In shared hosting environment, whose responsibility is data backup? Host's or customer's?

Vote now ... :)

cheers,
:beer:

I would say..your data, your responsibility.

Bribe me and I will say it is the HOST responsibility. :D




Originally posted by dektong
In shared hosting environment, whose responsibility is data backup? Host's or customer's?

Vote now ... :)

cheers,
:beer:

I didn't vote, since the question is too ambiguous.

Any hosting customer should have their own data backed up. That doesn't make it the customer's responsibility. It's simply a matter of common sense.

I think the issue of responsibility is simple. If the host says they do daily, weekly, etc. backups, then the host is responsible for doing whatever backups they promised. Most hosts do promise some type of backups and should be kept to their promise. If the host doesn't promise backups? They should probably still keep backups, but it's not really their responsibility anymore. I'd sure hate to be the person explaining that to customers who just lost all their data, though.

Originally posted by Planet Z
If the host says they do daily, weekly, etc. backups, then the host is responsible for doing whatever backups they promised.


On one of my servers (where there are about 40 shared accounts), we do daily and weekly backup of all accounts onto 2nd HD (yea... yea... not the best backup solution :) ), eventhough we never promised our customers about this... (dang ... it does not take much time to do all this backup). This is just a courtesy. So yes ... if the host promises it (and the customers pay for the backup service), then no doubt it's host responsibility ... But how if the host does never mentions it? Then I agree with you, it's not host reponsibility and therefore it's customers (and hence, I voted this way too :) )

cheers,
:beer:

Originally posted by dektong
But how if the host does never mentions it? Then I agree with you, it's not host reponsibility and therefore it's customers (and hence, I voted this way too :) )

I will not vote because I think the question is ambigous. Dektong, I think it's a little more complicated. I think if the host does no backup at all he has to communicate this active on his hosting page (and not somewhere in the TOS) because many inexperienced customers think backup is common for servers! At least you have to state that they should make backups themselfs.

From a host standpoint, not all back ups are totally successful. Users should always keep a local back up of their files.

I strongly urge both the host and customer to do backups of their files. We had a server which had 400 virtual accounts on it, and one day, the HD crashed. (Talk about dreadful experience). We waited up for 24 hours, sent about 50 emails and about 20 phone calls before we finally found out the backups were saved on the second HD. The one time we can thank Alabanza. The backups were 4-days old, but we could not have been happier and our customers were pretty pleased too. Many of them did have backups themselves, but were pleased with the fact we did have the backups.

A little advise to all hosts when a servers HD crashes. Get yourself a case of Mountain Dew or a big can of Folgers, because you arent going to sleep for about 50 hours ;)

Thank you for your time
J. Strong

This isnt a question of "Who" should back up the data in a shared environment, it realy depends on if you pay for a backup. There are two solutions:

A) you PAY the host and they backup your data on an agreed timescale, if they dont have a backup on your request then you can take them to court for false advertising.

B) you DONT PAY for a backup and you make sure you get a copy of the files on a regular basis.

Problem solved, which one would you like to go for?

Related to this subject, what's the easiest way for a Virtual Host provider to back up their customer's data?
Including mySQL etc?


:confused:

thanks in advance...

b

probably by using a tape drive and tapes :D :rolleyes:

although mirroring the hard disk once a day is also a viable solution.

make sure anything you use to backup a server has an "Open File" agent, to allow you to back up files currently in use.

XTStrike, thanks for reply, but I kind of meant those how are reselling virtual host accounts for clients and need to back up the data - okay, I figure FTP may be an option, and maybe a mySQL dump?

b

Host should have the data saved somewhere but if it's lost the host should not be held responsible.

I vote both. I think it's the responsability of the host, but lets face it, you don't have a backup of your own site, that's just asking for something to go wrong. I despise those programs that allow editing in ftp that goes directly to the server. Unless the customer backs up that file they changed (which if they edit directly to the server or using a file manager directly on it isn't very likely), the host is held by the customer 100% responsible.

It's kinda like on angelfire waaaaaaay back. I had to restart the page about 5 times because they managed to lose all the data. Of course then it was even more annoying since I couldn't just ftp in and grab the files so other than images, I didn't have a backup.

If the host doesn't say anywhere, anything about a backup... assume nothing (a great thing to go by... never EVER assume anything). As Asia said "your data, your responsability." If you don't want to have a HD cluttered with backups, just zip it up and burn it to disk or toss it onto a zip drive (and if you don't have one of those with the amount of info stored on a HD already you must be begging for something to blow up and teach you to get one).

All you have to ask yourself is "who suffers if the data is lost?" That will tell you ultimately who should have a backup copy regardless of what a host does or promises to do.

This polll is flawed as many others are by not having adequates choices for responses. It is the responsibility of a host to perform any backups they have contracted to do. Those are not always performed on schedule.

However, if an individual entrusts the care of their data solely to someone else, they only have themselves to blame if something happens to it.

We have the recent example of that poor schnook who did not have a backup or use a backup service he admitted he was told about several times and lost several gigabytes of data from a hard drive he claims was reformatted. He found out the hard way that he cannot evade his responsibility.

One, or both, or neither.

It depends on the services the host agrees to provide. If they agree to provide backup, then they are responsible to provide backup.

However, backup isn't infallible, nor is it a good idea for a customer to rely completely on that backup.

If a backup is done every night, and your developer uploads a bunch of changes in the morning and the drive crashes in the afternoon, what time is it when the train gets to Chicago?

Time to bug the developer until they upload the version they have. :)

Depends if the host gives the user enough functionality to install programs which can automatically backup. There are PHP, Perl, ASP, and probably even C/C++, Python, and Tcl programs/scripts that can do that job. But if the user doesn't have access to it, it's not really fair. Especially if it's a large site and the user has a dialup modem. Then it's almost impossible to backup regularly.

we have this in our T&C:
Back-Up Files. Client will have the ability to reinstate files which are automatically archived by Downtownhost; however, Downtownhost does not guarantee the existence, accuracy, or regularity of its backup services and, therefore, Client is responsible for making back-up files in connection with its use of the Services. Backup capability is available through the Client’s Control Panel.

Anyway, we make nightly backup of the server contents

If I am customer hosted with hosting company that promises to back-up regularly, still I would have my own back-up.

We back-up regularly and also insist our all clients to have their own back-ups.

if i pay for backups, i expect backups to be made. however, as it has been stated time and time again, it is foolish of me to rely on this. i tend to back up every major change i make myself and keep recent copies of everything else. periodically, when i get those nasty hunches i will backup everything.

i have been having a lot of computer problems lately so every night when i shut down i zip up the folder of the site i'm currently working on and save it to zip disc. makes sence to me.

The customer is responsible for maintainng an appropriate backup of his or her own data.

I use the word appropriate because the aversion to risk of data loss and the type, frequency and security of the backups caries greatly from one customer to another.

For example, on my dedicated server, it does not matter to me if, for some reason, I would have to wipe the disk clean and reinstall the OS. I have a duplicate copy of my data here on my PC; and my PC is backed up to a second physical disk weekly and to a DAT tape monthly. In other words, I have a backup strategy in place that is appropriate for the level of data risk I am willing to take.

More specifically, if you are in a shared hosting environment that provides backup services, are you still responsible for the backing up of your data? Absolutely. Most of the host contracts that I have read seem to indicate that they provide the backup service as a convenience to their customers, not as a guarantee against data loss. There is a subtle difference between convenience and guarantee. And there is a not so subtle difference between the cost of those two.

Bottom line: if you are delegating the responsibility of backup services to your hosting company, it is still your responsibility to perform the due diligence to assure that the hosting company's procedures are appropriate for your level of comfort. Any host can put the words "daily backups" on their websites, but what does that mean? If you want compensation for any data loss that might occur, get that in writing in your contract.

Originally posted by Mike the newbie
The customer is responsible for maintainng an appropriate backup of his or her own data.

I use the word appropriate because the aversion to risk of data loss and the type, frequency and security of the backups caries greatly from one customer to another.




One of these days I'll learn how to type... Should be:


I use the word appropriate because the aversion to risk of data loss and the type, frequency and security of the backups varies greatly from one customer to another.

IMHO as a customer I would say its both (but only if the host offers it as a service) The customer should have copies of all the files on their computer and even make back ups of that if the data is really impt. to them. The host, if they offer it as a service, should also back up data so you have serveral backups. I think I'm just talking to a wall here but both the host and customer should, but primary responsibility should fall on the customer.

Well, i'm off to go back up