So why in the world would anyone do it when there is NO REWARD? Think about that for a second, and then try to come up with an intelligent comback to my post.

Now you've really lost me. The last statement has left me with questions of your understanding of the world. Please read that last paragraph again and have a think about it. Is that really what you believe? really?

MrLeN

Yeah I'm sure the people making $100,000/year that pay $45,000 of it in taxes really agree with you :). Just FYI:

(A) The Soviet Union was demolished, however, prior to that they were the first modern country to nearly go completely bankrupt.

(B) China isn't any different. Powerful, but the country is so financially strapped, that they are starting to pass democratic laws.

Oh, one other thing. If I work my butt off to make a million dollars, why should I pay any more taxes than someone who made $100? If they pay 10%, why should I be forced to pay 20%? We both used what abilities we had to go out and make a living, we both put in effort, whether mental of physical. So Why is it fair that I should pay more?

As someone who grew up with nothing, I know what it is like to be poor. I grew up in a crappy part of town. I wore second hand clothing. My mom was on welfare. At least one of my parents was always unemployed. Today, thinking back on those times is my biggest motivation.

Today, I am a successful businessman - I own multiple business ventures, and have held a job for a fortune 500 company that paid me 65k a year. All this before my 27th birthday. I worked my butt off to get to where I am, and I have a long way to go before I get to where I want to be.

Coming from my background, and having achieved what I have so far, I have to say that your post is insulting to me. I'll just leave it at that.

Originally posted by bitstream
Oh, one other thing. If I work my butt off to make a million dollars, why should I pay any more taxes than someone who made $100? If they pay 10%, why should I be forced to pay 20%? We both used what abilities we had to go out and make a living, we both put in effort, whether mental of physical. So Why is it fair that I should pay more?

As someone who grew up with nothing, I know what it is like to be poor. I grew up in a crappy part of town. I wore second hand clothing. My mom was on welfare. At least one of my parents was always unemployed. Today, thinking back on those times is my biggest motivation.

Today, I am a successful businessman - I own multiple business ventures, and have held a job for a fortune 500 company that paid me 65k a year. All this before my 27th birthday. I worked my butt off to get to where I am, and I have a long way to go before I get to where I want to be.

Coming from my background, and having achieved what I have so far, I have to say that your post is insulting to me. I'll just leave it at that.

Hehe, it's amazing when you start paying taxes how quickly a flat tax sounds nice. But I think there should be cut off. I mean, someone making $12,000 a year certainly shouldn't have to pay taxes :D.

The only thing that has proved to be a catalyst for successful enterprise with profitability and gainful engagement of humans is known as Laizzez Faire or some call it Free Enterprise.

The general economic arguments in favor of freedom of choice--laissez-faire--can be found in the textbooks. They consist essentially in showing that, under a properly functioning free market, the prices (monetary and otherwise) people pay for things reflect the real cost of producing those things, and the prices they receive reflect the value of what they produce to those who use their products. When an individual makes economic decisions he therefore bears all of the resulting costs (either directly, as when he spends his time doing something, or indirectly, when he pays in money the cost borne by someone else who spends his time) and receives all of the resulting benefits (either directly, as when the benefit is his pleasure in doing the job, or indirectly, when he receives money from someone else who consumes what he produces). If total costs are less than total benefits, he should make that decision and will, since he, as well as the society as a whole, benefits. If total costs are greater than total benefits, he should not and will not.

Originally posted by comphosting
Yeah I'm sure the people making $100,000/year that pay $45,000 of it in taxes really agree with you :). Just FYI:

(A) The Soviet Union was demolished, however, prior to that they were the first modern country to nearly go completely bankrupt.

(B) China isn't any different. Powerful, but the country is so financially strapped, that they are starting to pass democratic laws.

I never mentioned a tax rate. I don't know how you got the idea that I suggested people earning 100k would be paying 45k in taxes.

Re: (A) and (B). I know. I am not trying to say we should all be communist. It's funny how some people will not reply to threads, but they will find a lesser part of it and concentrate on that. As a matter of fact - my initial post didn't even have communism in it.

MrLeN

Haha, funny thread. And sad too.

Three years ago I sold a business that I had for 18 years. In that business I put everything I owned on the line, and then some. I put myself personally on the hook for over $600,000.

So you're trying to tell me that there should be some kind of "equity" or balance between my income and that of my employees? When an employee started working for me, did he put any of his equity at risk? Of course not. When 5:00 came around, did he punch the clock, go home and put his feet up worry free? Of course he did. When a machine in the production line broke down and a specific part had to be brought in from Brazil asap, did he stay at work until 11 PM to make the arrangements? Of course not. Yet you think my income should be capped at 100K so I can let the income of others in the company catch up...

Hmmm. Absurd, laughable, at best. What a way to cripple an economy. What a disincentive for hard work and sacrifice. What a joke.

Originally posted by bitstream
Oh, one other thing. If I work my butt off to make a million dollars, why should I pay any more taxes than someone who made $100? If they pay 10%, why should I be forced to pay 20%? We both used what abilities we had to go out and make a living, we both put in effort, whether mental of physical. So Why is it fair that I should pay more?
One of my pet peeves. I will never understand why people are penalized the harder they work. I say a flat tax for all. Period. Don't punish me with a higher tax rate just because I work harder to earn more.

Vito

Oh, one other thing. If I work my butt off to make a million dollars, why should I pay any more taxes than someone who made $100? If they pay 10%, why should I be forced to pay 20%? We both used what abilities we had to go out and make a living, we both put in effort, whether mental of physical. So Why is it fair that I should pay more?

This is a demonstration of the greed and selfishness that I my initial post was speaking of. Also, most of the people who have good money had good fortune. They were either born more intelligent, or they were born into money, or are lucky enough to have powerful friends. Yes, there are rags to riches stories, but there are also many riches to even more riches stories.

As someone who grew up with nothing, I know what it is like to be poor. I grew up in a crappy part of town. I wore second hand clothing. My mom was on welfare. At least one of my parents was always unemployed. Today, thinking back on those times is my biggest motivation.

..and you have learned nothing from that? Don't you look back and wish that your parents - the people that looked after you through these hard times had a better life? Wouldn't you wish that, even just for their sake?

Today, I am a successful businessman - I own multiple business ventures, and have held a job for a fortune 500 company that paid me 65k a year. All this before my 27th birthday. I worked my butt off to get to where I am, and I have a long way to go before I get to where I want to be.

I'd be interested to know how you got started and what contributed towards your success. Please spare me the hard work story. There's always more to it than that.

Coming from my background, and having achieved what I have so far, I have to say that your post is insulting to me. I'll just leave it at that.

I'll leave it at that too ;)

MrLeN

Oh yeah, I agree that there should be a flat tax. As someone who regularly sits in at least the 29% bracket, I would love nothing more. As far as anyone making under 12k a year not paying taxes, they don't pay anyway. They have this thing called the "Earned Income Credit". If you make under like 18k, in most circumstances, the government pays you. You pay nothing. I would be happy to pay a flat tax, and stop subsidsing all the people who make less than me. If you read my post, you know what my background is like. I firmly believe that ANYONE can rise up and achieve, they just have to want to do it. If I came up from nothing to have what I do today, why can't anyone else do it too? Opportunity is what makes our country great. That is why I react so vehemently when someone starts suggesting this marxist crap. You want to fix the world? Open up a world-wide free market and give everybody the opportunity to make something of themselves. I don't care where you are, what your background is, or what obstacles you think you have, I firmly believe that anyone can succeed if they are willing to put in the effort to do it.

Originally posted by vito
Haha, funny thread. And sad too.

Three years ago I sold a business that I had for 18 years. In that business I put everything I owned on the line, and then some. I put myself personally on the hook for over $600,000.

So you're trying to tell me that there should be some kind of "equity" or balance between my income and that of my employees? When an employee started working for me, did he put any of his equity at risk? Of course not. When 5:00 came around, did he punch the clock, go home and put his feet up worry free? Of course he did. When a machine in the production line broke down and a specific part had to be brought in from Brazil asap, did he stay at work until 11 PM to make the arrangements? Of course not. Yet you think my income should be capped at 100K so I can let the income of others in the company catch up...

Hmmm. Absurd, laughable, at best. What a way to cripple an economy. What a disincentive for hard work and sacrifice. What a joke.


One of my pet peeves. I will never understand why people are penalized the harder they work. I say a flat tax for all. Period. Don't punish me with a higher tax rate just because I work harder to earn more.

Vito

I agree with 99.9% of what you said Vito. Except the last part about a flat tax for everyone. I understand doing like a flat tax for everyone at a certain income level, but forcing students, low-income families etc to pay the same percent as Bill Gates is just silly. I think there should be a $20,000+ flat tax personally.

Originally posted by MrLeN
..and you have learned nothing from that? Don't you look back and wish that your parents - the people that looked after you through these hard times had a better life? Wouldn't you wish that, even just for their sake?

I'd be interested to know how you got started and what contributed towards your success. Please spare me the hard work story. There's always more to it than that.

What are you trying to say buddy? That anyone with money just got it handed to them? You think because I told a story about my Dad having money had anythign to do with me? I lived (with a FAMILY) for 1 1/2 years and we made $15,000 in that time period. So you keep your friggen whiney stories. I made it from having NOTHING financially, to being where I am today. Quit being a baby and get a friggen job.

Originally posted by RajanUrs
The only thing that has proved to be a catalyst for successful enterprise with profitability and gainful engagement of humans is known as Laizzez Faire or some call it Free Enterprise.

The general economic arguments in favor of freedom of choice--laissez-faire--can be found in the textbooks. They consist essentially in showing that, under a properly functioning free market, the prices (monetary and otherwise) people pay for things reflect the real cost of producing those things, and the prices they receive reflect the value of what they produce to those who use their products. When an individual makes economic decisions he therefore bears all of the resulting costs (either directly, as when he spends his time doing something, or indirectly, when he pays in money the cost borne by someone else who spends his time) and receives all of the resulting benefits (either directly, as when the benefit is his pleasure in doing the job, or indirectly, when he receives money from someone else who consumes what he produces). If total costs are less than total benefits, he should make that decision and will, since he, as well as the society as a whole, benefits. If total costs are greater than total benefits, he should not and will not.

I had to read that twice and use my dictionary 19 times, but I finally came to an understanding of what you're trying to say.

There's nothing wrong with having an incentive to build a business, and being allowed to keep all of the rewards for your work.. but man, it's 2003 now. This system is dying.

Big business is getting TOO big, and the little guys that, in the past, have made a life for themselves by creating a business are being strangled. In a way - what I am suggesting is a way to "protect" free enterprise.

All I am saying is that a belly can only hold so much food. What are 100 people going to do with 10,000 apples, when there are 10,000 people who have only one?

MrLeN

Originally posted by comphosting
What are you trying to say buddy? That anyone with money just got it handed to them? You think because I told a story about my Dad having money had anythign to do with me? I lived (with a FAMILY) for 1 1/2 years and we made $15,000 in that time period. So you keep your friggen whiney stories. I made it from having NOTHING financially, to being where I am today. Quit being a baby and get a friggen job.

How did you ever become successful?

MrLeN

Sigh. Communism didn't work.

The idea you have there might sound good... but as people have pointed out it completely destroys any possibility or incentive to take a risk.

Look at it this way -- people bitch about prescription prices. A pill costs $100 for some meds. They say even with R&D for that pill there's no reason prices should be that high.

People don't point out that the $100 for that pill goes to fund, say, 100 other FAILED R&D projects that came to nothing. So if you cut down prescription prices... less new drugs will be discovered and created.

Intervention and price capping or salary caping or whatever is a bad idea. I work my ass off, I deserve whatever money I make. The first year I made over $100,000 I was estatic. Then I had to write a $50,000 check to the government above what I had already mailed them.

A flat tax is a great idea. A flat tax does *not* mean someone making $6,000 pays that percent in taxes. I would imagine there would still be some form of standard deductables -- basically the number of people you are responsable for, such as yourself, etc, so that the first X amount of your income is tax free.

Originally posted by comphosting
I agree with 99.9% of what you said Vito. Except the last part about a flat tax for everyone. I understand doing like a flat tax for everyone at a certain income level, but forcing students, low-income families etc to pay the same percent as Bill Gates is just silly. I think there should be a $20,000+ flat tax personally.
Point taken. I was so irritated with the premise of this thread that I didn't take the time to qualify my statement about the tax rate. Needless to say, there should be a minimum threshold, Once your income exceeds the threshold, a flat tax kicks in.

Frankly, I'm not entirely convinced that MrLeN is being straight up with us. Is he just pulling our collective leg? Or is he trolling? Or does he actually believe what he's posting? The latter seems the most unbelievable...

Vito

Originally posted by bitstream
Oh yeah, I agree that there should be a flat tax. As someone who regularly sits in at least the 29% bracket, I would love nothing more. As far as anyone making under 12k a year not paying taxes, they don't pay anyway. They have this thing called the "Earned Income Credit". If you make under like 18k, in most circumstances, the government pays you. You pay nothing. I would be happy to pay a flat tax, and stop subsidsing all the people who make less than me. If you read my post, you know what my background is like. I firmly believe that ANYONE can rise up and achieve, they just have to want to do it. If I came up from nothing to have what I do today, why can't anyone else do it too? Opportunity is what makes our country great. That is why I react so vehemently when someone starts suggesting this marxist crap. You want to fix the world? Open up a world-wide free market and give everybody the opportunity to make something of themselves. I don't care where you are, what your background is, or what obstacles you think you have, I firmly believe that anyone can succeed if they are willing to put in the effort to do it.

What you're saying is not true. It's just not true that "anyone" can "make it". Yes, everyone has the opportunity - but not everyone is goung to make it.

The reason I would like to see such laws is because the wealth of this world is spread too unevenly. Once a certain group or person or company gets a foothold on power/money - the bridge between them and the rest becomes much longer.

It is becoming increasingly difficult in this world for the average family to meet their financial needs. The reason for that is because they are not earning enough money. Both parents have to work. Children are being left unattended. No one is there to welcome them home with a hug, to ask where their homework is.

This world revolves around money for one reason. Because if you don't have enough of it - ones life can quickly become hell. Therfore, most of us place a greater value on money than it deserves. If the worlds wealth was distributed more evenly - I have no doubt that production would slow down and that science would progress slower - but at the cost of 1/4 of the world starving, I'd say that would be a good thing.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
How did you ever become successful?

MrLeN

Well, I started a company. Although I'm sure you think I received billions in venture capitalism, you'd be wrong. No, what I did is worked 10 hour shifts for $6.50/hour, and on my lunch break I came home and answered tickets. And after work, at 3:35AM, if I got a page for an emergency ticket, I got up and checked it. That's what I did. Worked my ass off. What have you done?

Originally posted by vito
Point taken. I was so irritated with the premise of this thread that I didn't take the time to qualify my statement about the tax rate. Needless to say, there should be a minimum threshold, Once your income exceeds the threshold, a flat tax kicks in.

Frankly, I'm not entirely convinced that MrLeN is being straight up with us. Is he just pulling our collective leg? Or is he trolling? Or does he actually believe what he's posting? The latter seems the most unbelievable...

Vito

Perfectly understandable. Hell, I'm pretty liberal, but this guy's even pissed ME off. I think he's a troll personally, in fact isn't this the guy that opened about 6 threads about MCHost?

That would be him.

Vito

Originally posted by MrLeN
What you're saying is not true. It's just not true that "anyone" can "make it". Yes, everyone has the opportunity - but not everyone is goung to make it.


Everyone has the opportunity. Of course not everyone is going to make it -- point out where in the constitution it says life is fair and we'll work that kink out of the system.

He said anyone CAN make it. That is true. Even if "making it" is going to college for 4 years and using your degree to get a good job. Everyone has the same opportunity. Everyone CAN make it. Not everyone WILL make it.

Originally posted by comphosting
Well, I started a company. Although I'm sure you think I received billions in venture capitalism, you'd be wrong. No, what I did is worked 10 hour shifts for $6.50/hour, and on my lunch break I came home and answered tickets. And after work, at 3:35AM, if I got a page for an emergency ticket, I got up and checked it. That's what I did. Worked my ass off. What have you done?

I did not say once that everyone who is rich became that way because they "received billions in venture capitalism".

Also, re: "You story". Well done. However, if you've finally made it - why are you such an angry, nasty person?

One more thing. Unless your the head of a company that is making 3 billion a year, and employing people at $6.50/hour than you don't really fit into the category of people that my initial post was speaking of.

What have I done? I am currently employed as a web developer, and I am building my own business after work and on weekends. I currently work around 16 hours per day and have done for a couple of years. I am not poor, but I certainly have a lot to work towards. As you know, my business has suffered some recent set-backs, but I will get back on my feet. I am sure that soon enough I will be quite successful.

MrLeN

oh, boy, you picked the wrong guy to mess with this time.

a - I never wished that my parents would have been given anything that they didn't work for. In fact, I am ashamed that they cared so little about my brothers and I that they would not take it upon themselves to provide us a better life. Looking back on the situation, I know they could have done it. They made a choice not to. Don't get me wrong, I love my parents dearly, but they are some of the laziest people I know. That is why I grew up like I did. I decided to make a different choice.

b - you act like greed is a 4 letter word. I have news for you - it isn't. If wanting something badly enough to work for it and sacrifice for it is a sin, then i'll wave at you from hell!

c - as far as having some leg up in some way, boy, I could tell you a story. Lets shorten it up and just give you the main points. I do consider myself to be of above average intelligence. Lucky me. My brother is of above average intelligence and he works at office depot for 8 bucks an hour. go figure. I made some mistakes that really set me back early in my life - the main one was having a child at 16. My then girlfriend (now wife of 10 years) got pregnant. There went the dreams of going off to a prestigous school. I took a job. I got kicked out of high school for non-attendance. Did I give up? Nay..... read on if you dare.

I finished High School on my own. I took extra jobs in different fields so I could learn about them. I worked in medicine, management, sales, shipping/transportation, all kinds of stuff. I even ran a landscaping business for 2 years in there. I didn't have the time of money for real college, so I took correspondence courses from home (before intenet universities). I figured If I knew something about many things, I would be better able to get a good job to take care of my wife and baby girl. No way was I going to let her grow up like I did.

I got curious one day and tore my computer apart when it broke, and decided that I should learn everything there was to know about computers, as it sounded like fun and I liked working on them. My career decisions again took a turn, as I decided to pursue computers. I quit my job making about 30k a year and took a job as an entry tech at a local computer shop for $8 an hour. 6 months later, I was the best tech in the shop, and decided that it was time to once again become upwardly mobile. So I started my own little computer business, building, upgrading, installing networks, you name it. That business still exists today.

Business was not always good, however, so during a down time in the computer business I decided I would try my hand at corporate america, taking a job as a project manager for one of the RBOC phone companies. I had never worked in telecom, other than doing some computer related install stuff. SO before my interview, I read every book I could find on telecom - I even went thru a telecom dictionary so I would have the vocabulary down. I managed to land the job, and I learned everything there was to know about how the internet and phone sytems worked.

On the side, I took courses to get my CCNA and Net+ Certifications. Took a course on web design using DreamWeaver. I started doing some consulting work on the side. Made a pretty good business out of it. Learned to admin in Linux. Admin'ed my own linux server on a dedicated line at home for a little over a year, and decided that maybe I could make a business out of that too. So, I leased a couple of servers, designed up a website, developed a business plan, and WHAM! I now run a profitable web hosting business. All of this on my own. No help, no government grants, no scholarships, no family members giving me money - not that they had it to give. My parents credit was so crappy they couldn't even co-sign on my first car. I have never even taken out an SBA loan. I DID IT MYSELF. Oh, did I forget to mention that I am now working on becoming a private pilot, and should have my license soon? WHERE DO I FIND THE TIME?

So for you to preach the cause of all of those poor, oppressed people out there who complain that they just didn't get dealt a fair hand in life, my answer is that is a bunch of BS. I didn't get dealt a great hand either, but look where I am now. If opportunity doesn't find you, then you need to go find it. If you can't find it, then MAKE it.

Your little theory about capping profit and income is INSULTING. I think that most anyone with good logical reasoning skills would see it as the same.

Originally posted by vito
Haha, funny thread. And sad too.

Three years ago I sold a business that I had for 18 years. In that business I put everything I owned on the line, and then some. I put myself personally on the hook for over $600,000.

So you're trying to tell me that there should be some kind of "equity" or balance between my income and that of my employees? When an employee started working for me, did he put any of his equity at risk? Of course not. When 5:00 came around, did he punch the clock, go home and put his feet up worry free? Of course he did. When a machine in the production line broke down and a specific part had to be brought in from Brazil asap, did he stay at work until 11 PM to make the arrangements? Of course not. Yet you think my income should be capped at 100K so I can let the income of others in the company catch up...

Hmmm. Absurd, laughable, at best. What a way to cripple an economy. What a disincentive for hard work and sacrifice. What a joke.


One of my pet peeves. I will never understand why people are penalized the harder they work. I say a flat tax for all. Period. Don't punish me with a higher tax rate just because I work harder to earn more.

Vito

You have many good points. I fully understand what you're saying. I also agree on most counts.

However, it is not possible for someone to earn 100 or 1000 times more than another person, because they worked 100 or 1000 times harder/more.

Also, would your life be any less satisfying if you could not spend more than 100k in one year? [personally]

MrLeN

I'd rather have them pay $6.50 per hour than they outsource to india.

My hat is off to you Comphosting - more proof that one can do anything when they put their mind to it. I was down there in the trenches with you brother.

I really think that behind most successes is the DESIRE to succeed. It's the best motivator.

bitstream,

So for you to preach the cause of all of those poor, oppressed people out there who complain that they just didn't get dealt a fair hand in life, my answer is that is a bunch of BS. I didn't get dealt a great hand either, but look where I am now. If opportunity doesn't find you, then you need to go find it. If you can't find it, then MAKE it.

It is often the case that poor, oppressed people out there who complain just didn't get a fair hand in life. Do you know why? Because there's less and less people willing [or even able] to give them that hand. Not to imply that everyone must have a hand to get somewhere. That would be stupid. But it would certainly help if our economies were set up in such a way where people wouldn't require a hand, or face the possibility of starvation and poverty through no fault or lack of will of their own.

Your little theory about capping profit and income is INSULTING. I think that most anyone with good logical reasoning skills would see it as the same.

I don't think it is. I can see that not far in the future, the bridge between rich and poor [that has affected our nations] will soon extend towards separating nation from nation. Actually, no. It already has, but it will get MUCH worse. At that time, there will be a lot more war. A lot more hatred and a lot more suffering. All because those with the power make up reasons why they deserve it and excuses for why they shouldn't have to share it.

Why is it that just about all of the replies to this thread have a "me me me" attitude? That's a big part of the problem. The very reason why this world is the way it is today.

MrLeN

Originally posted by bitstream
My hat is off to you Comphosting - more proof that one can do anything when they put their mind to it. I was down there in the trenches with you brother.

Awwwwwww, *sniff sniff*

Group hugs for everyone..

MrLeN :rolleyes:

Originally posted by MrLeN
I had to read that twice and use my dictionary 19 times, but I finally came to an understanding of what you're trying to say.

There's nothing wrong with having an incentive to build a business, and being allowed to keep all of the rewards for your work.. but man, it's 2003 now. This system is dying.

Big business is getting TOO big, and the little guys that, in the past, have made a life for themselves by creating a business are being strangled. In a way - what I am suggesting is a way to "protect" free enterprise.

All I am saying is that a belly can only hold so much food. What are 100 people going to do with 10,000 apples, when there are 10,000 people who have only one?

MrLeN

The day this system "dies", i'll give up and swallow the business end of my .45 ACP.

Here's an abstract concept for you - If everyone in the world put their effort into taking care of themselves rather than speding all of their time begging for a handout, the rest of us woudn't have to worry about them, would we? THEY WOULD BE TAKING CARE OF THEMSELVES, THUS NEGATING THE NEED FOR HELP FROM EVERYONE ELSE.

I don't feel like I ever got a "hand up", and I still made it. Quit complaining. Start doing. Look back when you are done, and say "boy, look how far I've come. That feels great."


PS - MrLeN - I hear the Communist party is looking for a good web designer. But you have to work for minimum wage, because thats what they pay all of their employees, so that they are all the same. :grin:

Originally posted by MrLeN
You have many good points. I fully understand what you're saying. I also agree on most counts.

However, it is not possible for someone to earn 100 or 1000 times more than another person, because they worked 100 or 1000 times harder/more.

Also, would your life be any less satisfying if you could not spend more than 100k in one year? [personally]

MrLeN
Your income is not necessarily in direct proportion to amount worked. Why would you think that? If I make 5 times more than my employee (who works 40 hours a week), then obviously that does not mean I work 200 hours a week. But part of the reward for working hard and working smart is the potential for exponential growth[b] in income.

I can enequivocally say that my life is more satisfying making more than 100K per year. Why wouldn't it be? I don't have to worry about paying the bills. I can provide my family with some luxuries. I can afford to put my daughter into a private school. I can help a relative or friend in genuine need if they fall on hard times. Why wouldn't my life be more satisfying?

Vito

Originally posted by bitstream
The day this system "dies", i'll give up and swallow the business end of my .45 ACP.

Well, you better start loadin', because before too long the stories that you people have told about "climbing to the top" will be just that - Stories.

MrLeN

Originally posted by bitstream
PS - MrLeN - I hear the Communist party is looking for a good web designer. But you have to work for minimum wage, because thats what they pay all of their employees, so that they are all the same. :grin:
:emlaugh: :emlaugh: :emlaugh: :emlaugh: :emlaugh: :emlaugh:

Vito

Yep - I'll swallow the barrel of my .45, and the rest of the planet can just fade away into the "great collective" that will be left after capitalism dies. Should we give up our names now, and just start handing out serial numbers? Ever read 1984 by George Orwell? Tell you what MrLen, I'll even assign you your serial number now - you can be no. 2! :D

Originally posted by vito
Your income is not necessarily in direct proportion to amount worked. Why would you think that? If I make 5 times more than my employee (who works 40 hours a week), then obviously that does not mean I work 200 hours a week. But part of the reward for working hard and working smart is the potential for exponential growth[b] in income.

I can enequivocally say that my life is more satisfying making more than 100K per year. Why wouldn't it be? I don't have to worry about paying the bills. I can provide my family with some luxuries. I can afford to put my daughter into a private school. I can help a relative or friend in genuine need if they fall on hard times. Why wouldn't my life be more satisfying?

Vito

I don't think that your income is in direct proportion to the amount you work, which is my point.

In answer to your second question; It all depends on how much you're making. If you've worked hard and you're making 100, 200 or even 500k per year - I wouldn't put you in the category that my initial post is speaking of.

However, you are in a position to start mass producing companies now. You could quite easily send MANY more people out of business. YOu have that power and take all of the reward. Whether you do that or not, or whether you intend on doing that or not is another story.

Many of you are missing my point. While so many in this world are suffering - I will never comprehend how anyone that has more than enough will sit back and say: "I earned it - ne piss off".

Now, I am sure that you help people - and lend a hand ;)

..but what I am saying is that MOST people with money don't. If they do - it's for "show and tell" or tax reasons. The threat here is, that the world has never been SO rich and SO scientifically advanced - yet there have never been so many hungry bellies and there has never been so much threat.

This hunger, this threat and a lot of other nasty things are caused by one thing; The people with the will and the power to fix the situation do not give a flying rats ass.

Therefore, by capping income - we would be capping what has already proven to be human natures inability to hold power in a reasonable manner.

MrLeN

lol - this thread is becoming ridiculous.

I should become a communist web designer? *haha*

If we cap the profits of the filthy rich, serial numbers will be next?

*hahahahaha* cough cough - choke...

Spare me, please!

MrLeN

Old Proverb - "Give a man a fish, he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he'll eat for a lifetime."

The one thing that proverb leaves out, is that the man you are teaching must WANT TO LEARN HOW. If he doesn't want to learn, you can't teach him. Anyone who won't do something to improve their own station in life, has chosen that path. IT IS A CHOICE.

How many fish would you have us give out, MrLeN?

Originally posted by bitstream
Old Proverb - "Give a man a fish, he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he'll eat for a lifetime."

The one thing that proverb leaves out, is that the man you are teaching must WANT TO LEARN HOW. If he doesn't want to learn, you can't teach him. Anyone who won't do something to improve their own station in life, has chosen that path. IT IS A CHOICE.

How many fish would you have us give out, MrLeN?

Now you're just being stupid.

If I had've made a post that said:

hey, everyone. I think that all the poor people should stop working - and anyone that is making more than average should give them all their money!

..I could understand that reply. However, this reply is so pathetic - and so far off topic that I am not even going to answer it.

MrLeN

*Edit* I can see it coming. Note: I said "answer it" - "not reply to it" :P

Announcement

Ok, you've raised some good points. All of you.

For argument sake, I am going to raise the 100k cap to 1 Million.

Does anyone need more $1,000,000.00 per year to live comfortably?

Note: There is enough money in the world for everyone to have $1,000,000.00

Also Note: I heard once that if you got all the worlds wealth and divided it between the people of the world; Inside a couple of years - the ones that DID have the money would have it back again, and the ones that DID NOT have the money would become broke again.

I agree with this. Now don't get me wrong. I agree with this 110%! HOWEVER: I do not agree that people should be allowed to personally highjack the wealth of the world at the expense of the majority, simply because they have wound up in the position to do so.

I'll also say that - yes, fair enough. Many of those filthy rich individuals may very well have worked hard for that power. But should we not draw any lines? Nothing?

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
I don't think that your income is in direct proportion to the amount you work, which is my point.

Why in the world SHOULD it be?!?

It would be impossible. It can't be.

..which is my point!

That post isn't a statement of my belief - it is just a fact that was pointed out.

Why are you asking why it should be?

Your question makes no sense.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
Does anyone need more $1,000,000.00 per year to live comfortably?

Yes. If you give everyone a million dollars per year, you'll instantly see hyperinflation as people try to spend this fabulous wealth. Before long, they'd be much worse off than they were to begin with.

Money, by itself, is worthless. It only becomes valuable by virtue of what people will do to get it; as such, money serves as a mechanism for efficiently distributing labour and the fruits thereof throughout the population.

but you did almost say that except in your plan they would be working. just not in a job that requires any effort, motivation, skills, dedication...

also your tactic of attacking the person making the argument instead of producing a stong rebuttal for your case shows that you do not have all the facts on this and have perhaps not thought out your point well enough...

nothing in this world is so black & white that you can say it should be done this way or it should be done that way. there are outside variables to take into account... if you give certain people money for nothing they will spend it thus on drugs or wasteful items... 100k a year would mean they still may not own their own house (oh and of course there would be no incentive for building new houses because manual labour would be less attractive if you could earn the same working in a less strenuous job.).

The solution you should be looking for is 'make the world governments handle what they do with tax money more efficiently' billions of $$$ are wasted all over the world through gross mismanagment of government schemes. your solution is to make people poorer so the government has more money to waste... the ratio of money paid per person to the benefits given to that persons life in that country is grossley unbalanced. once the governments can make things right at home then that is the time to look to helping out abroad.

Originally posted by MrLeN
Now you're just being stupid.

If I had've made a post that said:

hey, everyone. I think that all the poor people should stop working - and anyone that is making more than average should give them all their money!

..I could understand that reply. However, this reply is so pathetic - and so far off topic that I am not even going to answer it.

MrLeN

*Edit* I can see it coming. Note: I said "answer it" - "not reply to it" :P

Originally posted by cperciva
Yes. If you give everyone a million dollars per year, you'll instantly see hyperinflation as people try to spend this fabulous wealth. Before long, they'd be much worse off than they were to begin with.

Money, by itself, is worthless. It only becomes valuable by virtue of what people will do to get it; as such, money serves as a mechanism for efficiently distributing labour and the fruits thereof throughout the population.

All true.

MrLeN

Even if you cap the money at $1,000,000 or some other number it would basically come down to this: it would stifle investment and stagnate the economy.

Why are you guys even entertaining this troll.

This thread has him whining about people having more money that he has and his argument the world should change to suit his needs rather than him getting off his can and improving his income.

The last thread I read this clown started was one regarding 'getting rich quick'.

I'm going to put those two ideas together and label this guy, and not even bother addressing his topic at all.

ciqala,

but you did almost say that except in your plan they would be working. just not in a job that requires any effort, motivation, skills, dedication...

No I didn't. the only thing that I have stated is that at some point there must be a limit on how much an individual can earn on a yearly basis. The reason it would be a solution to many of the worlds problems is that much of the money accumulated by the worlds richest people does not go towards creating new jobs. It goes towards very expensive tastes and development in technology which is killing the need for the human workforce. One of the main reasons that these companies research such technologies is so that they don't have to employ more people. More money, research, less people, more money, research, less people.

also your tactic of attacking the person making the argument instead of producing a stong rebuttal for your case shows that you do not have all the facts on this and have perhaps not thought out your point well enough...

Um - Go back and read this thread. I've held myself well after some things that have been said to me. As a matter of fact - I've done very well - to have kept my good nature :)

nothing in this world is so black & white that you can say it should be done this way or it should be done that way. there are outside variables to take into account... if you give certain people money for nothing they will spend it thus on drugs or wasteful items... 100k a year would mean they still may not own their own house (oh and of course there would be no incentive for building new houses because manual labour would be less attractive if you could earn the same working in a less strenuous job.).

Some of the replies to this topic have truly [and I really mean this] left me shaking my head. I never once, anywhere in my previous posts during this topic - suggested that the solution to the worlds problems is to give all the poor people money. Now before you make another *not so informed* reply. Can you go back and read the posts - Or don't reply.

What you have stated above is completely out of contrast with anything that I have said.

The solution you should be looking for is to 'make the world governments handle what they do with tax money more efficiently' billions of $$$ are wasted all over the world through gross mismanagment of government schemes. your solution is to make people poorer so the government has more money to waste... the ratio of money paid per person to the benefits given to that persons life in that country is grossley unbalanced. once the governments can make things right at home then that is the time to look to helping out abroad.

Um. I think that you have just agreed with my suggestion to cap the profits of those that have too much money. However, I never proposed that it would go to the government to do what they like with. Where it "does" go could be another topic - but my point is that individuals should not be allowed to possess enough money to buy a small country.

I agree with you that the government doesn't manage funds properly - which is a huge problem. I could start another topic on that.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
Now you're just being stupid.

If I had've made a post that said:

hey, everyone. I think that all the poor people should stop working - and anyone that is making more than average should give them all their money!

..I could understand that reply. However, this reply is so pathetic - and so far off topic that I am not even going to answer it.

MrLeN

*Edit* I can see it coming. Note: I said "answer it" - "not reply to it" :P
No you are being stupid. Jesus, I'm very much a liberal, as I stated before. You could have came into this thread and said "Solicism is the perfect form of government" and I wouldn't have flamed you. You could have said anything that DIDN'T generalize anyone based on income. You are a whiner. Someone that wants to sit on their friggen ass and do nothing, and in the mean time be no more poor then the guys pulling 16 hour shifts. I'm sure you think that Bill Gates lives the permanate high life, you know, being a billionaire, but guess what: he has the responsibility of running the largest company in the world, which is probably more then your brain can even comprehend. That responsibility, to you, is worth $100,000 (or is it $1,000,000 now? You sure changed your mind fast).
You know what buddy, go get yourself a job at McDonald's and you just show us capitalist bastards.

Originally posted by akashik
Why are you guys even entertaining this troll.

This thread has him whining about people having more money that he has and his argument the world should change to suit his needs rather than him getting off his can and improving his income.

The last thread I read this clown started was one regarding 'getting rich quick'.

I'm going to put those two ideas together and label this guy, and not even bother addressing his topic at all.

See the thing is, I can deal with any 2-bit 15 year old, that buys a server from RackShack and still doesn't know what a reseller is. That I can handle.... whinners piss me off something royal. I've lived in **** before, and came out of it without having to whine to the world about how unfair it is.

akashik,
Why are you guys even entertaining this troll.

You forgot a question mark. When you ask a question, you need to end it with a question mark.

This thread has him whining about people having more money that he has and his argument the world should change to suit his needs rather than him getting off his can and improving his income.

Actually. I am more concerned with the direction that the world is heading in, but you can think that if you like.

Also, I work extremely hard at improving my income. Quite frankly, I don't think I could squeeze in much more effort.

The last thread I read this clown started was one regarding 'getting rich quick'.

The thread that you are speaking of is:

****SPAM**** Quick BUCKS - Join now! (http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=153276)

If you read the thread, you'll find out that the reason I created the thread was because I do not have faith in such systems.

I'm going to put those two ideas together and label this guy, and not even bother addressing his topic at all.

Thank you. Now go away.

MrLeN

Originally posted by comphosting
See the thing is, I can deal with any 2-bit 15 year old, that buys a server from RackShack and still doesn't know what a reseller is. That I can handle.... whinners piss me off something royal. I've lived in **** before, and came out of it without having to whine to the world about how unfair it is.
Excuse me?

I have started a reasonable topic.

I have been quite fair all the way through, so far. Even though many of your responses have been quite rude and rather impolite for seemingly little reason.

15? Is that how old you are.

You're 12 years younger than me.

Congratulations.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
Excuse me?

I have started a reasonable topic.

I have been quite fair all the way through, so far. Even though many of your responses have been quite rude and rather impolite for seemingly little reason.

15? Is that how old you are.

You're 12 years younger than me.

Congratulations.

MrLeN

Your 27? That's even more sad. Yeah I'm almost 22 buddy. And hey, I'm not bitching, I have a family, I have a life. Your five years behind me... Congradulations.

comphosting,
No you are being stupid. Jesus, I'm very much a liberal, as I stated before. You could have came into this thread and said "Solicism is the perfect form of government" and I wouldn't have flamed you.
..but you did, and this is not the only thread in which you have been completely rude, as you are demonstrating now.

You could have said anything that DIDN'T generalize anyone based on income.

You are a whiner..
I see it differently. There's nothing wrong with being concerned with the current state of the world, and opening a discussion that points out my views. It certainly does not give you grounds to start flaming someone. Why you haven't been banned [or an least warned] from this forum after the things you've said to me on this thread and other posts eludes me.

..Someone that wants to sit on their friggen ass and do nothing, and in the mean time be no more poor then the guys pulling 16 hour shifts.

No. That is not an adequate description of me. I'm a very hard worker, and you are now being deperately pathetic in your attempts to make me upset. I think you need to calm down.

I'm sure you think that Bill Gates lives the permanate high life, you know, being a billionaire, but guess what: he has the responsibility of running the largest company in the world, which is probably more then your brain can even comprehend.

Actually, I have never stated such a thing, but from memory do to believe that the US government has tried to split Microsoft in half - due to its overwhelming monopoly and ability to charge pretty much what it likes. I agree with such an action though.

You have no idea what my brain can and can't comprehend. I'd be satisfied to assume that I think it works better than yours.

That responsibility, to you, is worth $100,000 (or is it $1,000,000 now? You sure changed your mind fast).
You know what buddy, go get yourself a job at McDonald's and you just show us capitalist bastards.

Well, now I am making it $756,995,763 and twenty four cents. What are you going to do? Flame me some more?

MrLeN

Originally posted by comphosting
Your 27? That's even more sad. Yeah I'm almost 22 buddy. And hey, I'm not bitching, I have a family, I have a life. Your five years behind me... Congradulations.

I think you need anger management.

MrLeN

Originally posted by a communist
comphosting,

..but you did, and this is not the only thread in which you have been completely rude, as you are demonstrating now.
No actually I haven't been quite this rude to anyone before. I can't stand people that bitch about how unfair life is. Get a job.

I see it differently. There's nothing wrong with being concerned with the current state of the world, and opening a discussion that points out my views. It certainly does not give you grounds to start flaming someone. Why you haven't been banned [or an least warned] from this forum after the things you've said to me on this thread and other posts eludes me.
You aren't concerned with anything but YOUR well-being. You don't like the fact that other people make lots of money, but you don't have the cognitive capacity to make any yourself.

No. That is not an adequate description of me. I'm a very hard worker, and you are now being deperately pathetic in your attempts to make me upset. I think you need to calm down.
I don't need to calm down, I'm fine. I'm just annoyed at the prospect of people that blame everything on everyone else.

Actually, I have never stated such a thing, but from memory do to believe that the US government has tried to split Microsoft in half - due to its overwhelming monopoly and ability to charge pretty much what it likes. I agree with such an action though.
What does that have to do with anything? I figured you wouldn't like Bill Gates because he makes more money then you, and far surpasses any boundries you've set. Isn't that the whole point of this thread?

You have no idea what my brain can and can't comprehend. I'd be satisfied to assume that I think it works better than yours.
Whatever helps you sleep at night buddy. I'm content with my capabilities, which is why I'm not bitching about other people's financial situation.

Well, now I am making it $756,995,763 and twenty four cents. What are you going to do? Flame me some more?
No, because that comment was too stupid to make it worth it.

Originally posted by MrLeN
I think you need anger management.

MrLeN
That's nice. I think you need to grow up.

Originally posted by MrLeN
. . . and no person in the company should earn more than 100k. Not even the owner . . .
No worries. 100k/mth is fine with me. ;)

comphosting,

I'm tired of you now. Please find something constructive to say. Stop trying to tell me what I "really mean" after every post I make, and stop following me around this board with your immature, bad, disruptive attitude.

Stick to the topic or go and find something else to do.

MrLeN

Originally posted by MrLeN
comphosting,

I'm tired of you now. Please find something constructive to say. Stop trying to tell me what I "really mean" after every post I make, and stop following me around this board with your immature, bad, disruptive attitude.

Stick to the topic or go and find something else to do.

MrLeN

Like I would honestly waste my time following some newbie around the board. I'm sticking to the topic... the topic is garbage, so I'm posting garbage, but you know, I'm kind of tired of you as well.

So does that mean you're going to go and find something better to do?

MrLeN

Originally posted by vito
One of my pet peeves. I will never understand why people are penalized the harder they work. I say a flat tax for all. Period. Don't punish me with a higher tax rate just because I work harder to earn more.


So I take it that would work the other way around then, Boeing would no longer enjoy being the most subsidised company in the US, because every single company would also enjoy the same "special help" from the government.

Thread locked. I don't think we need to go into why.